Che Dail

If it means the SFA now has a mandate to organise all football clubs into the appropriate regions and leagues it would be excellent indeed. They could place the North clubs into the pyramid under the HL, the East clubs can integrate into the established EoS at tier 6, and the West Juniors effectively stays as is, but feeding into the LL alongside the SoS and EoS - hand it all over - sorted!

74 junior clubs think they should slot in at the same level as LL / HL?

Have any clubs confirmed they will definitely stay in the Junior grade next season? Between Midlothian and East Lothian I believe only Penicuik are determined to stay. From what I am led to believe, all the others in the two regions are giving the EoS move serious consideration.

Mediocre

You could always revive your popular 'Junior Giants' thread. That opinion piece wasn't at all antagonistic or divisive. Tell folk to read your posts.

After 5 years of the Lowland League, 45% of west junior clubs still don't support the pyramid - that's a divide. Better for the 55% to get together for 'sensible dialogue' and create the WoS league now. The pyramid is working, it's up to clubs to make a move.

The clubs effectively are the SFA and Lowland League. Neither is an authority. It would seem unlikely that a single club in the EoS Association would vote for such a move when there already is an East feeder. The question might be if 2 EoS leagues are formed, in future seasons could Junior clubs enter the 1st Division rather than having to work through the 2nd? I could see a logic in that, to a point.

Another key reason is because of this: https://www.midlothianadvertiser.co.uk/sport/football/fears-over-the-future-of-under-21s-football-in-midlothian-1-4697511 Bonnyrigg Rose 'A' have traditionally been strong at under 21s, and this season there are very good Tranent and Musselburgh Windsor sides at under 19s - where will the players go next? The under 20s EoS league is about to expand next season with Kelty, Dalkeith and Ormiston entering sides, plus 1 of the other Junior clubs that may be making the switch next season. Newtongrange and Bonnyrigg could effectively be youth 'feeder clubs' for Dalkeith and Whitehill, with Tranent and Musselburgh promoting players up to Ormiston.

I see Rosyth were awarded Quality Mark 'Development' status by the SFA recently. It's not the club I had in mind, but you'd think they would have the most to gain by moving to EoS if their new ground (has that happened?) meets the criteria. A derby with Burntisland! And close to Edinburgh for relatively local games... would make a lot of sense.

I do - but it's for the clubs to say if they want to go public at this point. I know there was a Fife club interested this time last year, they might be revisiting it.

It could hardly be described as a consultation, it's barely even a questionnaire as the answers are largely pre-determined: Should Junior Football Join the Pyramid System? NO (Junior Football wants to retain its independence, it says so in the paper you issued. Junior clubs should join though, if they want to) What option do you prefer? B (because Option A is a complete non-starter. But 'B' is almost there anyway as there already is an East feeder, so only a West feeder is required) Does your club meet entry level Club Licensing Criteria NO (Of course it doesn't - But every club can work towards it) These questions follow a clumsily worded paper laced with negative bias, leading inevitably to an outcome like, "The pyramid is still flawed, members don't want it, members aren't ready for licensing". And no progress is made. Meanwhile, on the 'rumours', if the Fife club interest is confirmed that makes it 4 Junior clubs planning on making the switch plus 2 Amateur clubs interested and possibly the return to the EoS by 2 former member clubs in the Borders - looks like 2 leagues will be possible.

Given that the member clubs currently in the pyramid will be the ones voting on the SJFA proposals, tell us what you make of this: PYRAMID Whilst it could be argued that Pyramid could aid the development of the game in Scotland, some would also suggest that the concept of the Lowland League was flawed – primarily being a rebadged East of Scotland League with geography rather that merit being part of the selection process. However, over the last 5 seasons, standards both on and off the park have improved in the Lowland League. The newly formed East Kilbride FC have been consistently improving on the pitch and all 16 clubs now are Club Licensed. The down side however is the “nomadic” clubs who have no fixed abode nor demonstrable support, together with Stirling and Edinburgh Universities and one could be excused for asking what they bring to the game overall. Very poorly worded, a certain level of arrogance displayed in this passage which permeates through the whole paper unfortunately. It also has several typos, factual inaccuracies, spelling mistakes and grammatical errors, and they've got the name of some clubs wrong. How to win friends and influence people. The wrong illustrations are used to describe the options, the pyramid diagram is confusing (the bands don't line up with the text) and the survey itself is woefully inadequate - 3 poorly selected questions to determine the future of Junior football. Do the North clubs just ignore it since Options A and B don't include them at all? Why is there not an option for the East Region clubs to merge in with the East of Scotland League? The language & tone of the document and the basic Word formatting of the thing is decidedly amateurish - it just doesn't fit with the SFA media image or PR profile - they've had nothing to do with this. As a progression of Option A, the national Junior Association should simply break up and split into distinct regions, join the pyramid and promote its top clubs into the Lowland and Highland Leagues. The East Region clubs should merge in with the established East of Scotland League feeder and the North Region assoc should lead their clubs into a North Association. It's fairly simple and straightforward. The 'Junior' name could still be survived in the Scottish Junior Cup for non-licensed clubs below the LL and HL, if they wish to participate.

Aye, 'promoted' ahead of Option B, but not 'proposed'. The document implies that this arrangement is what the SFA want. Absolutely no doubt they want the Junior CLUBS in the pyramid, but not on the arrangement being proposed here by the SJFA. The document pretty much says that the SJFA wants to remain independent, but allow its clubs to achieve a licence and compete in the Scottish Cup. There are no explanations on promotion / relegation. What if a decent ams team wins the EoS then gets relegated from the LL... into the Super League? What if Linlithgow win the SL but don't want to be promoted to the LL? The pyramid needs buy-in from everyone and judging by the tone and language in this document, the SJFA leadership isn't commited or positive enough about it. It mentions potentially 'losing' 2 clubs a season which is a negative view if this is to be a true collaboration.

It doesn't say the SFA proposed it... And if you transpose "SFA" with "Stewart Regan" the whole thing starts to unravel. The options are what the SJFA tabled at the meeting - nobody in the LL, SoS or EoS support it. Now they are asking their Junior assoc members for comment. It doesn't help that they've mixed up the Option A text with the Option B diagrams... but irrespective of those errors, neither arrangement is viable or realistic. Timescales: Season 2019/20 it suggests.

Dinny turn up at my door! But if at some point my boy asks for support to travel and work in another country, learn a language, gain invaluable life experience and play football - I'll probably give it some thought and possibly even encourage it.

I like that its new and different and somebody is trying to build something from the ground up rather than what we're used to seeing which is a generous sprinkling of money from the top down. Seems to be plenty demand from students abroad wanting to pay to come here for more than just football. From the number of students and the fees being charged it must be close to a £1m business aside from the fan ownership venture. It reminds me of the Camp America / Bunac projects, and US football scholarships. I'm sure Davie Weir embarked on that before returning home to play for Falkirk then Hearts. It'll be interesting to see how they progress and if they can get a home base in the central belt. Colin Cameron is good, credible. I say good luck to them...

Ha! "Edusport Academy eyes Premiership place by 2025 under web-based fan membership" On the BBC website today...

Different approach to FT football taken by Edusport, funded by the players themselves! Also Selkirk had a tie-in at one point through Borders College and the modern apprentice scheme... not sure how successful it was though

Probably, they're just the best example - although the point I'm trying to make is that for football at this level it would be more realistic and sustainable to employ staff to help develop the club instead of aiming to employ FT footballers which was suggested earlier.

It mostly depends on the people involved, the level of ambition and where the club priorities lie, its purpose and aims. Broxburn is another good local example with 3 or 4 FT roles. Refer to the OSCR website for more info on any charity's activities.

It's the Spartans Community Football Academy - in addition to subs from playing members and facility hire they're a charity with a variety of funding partners such as Cash for Kids, SIS, Big Issue, Big Lottery, Sport Scotland, Robertson Trust, BBC Children in Need, Rank Foundation etc etc.

Raith Rovers have a core support of about 2000 and were on the verge of going part-time after relegation, but decided to stay FT to pursue promotion back to the Championship as they figured they'd be £200k worse off in League 1. Kirkcaldy population: 50,000. The only time they've filled the stadium in recent years was against Rangers on their way through. I'm not sure if there should be any drive towards more full-time football clubs - Iceland have no pro clubs yet they made it to the euros and did pretty well, they also will be in the world cup finals in 2018. They invest in community football, coaches and have excellent facilities including several indoor full size astros. Their elite players move to bigger pro clubs in other countries. Perhaps Junior clubs should look to the likes of Spartans who have the equivalent of about 10-12 FT employees (maybe more?) but in club and community development roles rather than in the playing squad.

It's about football finances. A point was made, among others, doubting the credibility of the SFA and questioning why established junior clubs should risk their viability by putting trust in that organisation - so it is totally relevant. Not everyone will care too much about understanding the detail, some might just prefer the headlines - however it's not every day you'll get someone sharing this level of expertise and knowledge for free on a p+b forum - you can either soak it up, or ignore it.

Thing is if they'd have done that at the start it either would have worked or could have been chaos. Whatever they did not everyone would be happy. It has taken a few seasons but the Lowland League is now well established and it's time to expand the feeder leagues, starting with the WoS. To me the SFA should take the lead - the point has been made previously that they're afraid to step on the toes of the SJFA and member clubs and I think this is right but maybe they should appoint somebody now to just get on with it - it's not such a political 'hot potato' as it would have been 5 years ago, people are coming round to it.

I agree but if it is to be all embracing then all clubs should be in - in my opinion we should have max 2 (or 3) national pro leagues then regional below that. If all clubs are involved then the structure can be adjusted to suit. To me, fixtures like Peterhead v Berwick midweek are ludicrous - so is the fact they play each other 4 times a season.