SodjesSixteenIncher Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 very open minded though. I beg to differ. Quite interesting that you have Yes voters down as naive patriots, yet your main reason for voting No is your nationality and you admit to not knowing the facts 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkoRaj Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I just said "a lot of". I drew that conclusion from seeing a lot of posters post similar to what i said, surprisingly. Just giving you some more information, just so you can get a more accurate picture rather than making wild assumptions based on a few posters. You say 'a lot', I can't see a lot tbh. Even on the old folks views thread it's about 50/50 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I beg to differ. Quite interesting that you have Yes voters down as naive patriots, yet your main reason for voting No is your nationality and you admit to not knowing the facts Why do you beg to differ i'm open minded, you've never spoke to me. You're misrepresenting what i've said and trying to mock me, it doesn't do Pie and Bovrils yes group any favours, it just goes further into seeing why i've formed some of the views i have. I don't have "yes voters" down as naive patriots. Some are, you'd be a fool to deny this. I didn't "admit" to not knowing the facts, i don't know all of the facts, i'd be very fucking surprised if anyone on here knew ALL the facts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Reynard/hb or deegas? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 How can we be a valuable and integral part of a Union, and therefore bringing some material assets to the table, but apparently unable to make a go of it by ourselves? I don't think you have enough to go for it alone, i don't think that the campaign is solid enough, maybe it would work, i'm not fully convinced yet, that doesn't stop Scotland being valuable to the union. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jambo-rocker Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 On a personal level and using the people i've spoken to (not a representation of the general populace) i've recieved a lot of venom from the "yes" voters and can't help but feel a great deal of them are misguided with their reason of voting, obviously not all of them. I'm also English and i think Scotland is a very valuable, integral part of the union and i'd rather we stuck together. It's exactly the same from the other sides as well. The part in bold is an opinion, not a reason for voting NO, and a classic quote that has been many times on the NO side, it fools nobody. I get that voting NO for personal reasons, but trying to justify that I, or anyone else should vote the same way you do because it's 'how you feel' does not a substanative reason make. From my limited political knowledge i can't see it being successful, willing to admit their will be a lot of arguments from both sides i'm not entirely clued up on yet though. Also think it's worth noting that Pie and Bovril seems to be a misrepresentation of the general voting public, this website seems very very pro independence. Again, it's an opinion, and based on your admitted limited knowledge. My suggestion would be if you really are as unbiased as you claim to be, might I suggest maybe making your knowledge less limited? I've said this to people before, but it's clear by their lack of motivation to do so that their mind is already made up on the matter. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Just giving you some more information, just so you can get a more accurate picture rather than making wild assumptions based on a few posters. You say 'a lot', I can't see a lot tbh. Even on the old folks views thread it's about 50/50 It wasn't a wild assumption. Thanks for your information though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Reynard/hb or deegas? You left out Mr. Bairn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I don't think you have enough to go for it alone, i don't think that the campaign is solid enough, maybe it would work, i'm not fully convinced yet, that doesn't stop Scotland being valuable to the union. What facts have your considered that have influenced your decision making? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 You left out Mr. Bairn. I was assuming he was deegas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 It's exactly the same from the other sides as well. The part in bold is an opinion, not a reason for voting NO, and a classic quote that has been many times on the NO side, it fools nobody. I get that voting NO for personal reasons, but trying to justify that I, or anyone else should vote the same way you do because it's 'how you feel' does not a substanative reason make. Again, it's an opinion, and based on your admitted limited knowledge. My suggestion would be if you really are as unbiased as you claim to be, might I suggest maybe making your knowledge less limited? I've said this to people before, but it's clear by their lack of motivation to do so that their mind is already made up on the matter It seems like you're trying to tell me i shouldn't use my opinions as reasons to vote... I'm constantly following the debate and seeing facts over it, as i've said i know enough to have chosen to vote "no" if anything new convinces me then that's that, i do have reasoning behind my decision. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I was assuming he was deegas No, DeeGas was far more deranged than that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 What facts have your considered that have influenced your decision making? To be honest i'd say that i would naturally vote no and the onus is on the yes campaign to change my mind. Just from what i've read and seen on general issues, the currency, the EU, military, the god awful tv i'd suffer. Also as i've said the "yes" voters i've encountered and their reasoning for independence is enough to make me unsupportive of their aims. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jambo-rocker Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 (edited) It seems like you're trying to tell me i shouldn't use my opinions as reasons to vote... I'm constantly following the debate and seeing facts over it, as i've said i know enough to have chosen to vote "no" if anything new convinces me then that's that, i do have reasoning behind my decision. You seem to be deflecting from the fact that I just stated that if you want to vote NO for your own personal reasons, then fine. It does not exactly convince me that your personal reasons have any substance to change my mind. I would like to hear these reasons if you do not mind me asking. It don't mind if a person is voting NO, as long as they are open to changing their mind at the same. This is why I will never completely dismiss a NO vote on my end, although I have found myself utterly unconvinced by their arguments of late. Edited December 5, 2013 by the jambo-rocker 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodjesSixteenIncher Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Why do you beg to differ i'm open minded, you've never spoke to me. You're misrepresenting what i've said and trying to mock me, it doesn't do Pie and Bovrils yes group any favours, it just goes further into seeing why i've formed some of the views i have. I don't have "yes voters" down as naive patriots. Some are, you'd be a fool to deny this. I didn't "admit" to not knowing the facts, i don't know all of the facts, i'd be very fucking surprised if anyone on here knew ALL the facts. I beg to differ that you're open minded. You don't know the facts and don't want to know them, because your British nationalism is enough of a reason to vote no. Good luck with whatever you decide and for whatever reason you decide it. Don't bother casting aspersions on Yes voters though if you're going to admit to the same things you hypocritically accuse them of. Save us the "everyone's ganging up on me" pish as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broccoli Dog Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 To be honest i'd say that i would naturally vote no and the onus is on the yes campaign to change my mind. Just from what i've read and seen on general issues, the currency, the EU, military, the god awful tv i'd suffer. These points have all been answered adequately countless times, and TV is shit anyway so don't watch it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 To be honest i'd say that i would naturally vote no and the onus is on the yes campaign to change my mind. Just from what i've read and seen on general issues, the currency, the EU, military, the god awful tv i'd suffer. Also as i've said the "yes" voters i've encountered and their reasoning for independence is enough to make me unsupportive of their aims. You've clearly absorbed a great many of the Better Together talking points but if you're open minded shouldn't you at least attempt to see what the other side is saying? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 You seem to be deflecting from the fact that I just stated that if you want to vote NO for your own personal reasons, then fine. It does not exactly convince me that your personal reasons have any substance to change my mind. I would like to hear these reasons if you do not mind me asking. It don't mind if a person is voting NO, as long as they are open to changing their mind at the same. This is why I will never completely dismiss a NO vote on my end, although I have found myself utterly unconvinced by their arguments of late. Wasn't trying to deflect anything. The reasoning i can be bother to get into is posted above. I'm not going to have much of an argument to convince a yes voter i just don't agree with them, i'm waiting to be convinced by the yes voters rather than convince others to vote no as it doesn't need to be done, the yes vote is the one that needs to muster up support. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 I beg to differ that you're open minded. You don't know the facts and don't want to know them, because your British nationalism is enough of a reason to vote no. Good luck with whatever you decide and for whatever reason you decide it. Don't bother casting aspersions on Yes voters though if you're going to admit to the same things you hypocritically accuse them of. Save us the "everyone's ganging up on me" pish as well. It's scary how well you think you know my views. It's like you're giving me life advice. When did i give you the "everyone's ganging up on me" pish? I have no clue what you're on about. You're amusing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunarC Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 These points have all been answered adequately countless times, and TV is shit anyway so don't watch it. Well they've not been answered to a satisfactory level from what i've seen. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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