Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Bairnardo]

2 minutes ago, Elixir said:

How does this work? Hopefully it doesn't increase the chances of further mutation as appeared to be the case with convalescent plasma.

From what little I have read so far, it acts to calm the massive immune system overreaction that seems to cause a lot of covid deaths

[Granny Danger]

15 minutes ago, 101 said:

If that's true not pitching up will have the same effect. But the vote count would be significantly down which isn't a good look in my opinion.

If the option was between not voting and spoiling your ballot, which it was in this case, then spoiling your ballot is better, in my opinion.

I can see the ‘Spoil Your Ballot Party’ taking a few seats if they get their act together in time.*
 

* For the benefit of ‘the main players’ this is me being facetious.

[Burnieman]

14 minutes ago, Elixir said:

At least it's good to again hear this from the horse's mouth. Granted, these clowns have done U-turn after U-turn, but firing proof of vaccination to enter a public place in the bin, while still being able to obtain proof from your GP if it is an entry requirement to another country, is the sensible option to take.

They're not in control of this though.  If the EU for example come up with a requirement of proof that needs to be met in a specific way, then the UK will need to meet it.

They can't just leave it to "Yer Doc can give you a letter", that won't wash and I do think they're working on some sort of system of proof, if not neccesarily a "passport", more like an App like IATA are working on.

[Bairnardo]

2 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

I can see the ‘Spoil Your Ballot Party’ taking a few seats if they get their act together in time.*
 

* For the benefit of ‘the main players’ this is me being facetious.

Pretty sad to see this attempt at reverting to trolling in the face of criticism of your views.

[Billy Jean King]

That's been some night, glad I went to bed when I did !

Anyway today we have the vaccine minister categorically ruling out a vaccine passport program in the UK and I've just seen an interview with M O'Leary on Racing tv where he said he doesn't expect the majority of EU countries to be accepting UK or Irish tourists until September now due to a very slow vaccination response in the EU.

Interesting how the likes of Hunt gets the poo poo when giving out unpalatable news on the restrictions front yet it's gospel when coming from the mouth of anyone even remotely connected to the SG. Anyone who thinks we will see a situation of no restrictions in England and considerable restrictions up here come the summer is unhinged. It quite simply wont happen. There is an election in May that in effect will be a referendum on that very point. Basically they will state their intentions and the public will decide. Some on here are of the opinion "no one" would accept that stance by the SG. I personally can't see it myself but if they do go down that route they will soon enough see come election day if "no one" will be willing to accept it.

[101]

4 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

They're not in control of this though.  If the EU for example come up with a requirement of proof that needs to be met in a specific way, then the UK will need to meet it.

They can't just leave it to "Yer Doc can give you a letter", that won't wash and I do think they're working on some sort of system of proof, if not neccesarily a "passport", more like an App like IATA are working on.

Depends how many countries require proof, you're right if the EU bloc say they want proof the GP network would be swamped. Easiest way would be to link it to the passport so when it's scanned at the border it says if you have a vaccine or not.

[Jacksgranda]

Re ballot papers "A none of the above" option should be available.

Of course, that'll never happen, the same as PR will never happen for Westminster elections. PR is all well and good for the NI, Welsh & Scots elections though.

[Elixir]

So about those South African re-infections...

[Left Back]

4 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

Re ballot papers "A none of the above" option should be available.

Of course, that'll never happen, the same as PR will never happen for Westminster elections. PR is all well and good for the NI, Welsh & Scots elections though.

Agree with this.  Voting should be compulsory and the above should be an option.

[Billy Jean King]

They, like a lot of other govts, are obviously being fed models like the one from imperial released last night which seems to be extremely pessimistic 
 
 

That answers my very question from last night R without mitigation they estimate at 4. Difficult to see massive issues at that level in a fully vaccinated population but it's nudging towards problem territory although it happening in mid summer is bonkers stuff.

It also legitimately begs the question as to what efficacy and uptake models were governments fed to make the initial assumptions that the current vaccines would see us out of this if it looks like it may no longer be the case as natural R must have been well established at that stage?

[WhiteRoseKillie]

Between the Lone Beholder having an absolute nightmare and the Climate Denier's old posts getting chucked up to remind us what an absolute knob he is even without outing himself as a selfish wee Tory, it's been quite a couple of days on here - fair taken my mind off the aches and pains, I can tell you.

Anyone want to lay claim to being one of the "Main Players"?

[Granny Danger]

14 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

Pretty sad to see this attempt at reverting to trolling in the face of criticism of your views.

You obviously have no idea what ‘trolling’ means.  Maybe that’s why you’re half way down a rabbit hole with posters who are generally a lot thicker than you are.

[Granny Danger]

3 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

Between the Lone Beholder having an absolute nightmare and the Climate Denier's old posts getting chucked up to remind us what an absolute knob he is even without outing himself as a selfish wee Tory, it's been quite a couple of days on here - fair taken my mind off the aches and pains, I can tell you.

Anyone want to lay claim to being one of the "Main Players"?

Todd definitely is, and having me on ignore seems a criterion.

If you can’t read this post you’re in with a shout.

[madwullie]

9 minutes ago, Billy Jean King said:

That answers my very question from last night R without mitigation they estimate at 4. Difficult to see massive issues at that level in a fully vaccinated population but it's nudging towards problem territory although it happening in mid summer is bonkers stuff.

It also legitimately begs the question as to what efficacy and uptake models were governments fed to make the initial assumptions that the current vaccines would see us out of this if it looks like it may no longer be the case as natural R must have been well established at that stage?

When the vaccines were first being rolled out, Whitty or someone like that did say that at the current rate of vaccination (not sure what that figure was) they didn't think it would be enough to mitigate deaths and stop the nhs from being overwhelmed,but this got kind of drowned pit in the outpouring of relief iirc

From that model though, they don't look like they're considering that the vaccine is doing pretty well in most cases so far of stopping severe disease. I could be missing that though as a pot of it is gobbledygook to me - but it looks like the focus is on transmission? If loads of people catch it but for the vast vast majority it doesn't require hospital treatment, then what's the issue? 

I think the panic on here is extremely presumptuous - if deaths are dropping like a stone and hospital numbers are miles down (even while cases remain relatively high, no govt is going to be able to justify continued measures, no matter how much of a dictator you think Nikkkola is. 

Maybe, just maybe, if a concerning new strain / variant comes into play, some light measures may be justified for the few months it takes to get a booster online, but even then it will be an extremely hard sell, and they'd need to show the variant is properly dangerous ie completely avoids contemporary vaccines. 

Edited February 7, 2021 by madwullie

[Elixir]

34 minutes ago, madwullie said:

They, like a lot of other govts, are obviously being fed models like the one from imperial released last night which seems to be extremely pessimistic 

 

 

Their model suggests another peak in mid-summer worse than anything we have seen so far. I just don't see from a purely logic and evidence-so-far basis that this can be in any way a plausible outcome.

If a final peak was pushed out to next winter, I guess it would make more sense, but then we'll be vaxxed up to our tits by then, with boosters for the vArIaNtZ for the vulnerable by autumn if necessary.

21 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

They're not in control of this though.  If the EU for example come up with a requirement of proof that needs to be met in a specific way, then the UK will need to meet it.

They can't just leave it to "Yer Doc can give you a letter", that won't wash and I do think they're working on some sort of system of proof, if not neccesarily a "passport", more like an App like IATA are working on.

True of course, but short-term there will have to be more crude means of proof.

In any case, I don't think the EU or any western country will go down a route of requiring proof of vaccination to enter a public place. It just wouldn't fly with countries in central, eastern and southern Europe, as well as in places like France due to vaccine hesitancy. Then further afield, i.e. in America, it would just stoke even more division between Democrat and Republican states.

Requiring a negative test result or proof of vaccination will likely become necessary to enter at the border, but hopefully that will be all. And of course it all comes back to if this will really be necessary once Covid is de-risked to something more like seasonal influenza.

Edited February 7, 2021 by Elixir

[Bairnardo]

2 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

You obviously have no idea what ‘trolling’ means.  Maybe that’s why you’re half way down a rabbit hole with posters who are generally a lot thicker than you are.

Why is being sceptical of the need for continued restrictions long after the vaccine program has battered through half the population a "rabbit hole"?

[Granny Danger]

8 minutes ago, Left Back said:

Agree with this.  Voting should be compulsory and the above should be an option.

I always thought encouraging the disaffected to vote would be a good idea until I saw Trump winning in 2016 then increasing his vote in 2020.

[Erih Shtrep]

Well I'll quite happily vote SNP and I'll be giving my list vote to the Greens maximising the pro-indy numbers in the d'hondt system.   The whole election will be framed around the constitution.   If ( and it's a big if ) the SNP poll over 50% there will be enormous pressure on Westminister to allow for a 2nd referendum.   Labour and Lib Dems will probably come on board and at worst support for independence will climb ( due to Westministers refusal ) as it gets dragged through the courts.    

The idea you can be pro-independence and vote for these b*****ds is bonkers.   Post-election Nicola Sturgeon will still be the FM.  The only person you'll be helping  with a spoilt ballot is folk like Douglas Ross and these fuckers.  

Edited February 7, 2021 by Erih Shtrep

[Elixir]

 

[Granny Danger]

12 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

Why is being sceptical of the need for continued restrictions long after the vaccine program has battered through half the population a "rabbit hole"?

I am generally willing to have a serious discussion with posters who I think merit it and treat the others as I think they should be treated.

I’ve always had you in the first group but your last response bar one suggests that you’re at it.  Nonetheless, since I’m magnanimous, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt.

I think the SG and their advisers are being very wary because they’re dealing with an unprecedented situation that is still evolving.  To go off at a slight tangent, that’s why I get pissed off at the ‘I want to know when x, y and z is happening’ bunch.  Only a stupid or reckless politician* or public health official would try to predict where we will be in a month’s time, let alone three month.

I do not believe the SG will keep restrictions in place any longer than are necessary, they just do not want to offer false optimism.  I respect them for that.

* Or populists in a post-truth era who will say something then deny it a week/month later.  A bigger, longer term issue for society than the pandemic.

Edited February 7, 2021 by Granny Danger