Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[Bairnforever1992]

End is nigh, 9 days left for the liquidators to arrive at Ibrokes.

This is going to be a laugh in the long term.

[stonedsailor]

My link Please explain to us all as to why exactly any SFL team would be on the SPL fixture list for the coming season. DAFCs' last game in the SPL is shown as the 12/05/12 the day before Rangers played St.Johnstone. I don't see DAFCs' fixtures for 2012/13 in the SFL on the SPL website do you. Also as for the UEFA website the same information is given for both clubs as is shown on the SPL website.

What exactly are you trying to say?

[stonedsailor]

Well at least thats a change from the your a new club with no history you lot have been so keen to invent

Progress has been made, keep going you are close to making a full recovery

Your not very bright are you !

Dont have to be, to keep pace with halfwits like you

Woosh, Hellboy YOU'RE not very nice taking the pish like that.

[FinnesTON]

Aye .. we all know he is in denial. Whether appointed or not he's fully aware of the consequences that could be coming and perilous state of his 'debt free' club.

But hey let hm play his little games, while he buries his head in the sand and fails to act to save the club he professes to love ..

Moi ... I'll just laugh at him when they finish off the original club, they are stripped of their titles and trophies and the BDO start chasing wee Hughie for the assets to be returned or the cash equivalent as to what they think he plundered from the club.

Earlier Haudit and Daudit claimed they didn't sell the Rangers footballers because they needed them to secure the SPL prize (award) money. Yet the recent report released by these chancers confirmed they had sold the 'prize' as part of the £5.5 million package which meant 'technically' (if he had managed to get his hands on it) he bought the club for slightly over three million .. not that he has paid for anything as he has simply loaned the club the money ** snigger ** .

Paul McConville's blog article details it very well and if the analysis of the report is correct, then they have been truly bent over the desk and been pumped ... however they don't serve one ounce of sympathy as they refuse to listen .. as they did way back in 2003 2005 ...

Think the attitude then was .. awa yir talking shite .. roon ye ,, etc etc ...

I see this heading in the same direction .... doonhill very fast wi nae brakes !!!

.

What still quizzes me is the stance of Haudit & Daudit , in the Pompey administration the axe was taken to their playing staff immediately to get the club to return to a manageable state. With the Rangers administration the players took a deferral of payment so how was this in the best interests of the creditors, have these players been paid the money owed or are they also creditors.

IMO the money for finishing second should have been withheld by the SPL as the club in question had already gained an advantage of paying players they could not afford while avoiding paying tax and NI.

If H & D saw the players as assets then why didn't they sell them as part of the administration process for the benefit of creditors, surely that was their remit and had no concern about how many players we available to any new owner.

The other question for H & D as insolvency practitioners they must be aware of HMRC's policy of non-negociations in cases where tax has been deliberately unpaid so why were they accepting business plans that included a CVA, is this a process that has to be followed or was this another waste of money by what appears to be a shambolic exercise throughout H&D's involvement.

[Bairnforever1992]

CG is lying, why is he keep on saying we have, "unpaid debts" then why did your club not pay back £134M to the creditors? Because CG should never bought the club for £5.5M, to me he's a big chancer waiting for the club to be liquidated and make a huge profit.

[Fife Saint]

Then why did the SPL send CG a letter on the 18th May stating that they would pay the football creditors with this money?

So if the club were owe a bank that money instead of HMRC it would have been different? Debt is just that, it makes no difference who the creditors are

They are saying that they wrote to the old club.

This new club agreed to pay football debts in exchange for membership. The SFA have made a massive f**k up by applying conditions of sanction for membership.

[Itwiznaeme]

Charles Green:

"Rangers are the strongest club in Scotland, having rid themselves of debts."

"Today we are the strongest club in Scotland. We have no debts, no loans, no overdraft and money in the bank."

http://www.scotsman....claim-1-2504789

[Fife Saint]

That's like saying a flu victim has rid himself of flu by committing suicide. What a plum.

[Bairnforever1992]

CG "I have a very rich Chinese man here."

In your dreams Charles Green he sells the team.

Edited September 4, 2012 by Bairnforever1992

[King Kong Bundy]

Charles Green is a business man who does not give a toss for The Rangers. The fans are finally warming to him because he is feeding them the drivel they love. At least David Murray and Craig Whyte were 'Rangers men'.

It will be sold to the next clown as soon as the thing is profitable and then the cycle will continue.

[PeeTeeJag]

They are saying that they wrote to the old club.

This new club agreed to pay football debts in exchange for membership. The SFA have made a massive f**k up by applying conditions of sanction for membership.

Exactly.

The money due was to OldCo. But as they owed money to other clubs, the SFA said that they would pay the money to the clubs and whatever was left would go to OldCo. That way ensuring the other clubs got the money. This in effect was instead of OldCo getting the money and then them giving it to other clubs because OldCo couldn't be trusted to do that. All things being equal, OldCo would have been given this money, banked it, then distributed it to whoever they owed wonga. At this point it became OldCo's money.

However when OldCo no longer existed, the SFA had no club to give the money too. SevCo, despite how they want to dress it up, didnt get 2nd place in the SPL last season. So, as the money that the SFA still had in their account was still theirs then they didn't have to hand it over to anyone.

The confusion comes when the SFA told OldCo they would pay the money to other clubs first and only then give OldCo what was left. This is what Green is still pandering to the fans with. Firstly he is saying that HE had paid all the outstanding debt, then we discover that this wasn't quite accurate and that he expected the SFA to pay the clubs. Again inciting this siege mentality among the fans.

Green's comments akin to "why should we pay for the sins of a club that wasn't us", "We're still the same rangers" etc, etc only confuse matters further. The club is either still rangers and therefore must keep it's titles but be hammered by law, or it's a completely new club that can't be blamed for what the previous club did, and has no titles.

An example of this is the Homebase that used to be at Braehead. It lasted a couple of years, was getting massively in debt and had to be sold to B&Q. All B&Q did was change the name of the place. The building was exactly the same, and they kept on the Homebase staff.

Did B&Q incur Homebase's debts? No. Just the building, equipment and employees. If a company called "Homebasics" had bought the place over instead would they still be regarded as "Homebase" but just under a different name? No.

If Green wants to kid on he gives a shit about the club's history then that's up to him. But he also knows that with all that history comes a shitload of hassle that a completely new entity doesn't have hanging over it. More importantly investors will be watching with interest how this develops. They don't want to put money into a club that has a blackhole of debt that their cash will just disappear into.

Green knows that eventually he will have to concede that SevCo is an entirely new club, (he's probably known this from the start), and will blame all and sundry for this whilst making out he has tried his best for the club and fans.

The fans meanwhile will insist that no matter what this is still the same club they have supported all these years. Fair play to them, but it will be only them that will believe it. Everyone else AND the record books will show that rangers football club died in 2012.

I do admire the passion of some of the SevCo fans, like Tedi, No.8 etc but sadly in this day and age passion isn't enough to keep a club going when it's been so badly run for 20 years.

How long will it be once Green leaves before he is saying that he tried as hard as he could to save the club, but the fans, players, Sally, ex-board, SFA, SPL, Obama, Kylie, tea-lady, made it an impossible task?

[youngsy]

http://www.scotprem....sp?page=s13_1_1

Interesting that if you click on to the results the last match the team you link to played was a 4-0 away victory at St Johnstone on 13th May.

If you click on the fixtures, that team has no future fixtures, Rangers are on the SPL website, Sevco are not, much like the case for the UEFA website.

So what's your point caller?

What exactly are you trying to say?

I'm saying that you've posted a pile of nonsense as regards Rangers on the SPL website as regards future fixtures,neither of the two clubs that dropped out of the SPL last season,Dunfermline and Rangers, have had their fixtures shown on that website and why would they as they are both now SFL clubs. They have both had their last SPL game and result shown on the site as well as club history.

Edited September 4, 2012 by youngsy

[beermonkey]

The letter dated 18th May clearly states

"The Board of the Scottish Premier League Ltd considered the application by Dundee United that the outstanding sum due by Rangers to Dundee United of £31,031.20 be offset against the next sums due to Rangers by SPL Ltd, with the offset sum being paid to Dundee United."

"The board decided to accede the application to Dundee United and accordingly the sum will be withheld from the next sum payable by the SPL Ltd to Rangers, and <strong>the sum will be paid by the SPL Ltd to Dundee United</strong>."

Seems like a very clear agreement to pay

I understand that the SPL now say they see things differently, where CG clearly sees things otherwise, which is why the SFA have been asked to clarify the position as they see it, I am inclined to agree with CG as the SPL issued a written agreement and have only issued a statement after the fact that they now think otherwise. I guess until the SFA gives a judgement then further debate is pointless

But rangers don't exist anymore.

[Bendarroch]

CG is lying, why is he keep on saying we have, "unpaid debts" then why did your club not pay back £134M to the creditors?

Awesome

I'm going to take a guess here and suggest it's because theoretical sums don't mean that much in the real world.

[PeeTeeJag]

The letter dated 18th May clearly states

"The Board of the Scottish Premier League Ltd considered the application by Dundee United that the outstanding sum due by Rangers to Dundee United of £31,031.20 be offset against the next sums due to Rangers by SPL Ltd, with the offset sum being paid to Dundee United."

"The board decided to accede the application to Dundee United and accordingly the sum will be withheld from the next sum payable by the SPL Ltd to Rangers, and <strong>the sum will be paid by the SPL Ltd to Dundee United</strong>."

Seems like a very clear agreement to pay

I understand that the SPL now say they see things differently, where CG clearly sees things otherwise, which is why the SFA have been asked to clarify the position as they see it, I am inclined to agree with CG as the SPL issued a written agreement and have only issued a statement after the fact that they now think otherwise. I guess until the SFA gives a judgement then further debate is pointless

You are right. It is very clear. The SPL were due to pay an outstanding sum of money to Rangers, but Rangers no longer exist. "The Rangers" are not "Rangers" therefore are not eligible for the money.

If you do a job for me and I owe you money, but before you can collect you die, however a mad scientist clones you, do I owe the clone money? Nope.

He maybe identical to you, but he isn't you, therefore isn't entitled to be paid by me.

So are rangers still rangers and therefore should be punished for EBT's etc, or are they a clone that although identical in every way to the original, doesn't have it's history?

Gonna have decide soon which it is I'm afraid.

[JMDP]

I'm glad you're won over but to be honest whether you accept the answer is neither here nor there to me. I've stated that i personally know that several small creditors were paid in full by the RFF,many weren't but if you think i'm going to provide "evidence" as you put it you can think again. You got an answer,if you're not satisfied i suggest you contact the RFF for a full breakdown of monies paid out to small creditors. Although as you're more than likely not a creditor of any description or indeed paid into the fund i doubt if you'll get much joy there.

You're hardly a credible source. Even best case scenario from your dribbling, Rangers/Sevco did not pay any of these small creditors debts, the RFF did. Which leads me to think that they - along with the other creditors who haven't been paid - were royally screwed by Rangers(deceased).

Therefore, it strikes me as pretty morally repugnant for Sevco fans to be lording it over everyone, claiming to have kept their history, be debt free, signing players on ludicrous sums of money in the wake of shafting honest businesses like this. It stinks, and pisses all over those who have been shafted in this debacle.

To be fair, it's nothing I don't expect from Rangers(deceased)/Sevco fans.

Edited September 4, 2012 by JMDP

[stonedsailor]

I'm saying that you've posted a pile of nonsense as regards Rangers on the SPL website as regards future fixtures,neither of the two clubs that dropped out of the SPL last season,Dunfermline and Rangers, have had their fixtures shown on that website and why would they as they are both now SFL clubs. They have both had their last SPL game and result shown on the site as well as club history.

I think the truth is more plausible.

[stonedsailor]

You are missing the point

If you are owe money to a firm that goes bust then you are still due that money

How difficult is this, that money is due to the Rangers FC (in administration) the SPL made an agreement with Rangers FC (in administration). There was no agreement between the SPL and Sevco in that regard, Sevco have no claim to that money. Sevco made an agreement with the SFA to make right all football related debts in order for their application for membership to be fast tracked.

The two companies are separate legal entities and have no connection to one and other, that is why the creditors cannot pursue Sevco over the money they are not Rangers FC.

If you went by your logic then why are you defending (Rangers FC in administration)? According to you that company screwed your club over.

[beermonkey]

The SPL clearly state that the sum will be paid by the SPL Ltd to Dundee Utd.....No mention of Rangers / sevco / oldco

We already cleared up that the old Rangers waived the right to this money

The bottom part of my statement still stands

Maybe someone can draw this guy a wee picture.

[youngsy]

You're hardly a credible source. Even best case scenario from your dribbling, Rangers/Sevco did not pay any of these small creditors debts, the RFF did. Which leads me to think that they - along with the other creditors who haven't been paid - were royally screwed by Rangers(deceased).

Therefore, it strikes me as pretty morally repugnant for Sevco fans to be lording it over everyone, claiming to have kept their history, be debt free, signing players on ludicrous sums of money in the wake of shafting honest businesses like this. It stinks, and pisses all over those who have been shafted in this debacle.

To be fair, it's nothing I don't expect from Rangers(deceased)/Sevco fans.

Where did i state that Rangers paid off small creditors? Your question was"were any small creditors paid off". You got the answer that there were several paid off,by the RFF,Glencairn Glass were one that i personally know about that the RFF paid off among others that i know of from the fund. As for your opinion on The Rangers Football Club plc royally screwed creditors,do you really believe that the support were behind Craig Whyte and his actions in witholding Tax and NI as well as not paying other creditors.

Behave yourself,the man has possibly committed fraudulent acts which pushed The Rangers Football Club plc into liquidation.

There are many Rangers fans as much a victim of this as anyone else,myself included so don't give me this pish that the support are lording it over anyone because i can assure you i,and many,many others are not. Of course that is something that some like yourself will not take into account such is your vindictiveness towards the support and club which you have already demonstrated in your post.

Whyte pushed The Rangers Football Club plc into such a position that HMRC stated that it wasn't viable for a CVA to be accepted,hence the liquidation of the company.