The Moonster Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 The suggestion that a part time football club moving grounds is in any way comparable with a country deciding whether to govern itself is laughable. Other than there being some folk for it and some folk against it it's not even remotely similar. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Pete Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Stay on your knees everyone! We're just too wee too poor and too stupid. Everybody knows that. f**k off. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Quitely Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 For those who keep tabs on the vibrancy or otherwise of the local retail sector, I'm told this morning that Homebase will be vacating their prime position in St James Retail Park in favour of B & M, a sort of modern Woolworths operation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowhereman Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 For those who keep tabs on the vibrancy or otherwise of the local retail sector, I'm told this morning that Homebase will be vacating their prime position in St James Retail Park in favour of B & M, a sort of modern Woolworths operation. Do they have pick'n'mix? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 For those who keep tabs on the vibrancy or otherwise of the local retail sector, I'm told this morning that Homebase will be vacating their prime position in St James Retail Park in favour of B & M, a sort of modern Woolworths operation. Nothing to do with the local retail sector. It's down to Homebase's fall in profits and a subsequent decision to close a quarter of their stores. The deal with B & M is for most of those stores. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Quitely Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Nothing to do with the local retail sector. It's down to Homebase's fall in profits and a subsequent decision to close a quarter of their stores. The deal with B & M is for most of those stores. I'm well aware of that deal and what's behind it Wilf, but we may well find that the drop in profits is not unrelated to decreasing footfall across lots of local retail sectors, of which Dumbarton is one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Third Son from the Rock Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 The suggestion that a part time football club moving grounds is in any way comparable with a country deciding whether to govern itself is laughable. Other than there being some folk for it and some folk against it it's not even remotely similar. Who suggested that it was comparable? Not me, I just used a phrase which had been used ironically by the Yes campaign and it seemed apt. The main gripes on here about the proposal is that we are a part time football club (too wee) That the area is impoverished and couldn't support a leisure/hospitality/gym development (too poor) and that somehow the thing is likely to fail because it's pie in the sky and hasn't been thought through (too stupid). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thommo90 Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Just a quick point about homebase. The one here is actually one of the most profitable stores across central Scotland. B&m offered 5 million to get that space off them due to the constant profit that the dumbarton store makes every year, and homebase as a whole can't turn that money down. Anyway continue.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Getcooperon Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Who suggested that it was comparable? Not me, I just used a phrase which had been used ironically by the Yes campaign and it seemed apt. The main gripes on here about the proposal is that we are a part time football club (too wee) That the area is impoverished and couldn't support a leisure/hospitality/gym development (too poor) and that somehow the thing is likely to fail because it's pie in the sky and hasn't been thought through (too stupid). Not the reasons I have for being unsure about the proposals. I would prefer more detail and maybe that will come. My main issue is we appear to be moving further down an investor ownership model rather than community ownership. As everybody knows running football clubs as profit seeking businesses is risky and the investor ownership model is usually marked by poor governance, lack of accountability and limited management of risk. I am a supporter of clubs as social institutions mutually owned and controlled by fans. I look at the relocation plans from this standpoint and wonder if they mean we are at a crossroads for the idea of community ownership. This might not be a good enough reason to reject the move proposal but it influences my thinking on it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thechicogibsonexperience Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 Not the reasons I have for being unsure about the proposals. I would prefer more detail and maybe that will come. My main issue is we appear to be moving further down an investor ownership model rather than community ownership. As everybody knows running football clubs as profit seeking businesses is risky and the investor ownership model is usually marked by poor governance, lack of accountability and limited management of risk. I am a supporter of clubs as social institutions mutually owned and controlled by fans. I look at the relocation plans from this standpoint and wonder if they mean we are at a crossroads for the idea of community ownership. This might not be a good enough reason to reject the move proposal but it influences my thinking on it. So I wonder if Brabco proposed the following... "Let us move to the Renton Rd and have a little profit in our back pockets and we'll move control of the club to the supporters (i.e the Sonstrust)." Would folk accept that as a compromise? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Pete Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 So I wonder if Brabco proposed the following... "Let us move to the Renton Rd and have a little profit in our back pockets and we'll move control of the club to the supporters (i.e the Sonstrust)." Would folk accept that as a compromise? If the club was left debt free and handed fully over to the Trust with no conditions then it would be worth it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 Who suggested that it was comparable? Not me, I just used a phrase which had been used ironically by the Yes campaign and it seemed apt. The main gripes on here about the proposal is that we are a part time football club (too wee) That the area is impoverished and couldn't support a leisure/hospitality/gym development (too poor) and that somehow the thing is likely to fail because it's pie in the sky and hasn't been thought through (too stupid). Okay, I'll try and be a bit clearer here. We are a small part-time club and at the moment we're doing well. I fully understand that we'd all like to sustain this level of football for as long as we can and if we can improve income streams that may make that a bit easier. We're not too wee to boost our income streams but we need to be very careful with what we venture into. West Dunbartonshire is one of the poorest areas in Scotland, of course that will have an effect on what facilities are used. People have raised concerns over the assertion that we'll have 52 weddings a year in a fairly undesirable location (compared with some venue's in Balloch/up the Loch), people have raised concerns that there's any demand for a hotel what with a big chain just opened up round the corner from this proposed site. A gym? Aye, it could work, but as we've stated time and time again we need some evidence that these things are viable. I could tell you that a karate class would be full 3 nights every week but until you saw some evidence of that would you not doubt it? As for the too stupid part, well again, as I've stated before - if they can't even give us a rough outline of the cost of each part and expected revenue from each part (after 4 years of planning) then it doesn't seem like the most intelligent business plan to me. We're less than a week to the meeting and I don't expect anything in this respect to be released. "They don't know because they don't know what we'll get for the land". Well if they haven't the foggiest idea of what we'll get for the land how can we possibly plan for a hotel/gym/restaurant and say it will raise much needed cash? I don't doubt there is scope for us to increase our revenue but what I see here is a profit making exercise for our owners and the football club is secondary to their thoughts and for that reason I believe Thechicogibsonexperience has got the preferred end game right in my view. We need to be sure we don't end up with a pile of shite that will cripple us but ultimately get the club into safe hands. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowhereman Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 If the club was left debt free and handed fully over to the Trust with no conditions then it would be worth it. If the club was handed over to the trust then it would have to be fully self financing presumably. There would be no owner in the background to tide us over when we had a couple of poor months income wise. Is that really something that the trust could take on? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweet Pete Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 If the club was handed over to the trust then it would have to be fully self financing presumably. There would be no owner in the background to tide us over when we had a couple of poor months income wise. Is that really something that the trust could take on? I've no idea, that's really a question for the decision makers. However, I've every confidence that with the collective skillset of those involved, the Trust could successfully run the club. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trawler Rum & Weetabix Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 If the club was handed over to the trust then it would have to be fully self financing presumably. There would be no owner in the background to tide us over when we had a couple of poor months income wise. Is that really something that the trust could take on? Why not ? Community ownership need not mean big kids let loose with a train set; there is a broad skill set in both the Trust and wider community, and perhaps the need to remain solvent would direct DFC down a more customer-focused route. Does anyone know just what Brabco are contributing financially at present ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Back Paddy Flannery Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 If the club was handed over to the trust then it would have to be fully self financing presumably. There would be no owner in the background to tide us over when we had a couple of poor months income wise. Is that really something that the trust could take on? Would the current owners tide us over financially if need be? Have they had to so in the past? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 Does anyone know just what Brabco are contributing financially at present ? This was going to be my question, how many times have they had to tide us over in the last 5 years? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DumbartonTerrace Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 Ian Murray will mark two years in charge at Dumbarton tomorrow against Hibernian, the team he served with such distinction as a player. Read The Dumbarton Terrace's 10 key moments of his tenure so far here: http://thedumbartonterrace.wordpress.com/2014/11/21/ian-murray-ten-big-moments/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 This was going to be my question, how many times have they had to tide us over in the last 5 years? As there hasn't been an AGM in some time no one knows. I'd be surprised though if there haven't been some directors' loans over that time. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 When was the last AGM, Wilf? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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