George Floyd/Black Lives Matter Protests

[coprolite]

6 minutes ago, throbber said:

I dunno about the red top paper stuff, the war on benefits scrounges was more after the credit crunch 2008 - 2010 time and Little Britain ran from 2003-2006. Were people blaming the disabled for the countries woes in that era? I genuinely can’t remember but people can and will try and argue that’s what the message was in little Britain regardless.

Lou and Andy characters started on Rock profile which was a show they did on some MTV channel (UK Play?) in the 90’s and were parodies of Lou Reed and Andy Warhole and were specially designed to be absolutely nothing like them just out of pure silliness. There was no hidden agenda there it was just utterly daft.

Instead of me pontificating here's a proper report. 

My impression is that the "scroungers" narrative has been mainstream for as long as i can remember. The target group has varied from single mothers to immigrants and people with big families. 

Benefits-Stigma-in-Britain (1).pdf

 

[bennett]

18 minutes ago, ICTJohnboy said:

Another quote from the Guardian article mentioned in previous post.

 

Some would probably argue now that Mary Whitehouse was right to try and force Till Death Us Do Part off the air - even if she had missed the point of the show.

Mary Whitehouse claimed that the A Team was too violent ffs, she was always missing the point.  In sickness and in health was one of the first shows that I can remember showing a gay character, I'm sure that she had an issue with that.

 

 

 

 

 

[Jambomo]

2 hours ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

Love thy neighbour was a racist joke. Till death us do part was a joke about racism and class among other things. People seem to have lost the ability to tell the difference.

I think the problem with shows like that, and to some extent Little Britain, is that whatever the intention of the writers, it ultimately heavily depends on the audience being able to tell the difference. 
 

I think for every person laughing at the racist or homophobic character, there is probably another one not getting the joke and laughing along with them at the funny bigoted comments they are making. These ideas are just reinforced and legitimised because they are on TV, and people think that they aren’t the only ones thinking these things, so they must have a point.

[Jacksgranda]

31 minutes ago, Jambomo said:

I think the problem with shows like that, and to some extent Little Britain, is that whatever the intention of the writers, it ultimately heavily depends on the audience being able to tell the difference. 
 

I think for every person laughing at the racist or homophobic character, there is probably another one not getting the joke and laughing along with them at the funny bigoted comments they are making. These ideas are just reinforced and legitimised because they are on TV, and people think that they aren’t the only ones thinking these things, so they must have a point.

Make that 100

[Guest JTS98]

22 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

It's always worth discussion but I think the number of young, real quality black English footballers would point to real progress in the playing side of it.

In terms of representation there is absolutely no problem in football. This article puts the figure of black players in the Premier League at something like then times the proportion of the black population of Britain.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/11985713/coronavirus-jobi-mcanuff-says-premier-league-clubs-should-note-extra-risk-to-black-players

I'm not sure what the figures are for Scotland, but I'd be happy to bet that the percentage of the footballers in Scotland who are black is higher than the population in general.

Definitely an issue in those players moving on to management roles, but certainly not in terms of playing.

Edited July 7, 2020 by JTS98

[pandarilla]

I think the problem with shows like that, and to some extent Little Britain, is that whatever the intention of the writers, it ultimately heavily depends on the audience being able to tell the difference. 
 
I think for every person laughing at the racist or homophobic character, there is probably another one not getting the joke and laughing along with them at the funny bigoted comments they are making. These ideas are just reinforced and legitimised because they are on TV, and people think that they aren’t the only ones thinking these things, so they must have a point.

Pretty much this.

I think the mainstream success makes a difference.

When these shows are smaller, they can probably get away with the satire. But when the shows gets huge then the point of the satire gets lost, and it becomes damaging.

No easy answers. But i guess if you create a show like this you have to take responsibility for it - and act accordingly.

[Todd_is_God]

11 hours ago, bennett said:

Till death do us part was mocking the society which existed in the 70s, Alf was the joke.

Was Love Thy Neighbour not similar? An attempt to highlight the ridiculous racism in society at the time rather than legitimise it?

[Hillonearth]

1 hour ago, Tynierose said:

Whitehouse herself was a horrible bigot.  Her views on homosexuality etc were like something out the old testament.

 

That was precisely where she got her inspiration from. She was the worst kind of petty bourgeois bigot who was instinctively against anything that fell outside her own limited horizons which she didn't understand.

Which as it turned out was most things.

[Savage Henry]

16 hours ago, invergowrie arab said:

It's possible for people to do things with no malice and still end up making a rip roaring c**t of it.

Matt Lucas seems to spend time now doing stuff like amplifying voices of people in wheelchairs who had the piss ripped out of them with Little Britain catchphrases. 

Walliams doesn't seem to give a f**k really. 

I know they did have a go at everyone but it's interesting that the most popular characters are the ones that punch down to marginalised groups and not the ones where they were getting a laugh at white male Tory MPs 

Lucas at least seems to have realised you have to own your actions when that's the result.

Also Little Britain was dogshit 

To use an old comedy show phrase, a game of good guy/w**k of that pair wouldn’t take very long.

[hk blues]

12 hours ago, ICTJohnboy said:

 

Alf Garnet was even worse.

How about Porridge where Ronnie Barker constantly ripped the piss out of Fulton MacKay being Scottish?

[Steve_Wilkos]

2 hours ago, Jambomo said:

I think the problem with shows like that, and to some extent Little Britain, is that whatever the intention of the writers, it ultimately heavily depends on the audience being able to tell the difference. 

You can also see the 'No More Catholics' section from Trainspotting 2 for another example of this phenomenon. 

[Savage Henry]

15 hours ago, ali_91 said:

It doesn’t sound shocking, it’s just blatantly not true. Jack Monroe is someone who has spent a large part of her life on benefits and using food banks and is a renowned campaigner to improve the help available for those less fortunate.

 

Her viral thread on twitter is first and foremost about Walliams hitting down at the working classes, and she explores other themes in the books which may be perceived as racist. She obviously does care about it, it’s her raison d’etre. 

She may well have done so, but her ongoing Walliams thread - like the plethora of “anti Scottish agenda” tweets - are making the whole range of issues entirely about her.  I don’t doubt her sincerity - well, actually I do - but she’s an absolutely dreadful writer/polemicist/talking head. 

[hk blues]

1 hour ago, JTS98 said:

In terms of representation there is absolutely no problem in football. This article puts the figure of black players in the Premier League at something like then times the proportion of the black population of Britain.

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/11985713/coronavirus-jobi-mcanuff-says-premier-league-clubs-should-note-extra-risk-to-black-players

I'm not sure what the figures are for Scotland, but I'd be happy to bet that the percentage of the footballers in Scotland who are black is higher than the population in general.

Definitely an issue in those players moving on to management roles, but certainly not in terms of playing.

I would imagine you are right but when we are dealing with small numbers it doesn't take much to skew the data i.e.signing 1 black player would perhaps be enough to "meet a quota." 

[KnightswoodBear]

5 minutes ago, Steve_Wilkos said:

You can also see the 'No More Catholics' section from Trainspotting 2 for another example of this phenomenon. 

That was my favourite bit.

[Cosmic Joe]

3 minutes ago, Steve_Wilkos said:

You can also see the 'No More Catholics' section from Trainspotting 2 for another example of this phenomenon. 

I suspect the only ones who didn't find that scene hilarious were brain dead bigots themselves

[Guest JTS98]

2 minutes ago, hk blues said:

I would imagine you are right but when we are dealing with small numbers it doesn't take much to skew the data i.e.signing 1 black player would perhaps be enough to "meet a quota." 

Yeah, but I don't think there's any need for a quota at all. I don't think black players are denied opportunities.

Management jobs are a different story.

[Savage Henry]

9 minutes ago, ali_91 said:

I can’t say I’ve read much, if any of her work, but someone who has campaigned their whole adult life about something should be considered sincere in their beliefs at the very least.
 

Having some narcissistic undertones in your writing is not mutually exclusive to actually believing what you are saying. 

Fair.

[Steve_Wilkos]

23 minutes ago, Angusfifer said:

I suspect the only ones who didn't find that scene hilarious were brain dead bigots themselves

[bennett]

1 hour ago, Todd_is_God said:

Was Love Thy Neighbour not similar? An attempt to highlight the ridiculous racism in society at the time rather than legitimise it?

I can barely remember Love thy neighbour, I think it was a coarser in its humour/more Bernard Manningesque than Till Death was.  Though I'm sure that the white guy usually did end up with egg on his face.

 

 

 

[ICTJohnboy]

1 hour ago, hk blues said:

How about Porridge where Ronnie Barker constantly ripped the piss out of Fulton MacKay being Scottish?

I thought that was hilarious. Do you think some might have found it offensive?