Fullerene Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 2 hours ago, oaksoft said: Then how do you explain the SNP repeatedly beating Labour up here over the last decade or so? You could hardly accuse the media up here of being SNP advocates. Quite the opposite. Look, the point is that you can either obsess over things which are not going your way or you can create your own agenda. The SNP did that and Labour should be looking to see how they did it. Unless the old dog really isn't interested in new tricks and simply wants to remain a protest party. I think the media down in England is more savage than elsewhere and not just towards politicians. Members of the royal family, celebrities, social workers and almost anyone. I think that influences opinion more than any papers in Scotland can. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
git-intae-thum Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 6 hours ago, Malky3 said: Not on the evidence of the Nationalists on this forum....... With you being one of the forums biggest nationalists....I would tend to agree. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 What a parody you are [emoji13][emoji38][emoji38][emoji1787][emoji1787]Says the tamo reincarnation. Jeezo. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted January 25, 2020 Share Posted January 25, 2020 It's a matter of fact proportionally more people are educated to a higher degree in Scotland.I think the quality of the Scottish independence debate shows that you have a point. Andrew Marr on the eve of the referendum said that Scotland could be considered to be the most politically switched on electorate in the world (words to that effect). Compare that to the quality of the brexit debate. Shudder. It's a slim difference (obviously) but I think it does exist. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 Think the indy movement unjustly wanks itself off about how politically switched on and engaged it is because their main comparisons are braindead zoomers like the guy above and the standard of the Brexit debate. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 The vast majority of indy supporters come across as ‘zoomers’ I’m afraid. It’s part of the reason they can’t expand their support for it, due to the aggressive and unwelcoming nature of Nats. If you don’t agree with Nats, they insult you, and if you insult somebody they are unlikely to join your cause. The expansion in support for Scottish independence in the last 20 years is incredible. There are a fair number of zoomers in amongst them, but imo the public debate in 2014 was won by the side that inevitably lost the vote. There are reasons for that, but it's very much bedtime. Sleep tight, tamo. For what it's worth I think you add something to this part of the forum - so try not to be too controversial. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieThomas Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 SNP lads: We're very clever Kid on P&B whose only motivation is to bam c***s up: I think SNP lads are daft SNP lads: HOLY f**k LET ME RESPOND TO YOU IN TRIPLICATE EVERY SINGLE TIME YOU POST Aye, absolute geniuses. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky3 Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 (edited) 20 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said: Totally Agree. That fact has been clearly established by Scotland being the richest part of the UK outside London and the south-east, even when we exclude our oil and gas wealth. Scotland would have been ranked 14th in the OECD in terms of output per head in 2012 and among the richest in the world in terms of gross national income. The CPPR's figures show that even on its lowest assessment Scotland would be in the top 20 of the OECD in terms of wealth per head. On Scottish government figures Scotland would be wealthier per head than France, Japan and the UK. In 2012!!! Dear oh dear! Heres what the CPPR said in 2014 about those figures that the SNP had b*****dised. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10717593/Economists-attack-Alex-Salmonds-skewed-oil-figures.html Edited January 26, 2020 by Malky3 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky3 Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 7 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said: Dearie me! Yesterday's march was populated by a cross section of Scottish society of all ages, some in wheelchairs and many young mums pushing prams none I came across were 'zoomers' but all were decent average Scots dedicated to the cause. And many travelled from all parts of the country on a cold wintry January day such is their commitment. I have yet to see any semblance of a Unionist march in Scotland. Independence is inevitable. There is no need for those of us who don't wish to destroy our country to cause disruption to peoples lives by blocking off streets, frustrating traffic and public access. We are more than happy to leave that silly nonsense to the braindead cultists of the Nationalist movement. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arsenal till I die Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 On 24/01/2020 at 19:21, Blinky said: The biggest thing I saw with Corbyn is that he was a shambolic leader with no sense of control over issues. Sat on the fence and changed his mind too many times over Brexit and the 2nd Referendum. He lost all idea of what the actual working man was (he seemed to think benefit-scroungers and people with no intention to work were working class). His manifesto ranged from bonkers to utterly unnecessary with some of it falling under both of those, renationalising the railway for a start, an utterly incomprehensible proposal that would completely shaft the UK railways. Despite common excuses from Labour supporters, Johnson has recieved pretty poor media and social media coverage on the whole, and has definitely recieved a more varied personal smear than Corbyn has. Corbyn simply wasn’t good enough, shown by his overwhelming democratic loss. I'll accept much of the manifesto and Corbyn had major flaws while your claim about smears has been answered in pretty much the next post. However, as far as the railways go, privatisation has made rail travel a museum which was steam travel in my day (and I'm in the Labour voting 35-44 age bracket). A man famously flew to Germany and back because the train journey between the 2 points in England would have been more expensive. This is clearly not sustainable, not for people, not for the environment, not for the planet. Money that should be invested in the economy (including the railways) is being paid to shareholders and executives. We can't afford NOT to renationalise something which even Thatcher didn't privatise. And it wouldn't be bought out - the franchises would simply be allowed to expire. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 You clearly have very little idea at how bad nationalised rail in this country was and how bad the current government rail projects have gone/are going.You're in your 20s chief - neither do you! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 And the cost has now rocketed to near £20 Billion for a 15 mile London Railway. And will cost Scotland approximately £2 Billion. About the same as the new Forth Bridge. That's how ridiculous the unionist position in 21st century Scotland is. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted January 26, 2020 Share Posted January 26, 2020 You're in your 20s chief - neither do you! I went on the my first train in years to Glasgow last month and a return from Ayr to Glasgow cost me 14 quid. Thats why I'll never use trains regularly whether it's ScotRail, Abellio or the Scottish government. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin_Nevis Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 I thought Labour had run out of foots to shoot themselves in, but nope [emoji23] Another leadership candidate, another hopeless c**t. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theroadlesstravelled Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 50 minutes ago, Day of the Lords said: I thought Labour had run out of foots to shoot themselves in, but nope Another leadership candidate, another hopeless c**t. Another mouth that thinks attacking SNP is going to garner votes. Has that ever worked? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottsdad Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 Back to the Labour leadership. Can anyone explain to me the point of Rebecca Long Bailey? No charisma, no ideas. Comes across as very light (no gravitas at all). I am not one to go in to candidate looks but she seems to scowl all the time, and she wears jackets made for someone three times her size. . This is not good. If she wins Labour are toast for years to come. Lisa Nandy: never heard of her before this but comes across well. Would add: a bit of a wid. Emily Thornberry: nope, another loser. I cannot see how she appeals to anyone. Kier Starmer: the best of a bad bunch. Gravitas and a sharp mind. There is something about him that seems really old fashioned though. if you showed me a photo of him and said "this guy was a Labour politician in 1965" I would believe you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 There's something about Kier Starmer that sends me to sleep, he was on the radio this morning, as bland as John Major with that slightly nasal earnest whine. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted January 27, 2020 Share Posted January 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Blinky said: Starmer is another Joe Biden situation. Where Biden is the best of a bad bunch on Democrats, comes across reasonably well but ultimately has zero chance of winning an election. As a Conservative voter I’d be most worried about Nandy. She seems like a decent politician, comes across well and I can even buy into a number of her ideas. Rebecca Wrong-Daily and Thornberry are absolute lunatics. Labour would lose more heavily than Corbyn with them in charge. You are forgetting that Boris Johnson is unpopular - but not as unpopular as Corbyn. You are also assuming Brexit will be a success story and everything will go right for Johnson. Corbyn had a lot of baggage. He was seen as a career protestor and not as someone who really wanted to be prime minister. If any of them can be more effective at PMQs than Corbyn was then that might change things. Also the role of Prime Minister-in-waiting needs to start immediately as soon as whoever becomes leader. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky3 Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 9 hours ago, Fullerene said: You are forgetting that Boris Johnson is unpopular - but not as unpopular as Corbyn. You are also assuming Brexit will be a success story and everything will go right for Johnson. Corbyn had a lot of baggage. He was seen as a career protestor and not as someone who really wanted to be prime minister. If any of them can be more effective at PMQs than Corbyn was then that might change things. Also the role of Prime Minister-in-waiting needs to start immediately as soon as whoever becomes leader. Johnson is unpopular? Really? He's literally just secured the biggest Conservative majority since 1987 His party polled just under 14m votes - up 300,000 from Theresa Mays win in 2017 and up nearly 4 million votes on when David Cameron won the election in 2015. Both Johnson and May received around 3m more votes than Tony Blair did when he secured Labours thumping majority in 2001 and he's received over 800,000 more votes than Margaret Thatcher got in 1983 just after the victory in the Falklands war and 200,000 more votes than when Thatcher won in 1987. Indeed as far as I can make out - and I've gone back to before the 1st World War - Boris Johnson won more votes than any other Prime Minister in UK history! But you think he's unpopular. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malky3 Posted January 28, 2020 Share Posted January 28, 2020 (edited) Just to back up what I said earlier here's a table showing Prime Ministers and the number of votes their parties got to elect them. Boris Johnson's Conservative Party win in 2019 polled the second most votes in UK history for a Prime Minister. The only PM to do better was John Major in 1992. Yet still some daft people think Johnson is hugely unpopular. 2019 - Boris Johnson - 13,966,451 2017 - Theresa May - 13,636,684 2015 - David Cameron - 11,334,226 2010 - David Cameron - 10,703,754 2005 - Tony Blair - 9,552,436 2001 - Tony Blair - 10,724,953 1997 - Tony Blair - 13,518,167 1992 - John Major - 14,093,007 1987 - Margaret Thatcher - 13,760,583 1983 - Margaret Thatcher - 13,012,316 1979 - Margaret Thatcher - 13,697,923 1974 - Harold Wilson - 11,457,079 1974 - Harold Wilson - 11,645,616 (actually won more seats with fewer votes than Ted Heath who got 11,872,180) 1970 - Ted Heath - 13,145,123 1966 - Harold Wilson - 13,096,951 1964 - Harold Wilson - 12,205,808 1959 - Harold MacMillan - 13,750,875 1955 - Sir Anthony Eden - 13,310,891 1951 - Sir Winston Churchill - 13,717,851 (won more seats with fewer votes than Clement Attlee who had 13,948,385) 1950 - Clement Attlee - 13,226,176 1945 - Clement Attlee - 11,967,746 1935 - Stanley Baldwin - 10,025,083 1931 - Stanley Baldwin - 11,377,022 1929 - Ramsey MacDonald - 8,048,968 (won more seats with fewer votes than Stanley Baldwin who had 8,252,527) 1924 - Stanley Baldwin - 7,418,983 And in Scotland the SNP polled fewer votes than 11 other general election results in Scotland. Yet the same daft people seem to think that the SNP and Nicola Sturgeons popularity is unparalleled and is indicative of a strong desire for Scots to want to leave the United Kingdom. In 2019 the SNP got 1,242,380 votes In 1997 Tony Blair bettered that in Scotland winning 1,283,350 Scottish votes In 1987 Neil Kinnock bettered that in Scotland winning 1,258,135 Scottish votes In 1966 Harold Wilson bettered that in Scotland winning 1,273.916 Scottish votes In 1964 Harold Wilson bettered that in Scotland winning 1,283,667 Scottish votes In 1959 both Harold MacMillan and Hugh Gaitskell beat that in Scotland winning 1,260,286 and 1,245,255 respectively. In 1955 Sir Anthony Eden beat that in Scotland winning 1,274,942 Scottish votes In 1951 Sir Winston Churchill and Clement Attlee beat that in Scotland winning 1,349,298 and 1,330,244 Scottish votes respectively In 1950 Clement Attlee beat that in Scotland winning 1,259,410 Scottish votes In 1931 Stanley Baldwin beat that in Scotland winning 1,385,385 Scottish votes Edited January 28, 2020 by Malky3 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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