New clubs in the East of Scotland

[Burnie_man]

You need a Licence to compete in the LL so Pollok won't be applying.

[Robert James]

15 hours ago, stanley said:

How many EoS clubs have floodlights?  

18 EoSL clubs have floodlights

21 EoSL clubs do not have floodlights

Also 3 Lowland clubs still don't have them : Civil Service Strollers, Vale of Leithen & Whitehill Welfare. Given the new SFA licensing rule about floodlights, I would anticipate the Lowland League also making floodlights an entry (membership) requirement - possibly next year ?  In the Highland League floodlights are already compulsory.

[FairWeatherFan]

1 hour ago, GordonS said:

Selkirk's spot has to be filled by application - but it doesn't automatically mean someone goes up from the EoSL to fill it. The SLFL could award it to the team that finish bottom of the LL, or someone from outside the pyramid like Pollok.

As FWF says, if a club comes down into the LL but no-one goes up from it, the second-bottom club in the LL is relegated too (so this season it would be 14th place).

That's not what Rule B4 says though, although the wording isn't clear. Has it been re-written since 2016? http://slfl.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/Scottish-Lowland-Football-League-Rules-Version-10.pdf 

All I know for sure is that bottom is relegated regardless and isn't dependent on anything else. If there's a vacancy they have the right to apply like anyone else.

Second bottom can be relegated if HLC is promoted to the SPFL and SPFL42 is a lowland area club.

However, with this being a rumour mill. A couple of weeks ago there was talk of trying to get a Special General Meeting arranged  for a rule change this year with regards to relegation.

[lithgierose]

2 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

All I know for sure is that bottom is relegated regardless and isn't dependent on anything else. If there's a vacancy they have the right to apply like anyone else.

Second bottom can be relegated if HLC is promoted to the SPFL and SPFL42 is a lowland area club.

However, with this being a rumour mill. A couple of weeks ago there was talk of trying to get a Special General Meeting arranged  for a rule change this year with regards to relegation.

so,linlithgow could apply for the vacant LL spot.is that right ?

[Marten]

2 minutes ago, lithgierose said:

so,linlithgow could apply for the vacant LL spot.is that right ?

Yes, as you are a licensed club you have the right to apply.

[FairWeatherFan]

Just now, lithgierose said:

so,linlithgow could apply for the vacant LL spot.is that right ?

Yeah. I think the general consensus right now is Linlithgow are the prime candidate to be in the Lowland League next year. Just by the fact you're already licensed and challenging for promotion, so two bites at the cherry.

 

[Robert James]

23 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Dalkeith was the only club to come out this early with a public statement. Other than Clydebank, all the other eventual applications weren't really known publicly until March. In fact there was still some guessing over who the original 13 applications were shortly after the March 31st deadline as the EoS were waiting on getting their dues.

It's still very early and with the SJFA telling their members they are in at Tier 6 the circumstances are a little different. What you're seeing now isn't clubs thinking about licensing and accesss to the pyramid, but the likes of the Fauldhouse manager discussing the loss of local games being a reason to apply to the EoS.

Until it's clear that the PWG isn't going to enforce a change, I think the individual clubs will play things close to their chest.

 

Whilst on the subject of Clydebank, it is excellent news that redevelopment work on Holm Park has started.at last. Does anyone know what the estimated completion date is ?

If a West of Scotland League isn't created in time for 2019/20, it has been  stated previously that the Bankies will join the EoSL next season. If so, given their deferred entry last year, will Clydebank be given the 16th place in the new EoSL Premier in 2019/20 ?  The other 15 premier places have been earmarked for the top 5 clubs in each of Conferences A B & C.

 

[Burnie_man]

6 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Yeah. I think the general consensus right now is Linlithgow are the prime candidate to be in the Lowland League next year. Just by the fact you're already licensed and challenging for promotion, so two bites at the cherry.

Once the LL announce what they're doing with regards to filling the "Selkirk" vacancy, I'd be astonished if Linlithgow didn't apply, same with the other play-off contenders (if licenced), to cover themselves if they don't win the play-off.

There is also nothing to stop any other Licenced club applying, eg Blackburn, Girvan, Glasgow Uni........

[Burnie_man]

4 minutes ago, Robert James said:

Whilst on the subject of Clydebank, it is excellent news that redevelopment work on Holm Park has started.at last. Does anyone know what the estimated completion date is ?

If a West of Scotland League isn't created in time for 2019/20, it has been  stated previously that the Bankies will join the EoSL next season. If so, given their deferred entry last year, will Clydebank be given the 16th place in the new EoSL Premier in 2019/20 ?  The other 15 premier places have been earmarked for the top 5 clubs in each of Conferences A B & C.

No, they will take their place as a new club at tier 7

[FairWeatherFan]

13 minutes ago, Robert James said:

Whilst on the subject of Clydebank, it is excellent news that redevelopment work on Holm Park has started.at last. Does anyone know what the estimated completion date is ?

If a West of Scotland League isn't created in time for 2019/20, it has been  stated previously that the Bankies will join the EoSL next season. If so, given their deferred entry last year, will Clydebank be given the 16th place in the new EoSL Premier in 2019/20 ?  The other 15 premier places have been earmarked for the top 5 clubs in each of Conferences A B & C.

 

The EoS has already announced how the EoS Premier will be made up.

Any relegated LL clubs.

Best placed Top 5s.

Best  placed 6th placed clubs if required.

Clydebank don't factor in at all.

[GordonS]

2 hours ago, Marten said:

I admit the wording is unclear, but in B4 it says: "The bottom club will be relegated to the League which will have been decided by the Boards of the three leagues prior to the start of each season" and "If neither of the Champion Clubs meets the criteria there will be no promotion". 

What makes it less clear is the sentence before that is:

"A play-off match will take place between the champion clubs of The East of Scotland Football League and The South of Scotland Football League, if both clubs meet the required criteria, to replace the bottom club in The Scottish Lowland Football League."

Reading the two sentences together, it could be that they mean the bottom club is only replaced by a promoted club.

2 hours ago, Robert James said:

Surely not Pollok, nor any other West Region junior club (except Girvan, who are already licensed) can be promoted by application, as they aren't currently in the pyramid, and don't have an SFA licence - which I thought was essential to play in the Lowland League ?  

However the Licensing Committee meeting on 12 February could award up to a dozen new licences to existing pyramid clubs,  who applied before 1st January 2019.  

Pollok could get a licence and rent Hampden or something. Point I was (badly) making was that the LL can look beyond the SoS and the EoS for applications. 

1 hour ago, lithgierose said:

so,linlithgow could apply for the vacant LL spot.is that right ?

Yes and as others have said we'd be in a strong position.

But I wonder if league position might influence the LL's decision. If we did't win the conference, and two or three licensed clubs made the play-offs, we could be behind them. Bonnyrigg are clear favourites to win the EoS but achieving second place could give us a very strong argument ahead of other clubs when the applications open.

[Robert James]

1 hour ago, FairWeatherFan said:

The EoS has already announced how the EoS Premier will be made up.

Any relegated LL clubs.

Best placed Top 5s.

Best  placed 6th placed clubs if required.

Clydebank don't factor in at all.

Thanks for clarifying the rules.

It is perhaps  unfortunate therefore, that Clydebank can't be granted a special dispensation to take the 16th EoSL premier slot next season , as they applied last year when all  junior clubs joining the EoSL were guaranteed entry at Tier 6  level ?   The (west) debacle last year about the SJFA allegedly joining the pyramid at Tier 5 or 6 (as claimed), and problems arising from that, meant that it was not the fault of the clubs that it couldn't join the EoSL in 2018/19. In consequence, they were granted (and apparently accepted) a deferred entry instead.

 

[GNU_Linux]

@Robert James

Work on Holm Park is set to be complete by May. Yoker are groundsharing with Benburb at New Tinto for rest of the season.

[Robert James]

1 minute ago, GNU_Linux said:

@Robert James

Work on Holm Park is set to be complete by May. Yoker are groundsharing with Benburb at New Tinto for rest of the season.

Wow, if you mean May this year !

That is excellent news for both clubs.c

[Burnie_man]

7 minutes ago, Robert James said:

Thanks for clarifying the rules.

It is perhaps  unfortunate therefore, that Clydebank can't be granted a special dispensation to take the 16th EoSL premier slot next season , as they applied last year when all  junior clubs joining the EoSL were guaranteed entry at Tier 6  level ?   The (west) debacle last year about the SJFA allegedly joining the pyramid at Tier 5 or 6 (as claimed), and problems arising from that, meant that it was not the fault of the clubs that it couldn't join the EoSL in 2018/19. In consequence, they were granted (and apparently accepted) a deferred entry instead.

 

I'm not sure the club who just misses out on an EoS Premier place would be happy at Clydebank being handed a place instead!

[Robert James]

1 minute ago, Burnie_man said:

I'm not sure the club who just misses out on an EoS Premier place would be happy at Clydebank being handed a place instead!

I am sure you are right. 

Given what happened last year, it is nevertheless a shame for Clydebank, although the Holm Park news should be some consolation.

[FairWeatherFan]

20 minutes ago, Robert James said:

Thanks for clarifying the rules.

It is perhaps  unfortunate therefore, that Clydebank can't be granted a special dispensation to take the 16th EoSL premier slot next season , as they applied last year when all  junior clubs joining the EoSL were guaranteed entry at Tier 6  level ?   The (west) debacle last year about the SJFA allegedly joining the pyramid at Tier 5 or 6 (as claimed), and problems arising from that, meant that it was not the fault of the clubs that it couldn't join the EoSL in 2018/19. In consequence, they were granted (and apparently accepted) a deferred entry instead.

 

Clydebank went with the calculated risk of a deferred application probably thinking the west would be sorted before ever having to join.

Dundonald tried to do something similar. Defer for a year and hope things get sorted. Then the moves to the EoS kept coming and they moved this year.

[Marten]

58 minutes ago, GordonS said:

What makes it less clear is the sentence before that is:

"A play-off match will take place between the champion clubs of The East of Scotland Football League and The South of Scotland Football League, if both clubs meet the required criteria, to replace the bottom club in The Scottish Lowland Football League."

Reading the two sentences together, it could be that they mean the bottom club is only replaced by a promoted club.

I understand what you mean and I agree it could be clearer, but this rule doesn't say that the bottom club won't be replaced by another club if there is no licensed champion. Taking into account what's written lower down, that any vacancies get filled by application, I guess that can also apply if not having a licensed champion creates a vacancy.

[grinderbrokeyourhearts]

Yes and as others have said we'd be in a strong position.
But I wonder if league position might influence the LL's decision. If we did't win the conference, and two or three licensed clubs made the play-offs, we could be behind them. Bonnyrigg are clear favourites to win the EoS but achieving second place could give us a very strong argument ahead of other clubs when the applications open.

You could argue that the Rose have taken the hit on the park already by spending our cash on the ground.

That will probably be taken into account over league position. Bonnyrigg have a very strong squad as a result of investing that Hibs windfall in the team. If we'd done the same instead of floodlights we'd be in a better position on the park.

If it's a licensing application I'd be really surprised if Linlithgow don't get it as currently (I think) we are the most licensed non league team? Ie the highest ground specs.

[Fife Journeyman]

You could argue that the Rose have taken the hit on the park already by spending our cash on the ground.

That will probably be taken into account over league position. Bonnyrigg have a very strong squad as a result of investing that Hibs windfall in the team. If we'd done the same instead of floodlights we'd be in a better position on the park.

If it's a licensing application I'd be really surprised if Linlithgow don't get it as currently (I think) we are the most licensed non league team? Ie the highest ground specs.

Why should Linlithgow be worthy of a place because you have the highest ground spec.?. Every club at non league level who will have a licence by the summer all have entry level licence so all the same but let's promote Linlithgow on the grounds of best ground and decent fan base. I have a feeling this may happen but it shouldn't.
What about the whole structure of the club Ie. Youth teams , Disabled fan policies and all the other stuff that comes with a licence not just ground criteria.
Why haven't Linlithgow, Penicuik or Bonyrigg got teams in the under 20s development league?.Surely if they have aspirations of playing LL and all currently favourites for there conferences this needs to be addressed.