coprolite
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Posts posted by coprolite
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You are confused.
Rangers using EBTs for an illegal purpose is very different from using them illegally.
It doesn't matter too much though.
The point is they acted illegally. They cheated.0 -
Helping hand? Like when the SFA went against a UEFA directive and closed a transfer window early so we missed out on signing players.
Like when the club were voted out the top flight?
The other clubs benefited financially to the TV deal that was only in place if Rangers were involved. Rangers received next to nothing.
Like withholding Rangers license to play so the club could play no pre season friendliest.
I am glad my club were punished the way they were as we , the support, can look back and say we did it on our own. We asked for nothing and we got nothing.
It is utterly laughable supporters of the other clubs think they influenced this in any way.
The SPL clubs wanted Rangers in the second tier for their own self interest. Did the SPL fans want that?
The SFL fans wanted a 16 team top division. Did they get that?
The TV companies are the people who were pulling the strings. They made it absolutely crystal clear that Rangers , in whatever form, had to be included in the deal.
At the end of the day the correct decision was reached. Other clubs that walked away from their debt were not punished in the same way which is shameful but I can live with that. I would hope in the future any club who runs up exorbitant debt then simply walks away from it receives the same punishment as Rangers but I doubt it very much
salty salty tears.
delicious0 -
In your own words - nope.
Rangers used a mechanism that was sold to them on the basis that in utilising EBTs they could circumvent the requirement to pay PAYE. It was the very essence of why they used it and therefore the EBT was entirely the problem. A bit like a speeding driver causing a crash but pointing out that it could have been so much worse if the car hadn't had an MOT.
You are confusing their reason for using it with how they used it.
I agree that there would be no real reason for using the trust the way they did absent the tax benefit but that doesn't mean the use was illegal.
if i do up old cars and sell them legitemately on ebay but don't tell hmrc, it isn't using ebay to sell cars that is illegal.0 -
I thought that LNS had found that the players were incorrectly registered in the first place, no?
they got off because of "no sporting advantage".
I can't see why the decision would change because of the tax treatment which is only a bit relevant.
The decision was obviously a farce but no one should get their hopes up.0 -
Sorry but this is utter dross. No-one is arguing that the EBT schemes were not legal. Ranger's use of them was not and yet LNS proceeded on the basis that Rangers used the schemes legally. They clearly did not.
nope.
Rangers use of the EBT was entirely legal and above board. This is not and has not been in doubt.
The way they reported their PAYE obligations was the problem.
Had they done what they did but paid the tax and NI, there would be no issue. Ergo the EBT was not the problem, the tax return was.0 -
JIm?, what is actually your point here? Finally as we all know and hoped for, Rangers FC PLC have been found guilty of abusing a legal pension scheme with benefits to bribe players to play for them they otherwise couldn't have afforded, and it almost looks like you are defending their crime by saying it's not a sham???
It has been found out to be a sham hasn't it? The FTT & the UTT outcomes do not even matter one jot now other than they were previously contested outcomes.
The loans were found to be actual bona fide loans as a fact by the FTT. They were not a sham. What the court of session found was that the funds were put at the disposal of employees as a result of their employment, not that they weren't loans.0 -
The outcome was the FTT ruled the EBT scheme was legal. The UTT upheld that decision.As a matter of actually reading both sides I would urge people to read this blog
https://rangerstaxcase.wordpress.com/2012/03/16/illegal-use-of-ebts-other-issues/
This is the most pressing paragraphNo one is saying (or has said to the best of my knowledge) that Rangers are facing criminal charges. However, the First Tier Tribunal (Tax) on whose findings we are all waiting, will determine the legality of Rangers tax strategy. If the FTT(T) finds against Rangers, it will have deemed that the strategy used by Rangers for over a decade was indeed illegal. I struggle to believe that any hack is so stupid as to not understand this issue. One wonders if recent contact with Sir David Murray has dulled the investigative zeal of the five hand-picked journalists who were recently granted an audience. I could be wrong. Maybe they were just “duped”? Does this word mean “to have been misled voluntarily?”
HMRC went back to court and challenged not the legality of EBTs but if they eliminated a tax burden at all. On this point HMRC won.
The outcome is EBTs are legal, they just don't avoid tax.
nobody has ever said that EBTs were illegal, ever, at all.
The question was always whether the payments were income from employment in the hands of the players.
The ftt was not ruling on the legality or otherwise. They were deciding, wrongly as it turns out, on the tax point.0 -
i weed my pants
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According to AFC heritage Jess started that game as well as being an unused substitute. What a player.
Those were the days: rachid's overhead kicks; arild's hair; the conga; miniskirts. If it wasn't for the mediocre squad fillers and terrible results it would have been great.0 -
From what I've got in my stats, since promotion we've signed 39 senior players either permanently or on loan, 15 have been playing for a Scottish club immediately prior and 24 outside Scotland.
Every summer window we've signed a player who has gone on to if not win POTY that season then at least be very good
2013- Higginbotham
2014- Osman
2015- Cerny
2016- Barton
2017- ?
miniskirts min!
This is evidence only that familiarity breeds contempt and that it takes a while to see the flaws.0 -
Wouldn't mind the Saints joining the other Tayside diddies in the Championship next season.
f**k them.
Don't be so defeatist.
Hamilton might finish below you.0 -
itk and organised!
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if we could get something like...
Stevie May
Shaun Maloney
Craig Conway or similar pacey little winger
Kelvin Wilson or similar dominant centre back
then we'll be very well placed. Lets see what unfolds ahead of our signing deadline of 6th-7th July
I have convinced myself that you are ITK and that we are in advanced talks with all of the above.
if they don't all sign i will hold you responsible.
how come there is a two day deadline?0 -
Yes, but apart from that...
I actually knew it was Motherwell cos I remember wondering was that the 7-2 game where McGhee lost the plot, so I've no idea why by the time I typed it I'd turned them into Ross County??
In my (admittedly weak) defence it was written in a slight red wine haze..
inebriation is no excuse. if it was, then the papers are all in the clear.0 -
This was posted by Cowden Cowboy in our forum -
"Greg Stewart joins Aberdeen on season long loan from Birmingham. Good to see Greg back in Scotland - never understood why Birmingham signed him as they seemed to have no idea how to use him. They played with a big target man and relied on hard work and power rather than any footballing ability. They seemed to think Greg was some kind of a winger and then spent their time getting him to track back rather than set him free in any playmaking capacity"
It's pretty accurate. He wasn't used right at City but at Aberdeen I expect him to flourish. Give him freedom to roam and he'll be one hell of a signing. Make him stick to the wing and do a lot of defensive work and he'll be less effective.
thanks. the birmingham forums were pretty uninformative (although they did say he was a winger) and were written in that whiny accent.0 -
Does anybody know why things don't appear to have worked out so well for Stewart at Birmingham?
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But why would Joe Miller nake up such a story? What would Celtic's decision to refuse the ticket allocation gain from this?
One time a tramp told me a story that involved a talking horse. Sadly, it appears that wee Joe may be heading down that road. Or he just put his name to any old pish that the journo made up, probably for some money.
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It's a bit of a gamble with Forrans, a good player but a bit of a crock at times and we signed our fair share of them last season.
Spending around £2m for 2 players running down their contracts seems a ott,
You should lump the whole war chest on Walker. he's great. Mcclean's shite.0 -
funny. does it work with other words?
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[emoji38]
Imagine just browsing this place for the first time and reading this. You'd be wondering WTF was going on.
i've been on before and i'm a bit confused0 -
Please keep your filthy mitts off young Kenneth. He's too good for the likes of you.
You may carry on the troll squabble.0 -
in the continuing absence of the promised signing news, i thought you might be interested to know that I am considering going for a shite. I only 80% need it so I might let it bake for a while.
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Let's forget the bullshit,ok?
You're smarter than that.
Do you think it is good for Rangers? Yes or No?
always black and white with your lot, eh?
I think that it is an improvement, so that's good.
the starting point was pretty shit though, so i doubt that it is a deal that most comparable clubs would consider good.
I don't think it's a victory for Rangers v Ashley nor for Ashley over rangers. Its's not a zero sum game, you all lost out because of ego and pride but now something has been rescued.
if i had to choose a simplistic answer i would probably say on balance "good"
happy?0 -
Ok....as you think....if Rangers blinked first....why would Ashley give away a 7 year deal?
If Rangers blinked as you say....he could have continued making them blink year after year.
King says the deals are ripped up as of now, they've agreed a one year deal then free to negotiate.
Have Sports Direct said this isn't true?
I don't know the ins and outs of the deal.
Dave King's statement was clearly carefully worded to convey a message while being less than candid. It was clearly spin and if you took it at face value you are a moron (i'm sure you didn't though, cos you're not)
I don't believe that there were seven years left to run. If the deal has been shortened then surely that makes it more likely that you've been sodomised on this year's deal- a sort of termination payment?
make sure you get the socks as well so you can wear them to work. That's what a real fan would do.
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Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!
in Celtic v Rangers, Rangers v Celtic
Posted
sure. if you put proceeds of crime into one in a false name.