Sons' sorrow

[Howlin' Wilf]

12 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

We rode our luck and won with two breakaway goals - you get away with that once, maybe twice a season.

Sent from my MotoG3 using Pie and Bovril mobile app
 

If you'll forgive me OK3, it seems that in your eyes when we win it's lucky and when we lose we desreve it. 

[Howlin' Wilf]

17 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

Meanwhile back at the ranch Forfar rather contradicting those who thought we played well at Peterhead last week.

In games involving Peterhead, Forfar and Dumbarton this season, there have been two goals scored, one by Peterhead and one by Forfar. two of these games were at Peterhead and one at Forfar. There isn't much between these teams but based on the two I have seen, I reckon we could beat both at home.

[Jack Burton]

I don't know the costs of streaming games but I'm sure if away games were streamed,  there would be bigger "attendances". Many folk can't afford the considerable cost of away games but would be able to stand the £10-£12 if they were available on a stream. From my point of view, I go to a few away games per season but am unable to go to every one due to other commitments. I would be interested in streams were they available.. 

 

They are available, you just need to purchase it from whoever the home team is you're playing.

 

[Howlin' Wilf]

39 minutes ago, Jack Burton said:

 

They are available, you just need to purchase it from whoever the home team is you're playing.

 

Yes I know they're available now (Covid19) as I have watched several games. Under normal conditions you need to faff about with VPNs and I don't think many clubs at this level do it. 

[Jack Burton]

Yes I know they're available now (Covid19) as I have watched several games. Under normal conditions you need to faff about with VPNs and I don't think many clubs at this level do it. 

Can't see it changing long term.

Being able to show games in the UK at 3 pm is just a temporary measure and clubs would likely lose a fortune. You could all just pile round a mates house to watch the game buying one stream rather than the 3 or 4 individually paying in at the game.

[BallochSonsFan]

It would be good if teams could continue to offer it and include geo blocking. Easy to get round unfortunately, but the idea of blocking viewers within a certain radius of the home team would potentially be the right balance between getting folk to attend games in person and offering something for away fans and for home fans who don't get to travel so often to home matches. You could geoblock a 15 mile radius of Dumbarton and cover 90% of all Sons home fans. 

[Nowhereman]

If all games were streamed it would undoubtedly lead to smaller crowds at the games. Is that what we want?

[DFCdownsouth]

The last thing any wants are smaller crowds but I do wonder if that actually would be the case. As far as I know, no one has ever tried it so there is no way to know what effect it would have.

I would like to think that the people who already attend games would continue to do so - going to game is so much better than watching on the TV and I bet locals would continue to attend.

It would be interesting to see it trialled and tested. If it didn't affect attendances and gained revenue for a club it would be a no-brainer, but obviously without testing the idea out, we won't know. I get that it would be a bit of a risk for anyone to test it though as if it did affect attendances, whoever is trialling it would lose out.

[Jack Burton]

The last thing any wants are smaller crowds but I do wonder if that actually would be the case. As far as I know, no one has ever tried it so there is no way to know what effect it would have.

I would like to think that the people who already attend games would continue to do so - going to game is so much better than watching on the TV and I bet locals would continue to attend.

It would be interesting to see it trialled and tested. If it didn't affect attendances and gained revenue for a club it would be a no-brainer, but obviously without testing the idea out, we won't know. I get that it would be a bit of a risk for anyone to test it though as if it did affect attendances, whoever is trialling it would lose out.

Might not have much impact on the home attendance but the away crowd would take a hit IMO. Could just watch it with your mates and a few beers paying for just the one stream then. The club would also lose out on income from match programmes, pie stall, bar etc.

[FifeSons]

2 hours ago, Jack Burton said:

2 hours ago, DFCdownsouth said:

The last thing any wants are smaller crowds but I do wonder if that actually would be the case. As far as I know, no one has ever tried it so there is no way to know what effect it would have.

I would like to think that the people who already attend games would continue to do so - going to game is so much better than watching on the TV and I bet locals would continue to attend.

It would be interesting to see it trialled and tested. If it didn't affect attendances and gained revenue for a club it would be a no-brainer, but obviously without testing the idea out, we won't know. I get that it would be a bit of a risk for anyone to test it though as if it did affect attendances, whoever is trialling it would lose out.

 

Might not have much impact on the home attendance but the away crowd would take a hit IMO. Could just watch it with your mates and a few beers paying for just the one stream then. The club would also lose out on income from match programmes, pie stall, bar etc.

Surely the solution to that is to only allow season ticket holders to stream and not have PPV.

[Nowhereman]

Surely the solution to that is to only allow season ticket holders to stream and not have PPV.

But then you have less people at the game eg a pouring wet day so season ticket holders decide to watch it in the house instead of going along. The club might not suffer financially ( although they miss out on catering etc) but they have less support in the ground which is to their disadvantage

[FifeSons]

8 minutes ago, Nowhereman said:

But then you have less people at the game eg a pouring wet day so season ticket holders decide to watch it in the house instead of going along. The club might not suffer financially ( although they miss out on catering etc) but they have less support in the ground which is to their disadvantage

True.

Maybe offer a ‘streaming only’ season ticket that doesn’t allow you into the ground.

I doubt streaming will be allowed to continue for long when things are back to normal anyway.

Edited November 29, 2020 by FifeSons

[Homer Thompson]

They wont be able to stop streaming for this season even if limited fans go back. Your money and viewing ability is safe.

They will have to stop streaming this season if full crowds are allowed back.

[FifeSons]

1 minute ago, Mr X said:

On 28/11/2020 at 20:33, The Moonster said:

They wont be able to stop streaming for this season even if limited fans go back. Your money and viewing ability is safe.

They will have to stop streaming this season if full crowds are allowed back.

That's what I suspected.

That leaves 'overseas' streaming as the only option. Which would be great, but I can't see us doing it.

[The Moonster]

6 minutes ago, Mr X said:

They will have to stop streaming this season if full crowds are allowed back.

I really don't see full crowds coming back this season at all.

[Homer Thompson]

That's what I suspected.
That leaves 'overseas' streaming as the only option. Which would be great, but I can't see us doing it.

I think it's more likely lower leagues clubs will provide overseas streaming than pre-covid just because the equipment etc will be there.

It will continue for championship clubs through the spfl match centre whether clubs decide to do it themselves or not. Of course that uses pixellot and won't have commentary unless the club's choose to add it.

I really don't see full crowds coming back this season at all.

Neither do I, across all clubs. However, it's possible that the Highland clubs and possibly even Queens will drop into tier 0 before the end of the season.

Unlikely maybe but possible.

And if that does happen those clubs will not be allowed to stream in the UK.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

I dont attend any away games these days but I’d stream them if and when I can. I suspect there would be others out there in the same boat. 

[Homer Thompson]

I dont attend any away games these days but I’d stream them if and when I can. I suspect there would be others out there in the same boat. 

As, I'm sure, would many others.

However, as someone else pointed out there will also be fans, home and away, who would have attended games who will choose to stream instead and in the case of groups of friends or families spend £10 rather than £40 or £50. Local pubs could potential buy a stream and keep fans there who would have gone to the game too.

Its also worth remembering that if streaming is allowed it will be allowed for everyone. How many floating fans would chose to watch an OF stream who might otherwise have come along to watch their local team?

Personally, I have no idea if the net of all this would be beneficial to the clubs or not but I think there's enough doubt in the clubs minds to mean it wont happen.

[Skyline Drifter]

4 minutes ago, Mr X said:

As, I'm sure, would many others.

However, as someone else pointed out there will also be fans, home and away, who would have attended games who will choose to stream instead and in the case of groups of friends or families spend £10 rather than £40 or £50. Local pubs could potential buy a stream and keep fans there who would have gone to the game too.

Its also worth remembering that if streaming is allowed it will be allowed for everyone. How many floating fans would chose to watch an OF stream who might otherwise have come along to watch their local team?

Personally, I have no idea if the net of all this would be beneficial to the clubs or not but I think there's enough doubt in the clubs minds to mean it wont happen.

I'm not sure it would make a massive financial difference one way or the other at Leagues 1 and 2 level to be honest. The further up the leagues you go though the more it would have an effect. There's every chance that entire supporters clubs worth of OF firms for instance would go to their local and watch St Johnstone or Ross County away on a single paid stream than attend the game. It has a potentially massive effect on away attendances. To a lesser extent that's likely to be the case in the Championship too especially when you have the odd occasion at Hearts or Hibs ends up there. Of course as BBPF pointed out there will also be some people who don't travel to away games now because they either have no transport, or no time, or family commitments or can't afford it who might pay £10 for a stream to offset losses from other supporters not going. I'm pretty sceptical those numbers would be the same though.

Quite apart from that, it would be a sad day for football as a spectator sport when we're encouraging people NOT to attend by providing alternatives that enable them to treat a Dumbarton or QoS match like it's Liverpool on the telly. The atmosphere of physically attending is important, both for the spectator but also for the product. What we see with no crowds is an artificial product. The players don't like it.

That clubs can stream abroad (as they always could, but this will lead to more clubs having the infrastructure in place to carry it on post-Covid) is good and fair but it's a problem domestically. Of course it's not realistic to suggest that people living in London or Birmingham can pop to their home games in Dumfries or Dumbarton but where do you draw that line? We have fans who travel from well down South. We have a season ticket holder in Oldham who comes every game, we have fans in Shrewsbury who come 4 or 5 times a season. It's pretty much impossible I assume under current technology to set an arbitrary distance within the UK where you can do it. That being the case, then not allowing it is preferable to allowing it for all.

Personally I'd take a lot of persuading that there is a benefit to clubs in the medium term to allowing streaming even if there are no attendance restrictions.

[Thommo90]

On 27/11/2020 at 15:05, pleslie99 said:

He played a game (or 2) for the accies a couple years ago and was pretty rotund then

Beat me to it, was he not subbed at half time absolutely done?