Thumper Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 history shows most Scots over many, many years are happy with the current system. The SNP have an outright majority in the Scottish Parliament. This is sub-Bairn levels of wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 The SNP have an outright majority in the Scottish Parliament. Voting for the SNP doesn't mean you support Independence champ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Voting for the SNP doesn't mean you support Independence champ. And voting Labour, Tories or Lib Dem doesn't mean you support the status quo chump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Voting for the SNP doesn't mean you support Independence champ. The argument was that there was not a "growing number of people dissatisfied with the current political system". The landslide which gave the SNP an unprecedented outright majority in the Scottish Parliament plainly contradicts that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 The landslide which gave the SNP an unprecedented outright majority in the Scottish Parliament plainly contradicts that. It doesn't at all. The SNP are part of the current political system. As is the Scottish Parliament, delivered by the Labour Party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crùbag Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 It doesn't at all. The SNP are part of the current political system. As is the Scottish Parliament, delivered by the Labour Party. Then again, everyone is part of the current political system. Your point is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Then again, everyone is part of the current political system. Your point is? That, once again, Thumper is talking absolute gash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Party whose primary political objective is independence achieves landslide victory and overall majority in Parliament. This is an absolutely no way an indication that a growing part of the electorate supports independence. I really think that, in parallel with the Labour Voters for Yes movement, HB should start his own wee SNP Voters for No group. There's a phone box on Morningside Road that's usually vacant on Monday nights if they want to save on booking halls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Party whose primary political objective is independence achieves landslide victory and overall majority in Parliament. This is an absolutely no way an indication that a growing part of the electorate supports independence. I really think that, in parallel with the Labour Voters for Yes movement, HB should start his own wee SNP Voters for No group. There's a phone box on Morningside Road that's usually vacant on Monday nights if they want to save on booking halls. You'd be surprised how many people were won over by the SNP's record between 2007-2011 in tandem with growing disillusionment with Labour. A sizeable number of their 2011 voters will vote No or not vote at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I really think that, in parallel with the Labour Voters for Yes movement, HB should start his own wee SNP Voters for No group. There's a phone box on Morningside Road that's usually vacant on Monday nights if they want to save on booking halls. Polls have shown a large number of SNP voters in the 2011 election will be voting No. The SNP couldn't have won a majority, by relying solely on those who wish Independence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 You'd be surprised how many people were won over by the SNP's record between 2007-2011 in tandem with growing disillusionment with Labour. A sizeable number of their 2011 voters will vote No or not vote at all. I'm well aware that there are people who support the Union but who nonetheless vote SNP on other matters. However, it is ridiculous to suggest that there is no correlation at all between the SNP storming to the sort of majority that shouldn't even have been possible, and support for their primary political objective. As for this being a "sizeable number", it is nonetheless a group that (HB aside) doesn't feel strongly about the issue in the way that those behind Labour for Independence do. I can guarantee you that HB would be sitting on Kirsty Wark's lap on the news tonight if he sent out a press release announcing himself as a "grassroots movement for SNP unionism". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 I'm well aware that there are people who support the Union but who nonetheless vote SNP on other matters. However, it is ridiculous to suggest that there is no correlation at all between the SNP storming to the sort of majority that shouldn't even have been possible, and support for their primary political objective. I'm not sure what your point is here. The reason the SNP won the last SG election is because they were the best party, and the most viable option. Also because they did a good job in the previous Parliament. And Scottish Labour were a bad joke, as they still are. After No win the referendum the SNP will win the next SG election. I'm sure that will blow your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Try to at least show some balance. Redistribution is great when you have money coming in. Do you understand that cutting corporation tax is an investment? It's an investment to tempt new companies to bring jobs here. Jobs we don't currently have. Again this middle class hand wringing obsession with what the rich are getting away with when over a million Scots need help today. It shows a general level of ignorance in you that you can't see the bigger picture for focussing on the wrong thing at the wrong time. In terms of hand wringing - you do realise its the yes side that is playing the distress card daily in terms of austerity. I am not going on and on about the cost of gun licences or what bankers or Prince Charles are getting away with. To give you a chance I will make it simple. The yes side thinks (or is at least making out) that Scotland would prioritise the poor more if it could. From what I can see the indy camp and/or SNP in playing to a Scottish only audience over the last few years to get their way have still did what politicians do and prioritised what is popular with the electorate; and a focus on the poor has not been it. How anyone thinks that will change juts cos of indy is really pushing it. If helping the poor is that popular in Scotland then the SNP would have did that for the last 7 years. The SNP has had powers to do more but has focused on what is popular - that will not magically changed post a potential yes vote. Just about every £ a government spends can be called an investment - if cutting corporation tax brings companies flooding in then its got to be from somewhere or in preference to somewhere - rUK in a lot of cases - do you think they will just stand by whilst the Scottish 'investment' comes good ? really ? you don't think a probable Tory government will be happy to compete with us on that score ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Whataboutery and deflection - the bread and butter of the No voter. You just keep putting your fingers in your ears and shouting "la la la", Tubbs, then you won't feel the weight of your No vote. Not once have you (or others) even sought to try and justify the SG's spending prioritise in this regard. The whataboutery jibe is just like the project fear tag - a card to play when the answers run out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Nope. It's SNP policy, that's all. So a large proportion of yes don't agree with this ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 The SNP have an outright majority in the Scottish Parliament. This is sub-Bairn levels of wrong. Without a majority of votes though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaikuHibee Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 In terms of hand wringing - you do realise its the yes side that is playing the distress card daily in terms of austerity. I am not going on and on about the cost of gun licences or what bankers or Prince Charles are getting away with. To give you a chance I will make it simple. The yes side thinks (or is at least making out) that Scotland would prioritise the poor more if it could. From what I can see the indy camp and/or SNP in playing to a Scottish only audience over the last few years to get their way have still did what politicians do and prioritised what is popular with the electorate; and a focus on the poor has not been it. How anyone thinks that will change juts cos of indy is really pushing it. If helping the poor is that popular in Scotland then the SNP would have did that for the last 7 years. The SNP has had powers to do more but has focused on what is popular - that will not magically changed post a potential yes vote. Just about every £ a government spends can be called an investment - if cutting corporation tax brings companies flooding in then its got to be from somewhere or in preference to somewhere - rUK in a lot of cases - do you think they will just stand by whilst the Scottish 'investment' comes good ? really ? you don't think a probable Tory government will be happy to compete with us on that score ? Labour or Tories. They're not right-wing populists. Get a grip, vote yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45 Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Would it not be possible to cut corporation tax and help the poor by not contributing to Trident and expensive London centric shit like the HS2? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Willie Posted July 21, 2014 Share Posted July 21, 2014 Would it not be possible to cut corporation tax and help the poor by not contributing to Trident and expensive London centric shit like the HS2? ...and the royals and the lords and the.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confidemus Posted July 22, 2014 Author Share Posted July 22, 2014 Not once have you (or others) even sought to try and justify the SG's spending prioritise in this regard. The whataboutery jibe is just like the project fear tag - a card to play when the answers run out. What answers? When faced with the REAL facts, you and other No voters put your fingers in your ears and scream CORPORATION TAX! The Yes side have posed many many questions that the No side either cannot answer, or are too scared to face up to. And this vote? It's about waaay more than the SNP or the current SG. Perhaps if you took the blinkers off you'd see that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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