Scottish Independence

[Confidemus]

I must say I'm still totally sickened by the result. The fact that Blair McDougall admitted that fear mongering was the only way No could win, with the press making it a pretty much one sided publicity campaign, then papers like the Daily Record saying we're all nice and cosy again, Labour blatantly lying through their fucking teeth, then changing their tact about the NHS a couple of days later. The tories basically being tories, etc. The way Westminster and the press ran their campaign was utterly despicable. I'm still in shock to be honest.

I can't believe this COUNTRY has fallen for such utter shite. Land of sheep.

It is a fucking sickener is it not?

Possibly the most uneven political playing field in recent history.

[boabinoban]

It is a fucking sickener is it not?

Possibly the most uneven political playing field in recent history.

Totally. It also shows that as much as the vote count was really high, that Scottish people are just happy to skim the surface of the debate, without asking more questions of themselves, the media, government and country as a whole. I'm truly sickened by this 'United' Kingdom.

The fact is that so much of it is completely see through, yet people obviously believe it. Now we're meant to just carry on? Can anyone actually say they trust this establishment any more, or is it more of a case that they just don't give a f**k?

[Confidemus]

Totally. It also shows that as much as the vote count was really high, that Scottish people are just happy to skim the surface of the debate, without asking more questions of themselves, the media, government and country as a whole. I'm truly sickened by this 'United' Kingdom.

The fact is that so much of it is completely see through, yet people obviously believe it. Now we're meant to just carry on? Can anyone actually say they trust this establishment any more, or is it more of a case that they just don't give a f**k?

I watched that odious cow Jackie Baillie in Holyrood yesterday banging on about the "settled will of the Scottish people" and how we should all just get along swimmingly now.

It's a bit like Labour saying pre referendum "The NHS is safe with a No vote", then after the referendum, their new tack is "Save the NHS - vote Labour".

They can't just expect people to forget and move on. Underhand tactics were the single biggest deciding factor in the referendum. And that kind of taint can't easily be forgotten, and it certainly can't be forgiven.

[Taza]

I must say I'm still totally sickened by the result. The fact that Blair McDougall admitted that fear mongering was the only way No could win, with the press making it a pretty much one sided publicity campaign, then papers like the Daily Record saying we're all nice and cosy again, Labour blatantly lying through their fucking teeth, then changing their tact about the NHS a couple of days later. The tories basically being tories, etc. The way Westminster and the press ran their campaign was utterly despicable. I'm still in shock to be honest.

I can't believe this COUNTRY has fallen for such utter shite. Land of sheep.

It is a fucking sickener is it not?

Possibly the most uneven political playing field in recent history.

Totally. It also shows that as much as the vote count was really high, that Scottish people are just happy to skim the surface of the debate, without asking more questions of themselves, the media, government and country as a whole. I'm truly sickened by this 'United' Kingdom.

The fact is that so much of it is completely see through, yet people obviously believe it. Now we're meant to just carry on? Can anyone actually say they trust this establishment any more, or is it more of a case that they just don't give a f**k?

This is all why I think it's important, that there remains a high profile movement and why we should continue to visibly identify ourselves. I've seen all the arguments against the concept of the 45 badge etc but right now I only really want to communicate with Yes voters, as I would my family, if it were a family bereavement. I put a lot of effort and energy into the campaign, which at one point led to hospital and I'm mentally drained. I still wear my Yes badge and find it therapeutic when fellow yes voters - who are strangers to me - engage me in conversation, in shops and on trains etc.

When the No side speak of 'the healing process' they really mean 'the forgetting process' and I for one, am not having it.

[git-intae-thum]

I watched that odious cow Jackie Baillie in Holyrood yesterday banging on about the "settled will of the Scottish people" and how we should all just get along swimmingly now.

It's a bit like Labour saying pre referendum "The NHS is safe with a No vote", then after the referendum, their new tack is "Save the NHS - vote Labour".

They can't just expect people to forget and move on. Underhand tactics were the single biggest deciding factor in the referendum. And that kind of taint can't easily be forgotten, and it certainly can't be forgiven.

Long term the lies, smears and scares of the no camp fully endorsed by a willing media, will ultimately come back to haunt them.

[Henrik's tongue]

I haven't contributed to this sub forum before today. Been reading up on the topics in here over the last few days and found it very interesting. Lots of passion, debate and enthusiasm on show from both sides - with a liberal sprinkling of trolling from some as per. I've never been overtly political in my puff but this referendum engaged me in politics like never before.

I voted Yes mainly due to the fact I have a child under a year old and really, really wanted the wee barra to have the chance to grow up and live life in an iScotland. I understand there were risks and unknowns involved but I am thoroughly sick of being governed by shiny faced toffs from Westminster and have been for many years. I used to support Labour but became very apathetic with them when they became New Labour in the 90's which made them indistinguishable from Tories in my view, but it will be supporting SNP from now on.

I still hope to see an iScotland in my lifetime, but I am convinced my child - and all the children of this generation will see one in theirs.

[Confidemus]

When the No side speak of 'the healing process' they really mean 'the forgetting process' and I for one, am not having it.

Exactly, There's also plenty of No voters on here who would rather we all just shut up about it and moved on.

I even heard some No voters during the campaiging period who were of the opinion that they would rather this nasty independence business would just go away.

f**k them, f**k that and f**k Westminster.

[boabinoban]

I watched that odious cow Jackie Baillie in Holyrood yesterday banging on about the "settled will of the Scottish people" and how we should all just get along swimmingly now.

It's a bit like Labour saying pre referendum "The NHS is safe with a No vote", then after the referendum, their new tack is "Save the NHS - vote Labour".

They can't just expect people to forget and move on. Underhand tactics were the single biggest deciding factor in the referendum. And that kind of taint can't easily be forgotten, and it certainly can't be forgiven.

That's just one of the points that totally and completely fucks me off. The transparent sudden change of tact from the press like nothing ever happened and all of the negativity was just a bad dream.

Scotland is truly like a victim of domestic abuse. Subjugated and broken. Battered by the most negative, self admitted fear mongering and manipulation. And I can't hear anyone questioning it from the No voters, which basically backs up these theories.

Fucking sheep.

[Confidemus]

I still hope to see an iScotland in my lifetime, but I am convinced my child - and all the children of this generation will see one in theirs.

I've got two kids of my own and I am utterly, utterly convinced they would have had a better life in an independent Scotland. Westminster, no matter what extra powers they give us, will continue to hold Scotland back.

[Confidemus]

And I can't hear anyone questioning it from the No voters, which basically backs up these theories.

You won't hear any No supporters question it, because that would be them admitting they are wrong. What you'll get instead are people like H_B using whataboutery, deflection and binary questions to change the topic of conversation.

The No campaign lied and pressurised their way to victory in the most immoral political campaign I've ever witnessed.

[boabinoban]

What I'm really surprised about is how quiet the Yes campaign parties are about it all. Are they actually condoning everything by the establishment? If that's the case then we're truly fucked and not worthy of independence.

[Confidemus]

What I'm really surprised about is how quiet the Yes campaign parties are about it all. Are they actually condoning everything by the establishment? If that's the case then we're truly fucked and not worthy of independence.

I think the official campaign have to be seen to be above it all, to a certain extent. It's all very well us dweebs on the ground bumping our gums, but if Yes Scotland started whinging it would look like all out sour grapes.

I think we just have to suck it up, know we're in the right and put all our energy behind ending Labour in Scotland and getting the maximum powers we can from dishface and Gideon.

It's shit, but good guys don't always win. Certainly not in this case anyway.

ETA: That said, I did see Christine Grahame of the SNP speak after Jackie Baillie yesterday and she did mention the underhand tactics involved. They just can't be as "direct" as we can.

[boabinoban]

You won't hear any No supporters question it, because that would be them admitting they are wrong. What you'll get instead are people like H_B using whataboutery, deflection and binary questions to change the topic of conversation.

The No campaign lied and pressurised their way to victory in the most immoral political campaign I've ever witnessed.

There are also so many No voters that just want things to go back to the way they were, to crawl back under whatever comfort blanket they need, and to forget about the big nasty world of politics. This is why they buckled so easily and ate it all up. There aren't enough enquiring minds, people that want to actually get under the surface and have a truly informed opinion, even out of a lot of Yes voters. This is basically what won it for No. A general public that believes everything it reads in the papers. What a fucking shocking indictment of our own people.

[Anonapersona]

I watched that odious cow Jackie Baillie in Holyrood yesterday banging on about the "settled will of the Scottish people" and how we should all just get along swimmingly now.

It's a bit like Labour saying pre referendum "The NHS is safe with a No vote", then after the referendum, their new tack is "Save the NHS - vote Labour".

They can't just expect people to forget and move on. Underhand tactics were the single biggest deciding factor in the referendum. And that kind of taint can't easily be forgotten, and it certainly can't be forgiven.

History has shown that people vent their anger and then slip back into their normal lives. This is exactly what Westminster expects to happen.

However, we're now living in an era where communication is part of our culture, and that is why the independence campaign will stay alive.

[boabinoban]

I think the official campaign have to be seen to be above it all, to a certain extent. It's all very well us dweebs on the ground bumping our gums, but if Yes Scotland started whinging it would look like all out sour grapes.

I think we just have to suck it up, know we're in the right and put all our energy behind ending Labour in Scotland and getting the maximum powers we can from dishface and Gideon.

It's shit, but good guys don't always win. Certainly not in this case anyway.

ETA: That said, I did see Christine Grahame of the SNP speak after Jackie Baillie yesterday and she did mention the underhand tactics involved. They just can't be as "direct" as we can.

But the rank hypocrisy is unbelievable! The tone of every single fucking news outlet has changed to one of lovely togetherness and nice fluffy reconciliation. If the Yes campaign go along with this, it will make all of those continuing with campaigns and marches look even more out of touch and irrelevant. This is a very dangerous game to play because if you let these people's heads go down we're fucked. Again it's only MSM that are fighting on, which can only lead to an even bigger split due to the now wall to wall fucking pandering shite from the MSM. It's fucking disgraceful and transparent only to those who have enquiring minds.

[Taza]

History has shown that people vent their anger and then slip back into their normal lives. This is exactly what Westminster expects to happen.

However, we're now living in an era where communication is part of our culture, and that is why the independence campaign will stay alive.

Certainly hope so. I will be joining SNP as soon as their site allows, been trying daily. There has to be focus groups, keeping it all together but not just on-line. I intend to check out Radical Indi too. I work in event production and will be looking to try and organise some social/ents stuff. I think building a community network is important and will try to facilitate.

I've spent most of my life wishing for Scotland's Independence and will now spend the rest of my life working for it.

[Banterous]

Certainly hope so. I will be joining SNP as soon as their site allows, been trying daily. There has to be focus groups, keeping it all together but not just on-line. I intend to check out Radical Indi too. I work in event production and will be looking to try and organise some social/ents stuff. I think building a community network is important and will try to facilitate.

I've spent most of my life wishing for Scotland's Independence and will now spend the rest of my life working for it.

Sounds like an indie band with a cult following. Good luck with the cult........

[boabinoban]

Sounds like an indie band with a cult following. Good luck with the cult........

Kwalitae inpoot

[Confidemus]

But the rank hypocrisy is unbelievable! The tone of every single fucking news outlet has changed to one of lovely togetherness and nice fluffy reconciliation. If the Yes campaign go along with this, it will make all of those continuing with campaigns and marches look even more out of touch and irrelevant. This is a very dangerous game to play because if you let these people's heads go down we're fucked. Again it's only MSM that are fighting on, which can only lead to an even bigger split due to the now wall to wall fucking pandering shite from the MSM. It's fucking disgraceful and transparent only to those who have enquiring minds.

Yep, the stench of hypocrisy is palpable.

As Anonapersona alluded to, social media has changed things. The No side could have gotten away with the campaign they've ran in 1979. They could feasibly have gotten away with it in 1997. But with social media so prevalent and people so connected these days, people can spot the hypocrisy and act on it.

And the way we act on it is collectively never giving up on the idea of independence, whilst at the same time making the best of the hand we're dealt at present. And that means ending Labour and getting maximum possible powers for Scotland.

As much as those in the No camp would like it to be the case, independence isn't dead.

[Banterous]

Kwalitae inpoot

I'm pointing out the fact that large political groups either start off or regress to small fanatical groups.

I was being sarcastic but really it's not directed at the poster. It's more being embarrassed for a humiliated and seething campaign leader.