Fullerene Posted February 15, 2020 Share Posted February 15, 2020 13 minutes ago, MixuFixit said: Dunno, just picked it as a time from now when Stuart Campbell will be dead, today's 18 year olds will have houses and families and brexit will be a memory, all of which could be equally good or bad for Labour. Fair enough but if Harold Wilson said "a week is a long time in politics" then 20 years is an eternity. Personally I think it better to say "not going to change anytime soon" than state an actual number of years. Anyway I suggest we meet up in 2040 to discuss whether or not you were right. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted February 15, 2020 Share Posted February 15, 2020 25 minutes ago, MixuFixit said: Dunno, just picked it as a time from now when Stuart Campbell will be dead, today's 18 year olds will have houses and families and brexit will be a memory, all of which could be equally good or bad for Labour. What's the plan? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted February 15, 2020 Share Posted February 15, 2020 I see the takeaway from today's Glasgow hustings is that for Labour to form a future UK Government it will need to carry Scotland.As a former Labour voter I'm really struggling to see how any of today's leadership candidates will remotely achieve that.It’s like John Cena coming out with the hometown team’s cap on, its just playing to the gallery. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted February 15, 2020 Share Posted February 15, 2020 37 minutes ago, MixuFixit said: Nothing he's in his 50s now and posts between transbashing about eating sweeties and chinese takeaways. f**k me. I remember when he was a teenager. I'm away to lie down and cry about how old I am. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theroadlesstravelled Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 6 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said: I see the takeaway from today's Glasgow hustings is that for Labour to form a future UK Government it will need to carry Scotland. As a former Labour voter I'm really struggling to see how any of today's leadership candidates will remotely achieve that. Labour are so insipid and characterless. If they lost places like Sedgefield to the Tories then they have bigger issues that winning seats from the SNP. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sophia Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 The job of the leader of her majesty's permanent opposition is being debated on channel 4. Starmer is miles ahead. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sophia Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 Best labour leader of the last fifty years? ... Long-Bailey; Clement Atttlee 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lambies Doos Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 The job of the leader of her majesty's permanent opposition is being debated on channel 4. Starmer is miles ahead.Nandy doing well, borderline wid too.Bailey is appalling 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 35 minutes ago, Grahame said: Did you grow up with him? He's from Stirling, right? No, but I've no doubt he'd have been the biggest clipe in any classroom. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted February 17, 2020 Share Posted February 17, 2020 On 16/02/2020 at 00:56, Theroadlesstravelled said: Labour are so insipid and characterless. If they lost places like Sedgefield to the Tories then they have bigger issues that winning seats from the SNP. Labour lost Sedgefield because they allowed the Tories to define patriotism (in England at least) as "getting Brexit done". Apparently the EU were as bad as the Nazis or something like that and Labour were a bunch of appeasers. It was less about Labour's position during the election than about Labour's ambivalence during the EU referendum itself that destroyed Labour. As an individual I am allowed to be unsure whether the EU is a good thing or a bad thing. As a political party that is there to assess these things 24/7 it was totally unacceptable for the Labour Party to be ambivalent about the issue. If leaving the EU was such a bad idea then why did they not say so at the time and forcefully at that. Clumsy dithering and indecision became a hallmark of the party. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted February 18, 2020 Share Posted February 18, 2020 Long-Bailey comes across far better than Corbyn, that’s for sure and may have even stood a chance without the Momentum influence. But the influence from the likes of Lansman and Zarb is too obvious at times. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 On 18/02/2020 at 20:09, BerwickMad said: Long-Bailey comes across far better than Corbyn, that’s for sure and may have even stood a chance without the Momentum influence. But the influence from the likes of Lansman and Zarb is too obvious at times. Coming across better than the worst opposition leader in history - bit of a low bar, that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Thinking ahead, Labour are rooked whatever direction they try. Take Starmer. Easily the most electable of the three. With him in charge, I imagine they'll regain a fair few seats at the next election. But he won't win. Labour being Labour, they'll decide that the problem was that he wasn't lefty enough for the country and replace him with another puritan. This Tory government is going to go on at least as long as the Thatcher-Major one. Long-Bailey - well, if they go for her then in 2024 it'll just be a repeat of 2019. She is hopeless. Nandy - no chance of her winning now. Maybe in future? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 1 hour ago, scottsdad said: Thinking ahead, Labour are rooked whatever direction they try. Take Starmer. Easily the most electable of the three. With him in charge, I imagine they'll regain a fair few seats at the next election. But he won't win. Labour being Labour, they'll decide that the problem was that he wasn't lefty enough for the country and replace him with another puritan. This Tory government is going to go on at least as long as the Thatcher-Major one. Long-Bailey - well, if they go for her then in 2024 it'll just be a repeat of 2019. She is hopeless. Nandy - no chance of her winning now. Maybe in future? You are ignoring Events. Such as when the Brexit transition ends and everything hasn't gone as smoothly as expected. Or the unicorns don't arrive. Or maybe other events that nobody is thinking about. Labour needs a leader that non-Labour voters don't mind. That does not mean they have to be Tory Lite. It does require a leader with the occasional positive approval rating from time to time. The Tories under May imploded but Corbyn was more unpopular so they survived. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 May was so unpopular she got 14m votes! The Labour slide between June 2017 and December 2019 was down to a lot of factors but Corbyn didn't change and the only Labour policy that changed was Brexit. Also anyone who says Corbyn is the worst LOTO ever should be roundly ignored. They are either mindlessly parroting right wing talking points or are brain damaged to the extent they don't remember IDS, Hague or Howard. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICTJohnboy Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 4 hours ago, scottsdad said: Thinking ahead, Labour are rooked whatever direction they try. Take Starmer. Easily the most electable of the three. With him in charge, I imagine they'll regain a fair few seats at the next election. But he won't win. Labour being Labour, they'll decide that the problem was that he wasn't lefty enough for the country and replace him with another puritan. This Tory government is going to go on at least as long as the Thatcher-Major one. Long-Bailey - well, if they go for her then in 2024 it'll just be a repeat of 2019. She is hopeless. Nandy - no chance of her winning now. Maybe in future? FFS, please don't say things like that. I'm depressed enough with this government as it is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 The Tories are going to govern til 2100 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlion Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 Corbyn was ineffectual, and he couldn’t afford to be, given how much a hostile media was coming after him. He appeared to think the electorate wanted a calm, detached, and measured figure in a time of upheaval and played up to that, to his cost. But ultimately the yokels of Englandshire (and by this I mean those who voted Tory and Brexit) simply wanted a leader who would endorse all their views, tell them everything would be great, and tell them that nothing they thought, no matter how ignorant or xenophobic, was wrong. The last election was a popularity contest hinged primarily on appeasing angry Brexit voters who had been whipped into a frenzy by the ticking clock. They wanted easy answers and Boris - and fair play to the c**t - realised that and provided them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlion Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 3 minutes ago, ICTJohnboy said: FFS, please don't say things like that. I'm depressed enough with this government as it is. He’s right, though. The Tories will pander to the right wing working classes at a social level whilst benefitting their pals and donors (as always) at an economic level. When the economy tanks they’ll blame the evil EU for not kowtowing to English might and so won’t even suffer electorally for it. Labour, meanwhile, will argue amongst Labour, hoping that the Tories will damage themselves enough that they can slide into power (though probably refusing to understand why that’s not happening). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DublinMagyar Posted February 21, 2020 Share Posted February 21, 2020 FFS, please don't say things like that. I'm depressed enough with this government as it is.Longer probably 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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