MacDuffman Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 Mandela grandson gives it to the Jewshttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/11/grandfather-nelson-mandela-apartheid-parallels-israel-palestinian 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdog Posted October 12, 2018 Author Share Posted October 12, 2018 6 hours ago, Granny Danger said: It won’t be enforced by the NZ courts, but it will be interesting to see if a similar thing happens in the US. Imagine if apartheid South Africa had tried to pull a stunt like this. I think it could get very interesting when Israel host the next Eurovision song contest, there will be massive pressure on some countries to boycott. In the last few years due to BDS there have been several artists pulled out . -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 12 hours ago, Granny Danger said: It won’t be enforced by the NZ courts, but it will be interesting to see if a similar thing happens in the US. Imagine if apartheid South Africa had tried to pull a stunt like this. The South Africans bombed Joe Slovoes's wife, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruth_First fitted up Peter Hain for arrest http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/april/9/newsid_2523000/2523609.stm Went a bit further than court rulings. But any country worth its salt would ignore this court order. I do not support cultural or academic boycotts against the citizens of any regime as individual artists and academics can have a huge amount to offer society. That goes for Iran, North Korea, Turkey, China and other countries with dubious human rights records. I have no problem with people following economic boycotts against countries they feel necessary though boycotting Israeli companies and not Turkish for example would be very questionable (both have long running, bloody internal conflicts, both occupy land taken by force) -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 1 hour ago, dorlomin said: The South Africans bombed Joe Slovoes's wife, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruth_First fitted up Peter Hain for arrest http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/april/9/newsid_2523000/2523609.stm Went a bit further than court rulings. But any country worth its salt would ignore this court order. I do not support cultural or academic boycotts against the citizens of any regime as individual artists and academics can have a huge amount to offer society. That goes for Iran, North Korea, Turkey, China and other countries with dubious human rights records. I have no problem with people following economic boycotts against countries they feel necessary though boycotting Israeli companies and not Turkish for example would be very questionable (both have long running, bloody internal conflicts, both occupy land taken by force) At least for once you have responded rather than just red dotting posts on this thread. Thats progress of a kind I suppose. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 4 minutes ago, Granny Danger said: At least for once you have responded rather than just red dotting posts on this thread. Thats progress of a kind I suppose. Your capacity to engage substantively is obviously limited. But at least you and the holocaust denier "JDog" aka "The King" are on the same page. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 41 minutes ago, dorlomin said: Your capacity to engage substantively is obviously limited. But at least you and the holocaust denier "JDog" aka "The King" are on the same page. I’m not a holocaust denier. I am convinced the holocaust happened and am sadly disappointed that a group of people who, and whose ancestors who, experienced such an horrific experience are prepared to inflict such draconian measures on others. Maybe people don’t learn from history after all. You, on the other hand, are someone who denies the apartheid nature of Israel. You probably opposed those who boycotted apartheid South Africa. Or should I say you were on the same page as them. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BawWatchin Posted October 12, 2018 Share Posted October 12, 2018 1 hour ago, dorlomin said: Your capacity to engage substantively is obviously limited. But at least you and the holocaust denier "JDog" aka "The King" are on the same page. You're a modern day holocaust denier. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdog Posted October 13, 2018 Author Share Posted October 13, 2018 10 hours ago, Granny Danger said: At least for once you have responded rather than just red dotting posts on this thread. Thats progress of a kind I suppose. I thought it was just me!...seems to follow me around the site, red dotting me 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 On 10/12/2018 at 14:08, MacDuffman said: Mandela grandson gives it to the Jewshttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/11/grandfather-nelson-mandela-apartheid-parallels-israel-palestinian No he gives it to Israel and it's a little worrying that you don't understand the difference. Noam Chomsky and Norman Finkelstein are examples of Jewish intellectuals who would probably make similar comments. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDuffman Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 No he gives it to Israel and it's a little worrying that you don't understand the difference. Noam Chomsky and Norman Finkelstein are examples of Jewish intellectuals who would probably make similar comments.[/url] Seeing as it's the Jews in Israel that are persecuting and murdering non Jews then I'll stick with calling them Jews. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 I don’t think we should pander to the “anti-Zionism = anti-Semitism” brigade, but we should be clear in who we are criticising. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 13, 2018 Share Posted October 13, 2018 1 hour ago, MacDuffman said: Seeing as it's the Jews in Israel that are persecuting and murdering non Jews then I'll stick with calling them Jews. Coming from a Christian family I feel personally responsible for the Holocaust, the Iraq War and Trump's abduction and imprisonment of Mexican babies and children. Not really, obviously, but blaming the actions of the Israeli Government on "The Jews" is just as daft. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 I don’t think we should pander to the “anti-Zionism = anti-Semitism” brigade, but we should be clear in who we are criticising. The problem is though that there are antisemites who do use antizionism as a cloak to hide behind - we have one on this forum who has been binned before and returned under a new alias.You know my views on this - anti-zionisim is a perfectly legitimate viewpoint to take and has a long proud tradition - it's when some anti-zionists take the friend of my enemy approach to give blanket support to anyone who opposes Israel that I have a real concern about. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted October 15, 2018 Share Posted October 15, 2018 14 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said: The problem is though that there are antisemites who do use antizionism as a cloak to hide behind - we have one on this forum who has been binned before and returned under a new alias. You know my views on this - anti-zionisim is a perfectly legitimate viewpoint to take and has a long proud tradition - it's when some anti-zionists take the friend of my enemy approach to give blanket support to anyone who opposes Israel that I have a real concern about. All valid points. There are those who oppose Israel whose views are as abhorrent as that of the Israeli government. However whilst the MSM together with vocal pro Zionist politicians in the U.K. are only too willing to decry these people there is not the same scrutiny of the actions of the Israeli government and the IDF. Criticism of the apartheid regime in South Africa and actions against them grew over a period of time until that regime became unsustainable. There is no sign of this with the oppressive Zionist regime in Israel; quite the opposite sadly. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 18, 2018 Share Posted October 18, 2018 Israel doesn't give a f**k anymore, bragging about their longer life expectancy versus Palestinians. https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Report-By-2040-Israelis-lifespan-will-soar-Palestinians-to-drop-most-569733 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdog Posted October 19, 2018 Author Share Posted October 19, 2018 (edited) 7 hours ago, welshbairn said: Israel doesn't give a f**k anymore, bragging about their longer life expectancy versus Palestinians. https://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Report-By-2040-Israelis-lifespan-will-soar-Palestinians-to-drop-most-569733 Anymore? In other news, Israel looking to jail anyone who boycotts them! https://www.haaretz.com/amp/israel-news/.premium-israeli-ministers-to-talk-bill-calling-to-imprison-bds-activists-for-up-to-7-years-1.6572953?__twitter_impression=true Edited October 19, 2018 by Jdog 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 On 12/10/2018 at 13:08, MacDuffman said: Mandela grandson gives it to the Jewshttps://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/oct/11/grandfather-nelson-mandela-apartheid-parallels-israel-palestinian He is not "giving it to the Jews". He is criticising Israel. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 It's worth remembering that Israel and Apartheid South Africa jointly developed and tested nuclear weapons together. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDuffman Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 He is not "giving it to the Jews". He is criticising Israel. The people in Israel that make the decisions are Jews. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coprolite Posted October 19, 2018 Share Posted October 19, 2018 39 minutes ago, MacDuffman said: 2 hours ago, coprolite said: He is not "giving it to the Jews". He is criticising Israel. The people in Israel that make the decisions are Jews. but not all of the Jews are people in Israel that make the decisions. it's a basic point, but not a trivial one. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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