Nowhereman Posted March 28, 2018 Share Posted March 28, 2018 It isn't speculation. It is the situation right here, right now. How much did the Clydebank shareholders get when Dr Hall acted? There are of course different classes of shares. Brabo's are "A" mine are "B". Forget end of year dividends. Brabco own the assets. It was the Steedmans that sold Kilbowie. Did Clydebank have any other shareholders? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 It was the Steedmans that sold Kilbowie. Did Clydebank have any other shareholders? There were other shareholders yes. The Steedmans and the other shareholders had bought land on 13 acres of green belt between Hardgate and Drumchapel for a new stadium. Planning was rejected. The Steedmans then sold Kilbowie and pocketed the money. They then sold the club to Hall, who after trying unsuccessfully to relocate to Dublin and Carlisle, sold the league place to Airdrie United for a reputed £100,000. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 It’s my understanding that Brabco owns something like 75% of DFC A shares. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Here’s how it was all done.....legally. £2.3 million for Kilbowie. https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/search-judgments/judgment?id=b24087a6-8980-69d2-b500-ff0000d74aa7 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jan Vojáček Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Here’s how it was all done.....legally. £2.3 million for Kilbowie. https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/search-judgments/judgment?id=b24087a6-8980-69d2-b500-ff0000d74aa7 If I’m reading that correctly it seems to outline plans for the Bankies to groundshare with West at Burnbrae. Christ, if that had happened I could’ve ended up a Bankies fan...Do we know (even roughly) how much the current site at the Rock is worth? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 1 hour ago, Howlin' Wilf said: It’s my understanding that Brabco owns something like 75% of DFC A shares. Brabco own B shares I believe. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) 52 minutes ago, The Moonster said: Brabco own B shares I believe. If that is so, I wonder who owns the 6,000 ordinary A shares at £1 each? There are 6,000 A shares at £1 which are all issued and 1,988,000 B shares at 50p according to my share certificate issued in 1992. I don’t know how many B shares are issued. I would have to check back what the differences are in A and B shares . My 200 B shares are numbered 429161 to 429360 inclusive. There are 100 special category C shares which are held in entirety by Dumbarton Community Stadium Ltd ( the independent company set up by McFall, not the Brabco subsidiary) Edited March 29, 2018 by Howlin' Wilf 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonsanorak Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 On 20/10/2017 at 15:19, sonsanorak said: The Brabco return is from the sale of the current site; 10 acres at £500k each. The new ground has to be funded from whatever the new housing site sells for. Problem then is we need the council to approve a community sports hub (with housing) that could end up not fully funded and having to be cut back. Would the council approve the full project if financially we couldn't build the 2 astro pitches, or the full stadium? Definites are; Current ground needs expensive repairs done in the next few years. Current site is worth around £5m. Protection offered by the Golden shares is questionable. Someone asked about the value of the Castle site; this was my post from the Sonstrust meeting in October. On page 1315 of this thread. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Parr Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Just now, Howlin' Wilf said: If that is so, I wonder who owns the 6,000 ordinary A shares at £1 each? There are 6,000 A shares at £1 which are all issued and 1,988,000 B shares at 50p according to my share certificate issued in 1992. I don’t know how many B shares are issued. I would have to check back what the differences are in A and B shares but from memory I thought the B shares were non voting shares. My 200 B shares are numbered 429161 to 429360 inclusive. There are 100 special category C shares which are held in entirety by Dumbarton Community Stadium Ltd ( the independent company set up by McFall, not the Brabco subsidiary) B shares carry 1 vote per share. Grenada Enterprises (via Brabco) hold circa 1.5m shares of this class. A shares carry 1 vote per 5 shares and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale of its heritable property. Voting power there is diluted to the point of being worthless. The C line carries 1 vote per share and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale, disposal or transfer of the company's heritable property. In such meetings a 75% majority of C class holders have to vote in favour for any resolution to pass. Presumably this constitutes the so-called 'golden share' much harked about years ago. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 10 minutes ago, Consolidate said: B shares carry 1 vote per share. Grenada Enterprises (via Brabco) hold circa 1.5m shares of this class. A shares carry 1 vote per 5 shares and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale of its heritable property. Voting power there is diluted to the point of being worthless. The C line carries 1 vote per share and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale, disposal or transfer of the company's heritable property. In such meetings a 75% majority of C class holders have to vote in favour for any resolution to pass. Presumably this constitutes the so-called 'golden share' much harked about years ago. Thanks for the clarification! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 19 minutes ago, Consolidate said: B shares carry 1 vote per share. Grenada Enterprises (via Brabco) hold circa 1.5m shares of this class. A shares carry 1 vote per 5 shares and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale of its heritable property. Voting power there is diluted to the point of being worthless. The C line carries 1 vote per share and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale, disposal or transfer of the company's heritable property. In such meetings a 75% majority of C class holders have to vote in favour for any resolution to pass. Presumably this constitutes the so-called 'golden share' much harked about years ago. On the C shares, the 75% is a minimum assuming four directors of DCS Ltd. In fact at the time I was involved there were five directors which meant that an 80% majority was needed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 Oh Jesus, naw......as if things weren't bad enough on every front the Golden Share has reappeared like, er, a bad share 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Parr Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) At least it's some sort of hindrance to hostile intentions. Better it existed than didn't. Edited March 29, 2018 by Consolidate 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 It would be nice to have some sort of statement from the club and/or Brabco over the next week acknowledging that the proposal is either dead or will be appealed and where they now see the future. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deputy Keeper Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 23 minutes ago, The Moonster said: It would be nice to have some sort of statement from the club and/or Brabco over the next week acknowledging that the proposal is either dead or will be appealed and where they now see the future. My understanding is that Brabco have three months to appeal the decision, so I guess it's unlikely that we will see any statement from them in the next week. Meantime I'm sure the Trust will be looking at options for staying at the Rock and considering what the possible ways forward might entail, depending on developments over the next few months. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 51 minutes ago, Consolidate said: At least it's some sort of hindrance to hostile intentions. Better it existed than didn't. It exists, but does it fulfil it's original purpose of protecting the football club from, shall we say, actions detrimental to it's future wellbeing ? I'd very much doubt that it would be anything more than a speed bump in the road once push came to shove. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Flash Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Consolidate said: B shares carry 1 vote per share. Grenada Enterprises (via Brabco) hold circa 1.5m shares of this class. A shares carry 1 vote per 5 shares and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale of its heritable property. Voting power there is diluted to the point of being worthless. The C line carries 1 vote per share and votes can only be exercised in meetings concerning (i) liquidation of the company and (ii) sale, disposal or transfer of the company's heritable property. In such meetings a 75% majority of C class holders have to vote in favour for any resolution to pass. Presumably this constitutes the so-called 'golden share' much harked about years ago. Not sure if there is any significance in this, but the A shareholders can vote in meetings to sanction the sale of the heritable property “or any part thereof”. The C shareholders can only vote in meetings sanctioning the sale, disposal or transfer of the whole of the company’s heritable property. Not saying that this is likely, but if a meeting was held to sanction the transfer of the stadium plus 99% of the surrounding area, does that mean the C shareholders wouldn’t be able to vote? Probably me talking a load of nonsense. Just don’t know why there is a difference in the wording between the A and C shares concerning the property. Edited to take out a bit that definitely was nonsense. Edited March 29, 2018 by Flash 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 1 minute ago, Deputy Keeper said: My understanding is that Brabco have three months to appeal the decision, so I guess it's unlikely that we will see any statement from them in the next week. Meantime I'm sure the Trust will be looking at options for staying at the Rock and considering what the possible ways forward might entail, depending on developments over the next few months. As regards an appeal, I'd imagine that Brabco have already laid out a considerable sum of money to get where they are today, ie marooned at the bottom of Castle Road. Montagu Evans bill for Roddy won't have been cheap never mind all the other outlays and consultations. Their record currently stands at Played 2, Lost 2 and if they decide to plough on they may very well risk throwing a not insignificant sum of good money after bad, as there is absolutely no certainty that the Scottish Government will be any more enthusiastic about a proposed football development very close to the A82 main trunk road up the western side of Scotland than the local council. Brabco would therefore do very well to consider their next moves, and just maybe it's time for them to consider beating an orderly retreat for the benefit of everyone concerned. If that results in a loss-making situation, then as savvy businessmen they will presumably recognise that the value of investments can vary - caveat emptor and all that. Cool heads and honest assessment should be the order of the day, the last thing we need is more emotion in the mix. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Parr Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 12 minutes ago, Flash said: Not sure if there is any significance in this, but the A shareholders can vote in meetings to sanction the sale of the heritable property “or any part thereof”. The C shareholders can only vote in meetings sanctioning the sale, disposal or transfer of the whole of the company’s heritable property. Not saying that this is likely, but if a meeting was held to sanction the transfer of the stadium plus 99% of the surrounding area, does that mean the C shareholders wouldn’t be able to vote? Probably me talking a load of nonsense. Just don’t know why there is a difference in the wording between the A and C shares concerning the property. Edited to take out a bit that definitely was nonsense. My assumption is that it attempts to restrict C class holders to voting in very specific circumstances only - I.e. complete sale. I think your suggested scenario would likely end up in litigation as a possible circumvention of the purpose of the articles. Messy! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowhereman Posted March 29, 2018 Share Posted March 29, 2018 4 hours ago, Howlin' Wilf said: Here’s how it was all done.....legally. £2.3 million for Kilbowie. https://www.scotcourts.gov.uk/search-judgments/judgment?id=b24087a6-8980-69d2-b500-ff0000d74aa7 Thanks for that Wilf. I'd always wondered how the Steedmans had managed to pocket the money for Kilbowie without giving Clydebank FC anything 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.