LongTimeLurker

"Conspiracy theory" was terminology that grew out of the JFK assasination. Anyone who didn't believe Lee Harvey Oswald was a lone nut acting alone believed instead in a conspiracy theory. The problem with applying this terminology to 9/11 is that the hijacking of four separate planes could only happen through a coordinated conspiracy and quite clearly wasn't caused by a lone nut.

Finishing last season's SJC wouldn't be mission impossible given there are only 5 games left to schedule if they do the semis as one game rather than over two legs. There is only one non-WoS club and they aren't likely to make it past Darvel, so they could easily do most of it midweek given the plan judging by what is being posted elsewhere appears to be to mainly do cups after the league season ends:

Might make sense if he was using public transport as it's not the easiest trip to do that way.

Different strokes for different folks as the Americans say. Maybe it is more noteworthy that Wales, NI and the RoI all have national nonleague cup competitions with histories stretching way back like the SJC, and closer to home if the amateur grade can still do it complete with a final at Hampden, then it would/will be bizarre for the part-time professional level not to have one as well and to only have relatively low key regional competitions instead. If the various leagues are not able to start up with spectators next month (fingers crossed that won't happen and it's all just a case of politicians having to be seen to be take something seriously without actually pulling the trigger), I suspect all we'll see this season is the conclusion of last season's SJC and there will even be a major question mark over the rounds that have been drawn for the SCC ever happening as league games will have to take priority. Once we are back to something closer to normality, hopefully now that the SJFA will be under new management it will be possible for the various leagues and associations to work together more constructively than has been the case over the last 20 years, and to come up with a plan for the future that doesn't completely throw away what was great about the past:

Meanwhile in England they still seem to be able to have the FA Trophy and FA Vase continuing the traditions of the old FA Amateur Cup, so it's definitely possible to still do something a bit more prestigious than a regional SCC is likely to wind up being in a pyramid setting. A high profile national cup run can help keep the season interesting for clubs that are not featuring where the league title is concerned. Some grade politics obsessed people are determined to kill off the SJC when it is still able to regularly attract 5000+ to its final and has a history stretching back to 1886. Wanton vandalism comes to mind as a way to describe that. A more sensible approach would be to finally move beyond all the junior vs senior nonsense and find a way to assimilate the SJC into the new way of doing things. Take what was good from what went before on the junior side of things (the SJC but minus the replays and endless weeks of postponements), get rid of what was bad (reinstatement, no fixture lists and no floodlights) and make something better in other words.

Thing is though this isn't rational if the number of deaths does not also undergo an uptick because all that's happening is that a far larger percentage of infections are being identified now than was the case back in April. Hopefully, what comes next is a bit like the Glasgow "lockdown". A cosmetic measure that keeps the hypochondriacs placated but doesn't get in the way of most things that have been opened up and doesn't get in the way of outdoor live events where social distancing for spectators can easily be achieved. If they are too draconian on that sort of thing there are votes to be lost amongst the silent majority and Nicola and co probably realise that as well.

Guess 18 games in the section followed by the 10 crossover ones gives flexibility to deal with losing games to lockdown restrictions as they can always switch to an 18 game format if circumstances dictate a shorter season.

Without Scottish in the name and a big event being made of it in final venue and live national broadcaster terms, it's difficult to see the SCC ever being anything more than an afterthought compared to the LL, WoS and EoS league titles and associated promotion playoffs.

Arguably the subforum that should have had a thread about this topic is the Domestic Cup Football one as that's designed to accomodate topics that spread across different league subforums to keep it all in one place. Beyond that anyone who thinks west superleague teams from last season won't ragdoll clubs in the bottom half of the LL is delusional, in my opinion. That competitive imbalance is inevitably going to lead to all kinds of seethe over the issue that was mentioned in the years ahead and although it will be amusing if/when a lot of that seethe is emanating from Linlithgow it won't make what's happening right.

Any change has to be made by agreement between the SFA, LL, EoS, WoS and SoS and this is what made it possible for the EoS to veto east region entry at tier 6 despite the SFA Board wanting them in. No change in format to open up a second automatic promotion place was made recently when the WoS were inserted into the mix. Back when around 25 east region clubs were defecting to the EoS three seasons ago my recollection is that Burnieman was posting regularly that the playoff format would be adjusted to make promotion easier after the east region clubs joined. When the issue got discussed at the LL AGM that summer that got knocked back, however, with the word at the time being that there was little chance of any change being made for the foreseeable future: https://nonleaguematters.co.uk/forum/gforum.cgi?post=877791#877791

The first paragraph of that appears to be the personal opinion of a poster on Non League Matters: https://nonleaguematters.co.uk/forum/gforum.cgi?post=869166#869166 rather than something official from the SFA.

If it sticks at one automatic relegation place (turkeys don't vote etc...), the playoff bottleneck is going to become a huge issue in the not too distant future because the east and west champions will have to playoff against each other. Something like Talbot vs Linlithgow Rose as a promotion playoff with a club like Edinburgh Uni safe for another year is going to be what gets remembered.

They should try again and put it to the test. I was surprised that they accepted Luncarty apparently with very little opposition on a travel sort of basis.

The failure to implement a second automatic relegation place after the mass defection of east region clubs three seasons ago means that they are mainly going to be remembered now for lingering like a bad smell.

As things stand there is nothing in the rules stopping them from being promoted to the LL either. They only wind up as definitively being in the HL catchment if they get promoted to the SPFL after that then get relegated from the SPFL as Club 42.

The actual written rule only applies to where Club 42 gets relegated to. There is nothing anywhere in the rules to stop Carnoustie Panmure joining the EoS, if the existing membership voted them in.

Time will tell on what happens this season due to COVID, but the significance of WoS clubs being able to retain SJFA membership should not be underestimated because it means that the SJC is no longer exclusive to a separate grade of clubs. That means that the senior grade can now potentially proceed to assimilate the SJC into its fixture calendar in the years ahead as Scotland's FA Trophy equivalent, if that's what most of the clubs involved would prefer to have happen.

Carnoustie don't seem to grasp that Luncarty set a useful precedent for them: Luncarty's registered home ground is actually on the wrong side of the boundary by a few hundred yards and they still got in OK.

^^^being argumentative for the sake of it with no attempt to address the main issue is this guy's MO. Another reseaon that having the final of the flagship cup as a big occasion with a national media profile rather than just another Alex Jack sort of final is that the possibility of the local team getting there is what generates extra interest in the earlier rounds and keeps a club relevant in its local community amongst a more casual fanbase that only goes along a few times a season.

No Ibrox as the backdrop with around 15,000 spectators and not shown live on STV, so I think the point is being missed in a big way here. The final of the flagship tournament for the nonleague game needs to be a wee bit bigger in scale than that, because it's the annual event that can make this level of football visible to a significantly larger audience. Now the SFA own Hampden there is a much better chance of getting a national final played there again to add to the sense of occasion.

Top half of the LL is strong, while the bottom half is generally two tiers higher than they will probably wind up in another decade or so. Fair enough to predict that clubs in the lower half will struggle against top WoS opponents that were in the west superleague last season.

In the 40s and 50s the SJC would have had teams from most of those areas plus Campbelltown in Argyll. Later junior football retreated a bit in geography terms. As long as the invitation is open to the HL and NCL to enter you can still have a Scottish Cup with everyone else. Scottish rather than South in the name is the key to making it work as the flagship cup in an SJC sort of way.

Key thing to remember maybe is that a large majority of SCC entrants this season were in the SJC as recently as three seasons ago. The tail doesn't need to wag the dog on this. Now that the leading officeholders of the SJFA are from WoS clubs that are in the pyramid and SJC entry has been decoupled from the concept of being in an association outside the pyramid and the senior grade, it should be possible to use democracy at the various AGMs to resolve these issues in a common sense sort of way and come up with a flagship cup competition that is fit for purpose and will thrive in the years ahead.

The focus should be on how to have a competition that keeps alive the traditions that gave us moments like this: Now that Tom Johnston is heading off into the sunset to enjoy his retirement that shouldn't be mission impossible. It's time for a lot of people to hit the reset button on how they approach these issues..

Do these playground level insult sort of posts contribute constructively to the discussion? The reality whether the hardline anti-junior types on here like it or not is that the SJFA probably isn't going away any time soon and is now embedded inside the pyramid with 53 out of 67 WoS clubs still members and the 30 or so clubs of the north region likely to enter soon when the north superleague becomes a tier 6 feeder for the HL. The focus should be on how to move forward, sort out the mess in the east and build a strong national cup competition using the traditions of the SJC as its foundation rather than having an ongoing rivalry between the SCC and SJC.