Might not vote 2021

[Big Rider]

The 3 Cs of Conservatism - Corruption, Cronyism, Cuntyness.
Pheromones for attracting Rangers dafties right enough.

[Ira Gaines]

"All Tories Are c***s" should be one of the SNP campaign slogans.

[vikingTON]

On 21/03/2021 at 03:08, Baxter Parp said:

Do you want independence?

My constituency vote already covers this. 

I also want a party that supports radical change to the existing system as well, and unless I see a credible vision for this then no party has earned a right to my second vote. 

[SANTAN]

I wonder which racist account got emptied...

Take note of all the gullible morons that blindly liked that nonsense. 

[SANTAN]

1 minute ago, Pato said:

?

William Bragg. 5 posts above, quite rightly recieved the ban hammer last night for his antics in the Rangers in Europe thread. 

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

On 21/03/2021 at 03:47, git-intae-thum said:

 

They are a shambolic excuse for an administration who have become beholden to all sorts of ridiculous fringeists. Absolutely nothing positive has been produced by the administration since 2014. All the SNP govts good achievements came in its first two administration's. Since then the leadership has been absolutely turgid.

 

 

There's a valid point being made there that may be better discussed with it's own thread. 

I have also become a bit disillusioned with the SNP and were worried that after 14 years they've gone a bit stale. And then I see things like the 40% reduction in violent crime, and also that the promised 117 new schools have been built in the last 10 years and many more have been significantly renovated and improved.

When I sat down and thought about how my life is now compared with 20 years ago, I can't really think of any negatives. My kids got a good education, went to Uni and have good jobs. I've been employed with the same company for years and my standard of living has improved out of sight. I feel safer on the streets. I'm lucky enough to live in a town where there's little or no graffiti, never mind violent crime. There's very little unemployment, and people to me seem more contented with life than they were a generation ago.

The only thing I'd really change is to get the potholes repared.

I obviously don't think to speak for anyone apart from myself, but I believe strongly that Scotland has become a better country under an SNP administration. And those that hate the SNP because of constituitional issues often miss the big point.....that many people are actually quite happy with the 'day job' that the SNP are doing. 

 

 

[Genuine Hibs Fan]

On 21/03/2021 at 08:26, Pato said:

The idea the reactionary old farts we're slowly crowbarring out of public life might seize the moment and put a policeman in every toilet is about the only thing that could cause me to think twice about voting yes in a new independence referendum.

What's especially intriguing is that, given they're always bragging about longevity these are presumably people who've been happy to support the SNP while taking money from Brian Souter and pandering to Tartan Tories like Ewing. But some tumbler kids and Stirling uni students being rude online about trans rights is a step too far. You'd think after the cybernat discourse they'd have learned that this was nonsense but there we go.

Edited March 22, 2021 by Genuine Hibs Fan

[scottsdad]

10 minutes ago, Bob Mahelp said:

There's a valid point being made there that may be better discussed with it's own thread. 

I have also become a bit disillusioned with the SNP and were worried that after 14 years they've gone a bit stale. And then I see things like the 40% reduction in violent crime, and also that the promised 117 new schools have been built in the last 10 years and many more have been significantly renovated and improved.

When I sat down and thought about how my life is now compared with 20 years ago, I can't really think of any negatives. My kids got a good education, went to Uni and have good jobs. I've been employed with the same company for years and my standard of living has improved out of sight. I feel safer on the streets. I'm lucky enough to live in a town where there's little or no graffiti, never mind violent crime. There's very little unemployment, and people to me seem more contented with life than they were a generation ago.

The only thing I'd really change is to get the potholes repared.

I obviously don't think to speak for anyone apart from myself, but I believe strongly that Scotland has become a better country under an SNP administration. And those that hate the SNP because of constituitional issues often miss the big point.....that many people are actually quite happy with the 'day job' that the SNP are doing. 

 

 

Interesting take. I think the SNP really is stale now in office. Independence aside, I'm not sure that they're up for more years of government. They've made things a bit better across the board, but wouldn't anyone? I have voted SNP in recent years and when I think about it, it has become a habit. Just the natural thing to do - like voting Labour was once upon a time. Less than 2 months out from the election, I don't know what they're proposing other than inderef2.

I like in a town where there is crime, and I do worry about my kids round here. The roads are a shambles, more potholes than tarmac. Unemployment is a concern (not for me, but for my neighbours). The schooling is good, the bins are improving. 

[HTG]

44 minutes ago, scottsdad said:

Interesting take. I think the SNP really is stale now in office. Independence aside, I'm not sure that they're up for more years of government. They've made things a bit better across the board, but wouldn't anyone? I have voted SNP in recent years and when I think about it, it has become a habit. Just the natural thing to do - like voting Labour was once upon a time. Less than 2 months out from the election, I don't know what they're proposing other than inderef2.

I like in a town where there is crime, and I do worry about my kids round here. The roads are a shambles, more potholes than tarmac. Unemployment is a concern (not for me, but for my neighbours). The schooling is good, the bins are improving. 

I get where you're coming from but you need to see the context of this election. In the past, the SNP has been accused of not having Indy2 front and centre, of not being loud enough and strong enough on independence. You can see that perspective in here and on Twitter. At the same time, they're primarily fighting the tories who couldn't give you a policy of their lives depended on it. For the last 5 years everything they produce and everything they've said has been to stop Indy2. 

Against that backdrop, everything has to be focused on Indy2. It's a sign of encouragement to me that the absolute fucking zoomer rump of the anti-Holyrood brigade are becoming ever more frantic on social media. Deans is on this morning comparing the SNP to the Nazis and it seems she's serious. 

This election needs to see fire fought with fire. 

[G51]

1 hour ago, Bob Mahelp said:

When I sat down and thought about how my life is now compared with 20 years ago, I can't really think of any negatives. My kids got a good education, went to Uni and have good jobs. I've been employed with the same company for years and my standard of living has improved out of sight. I feel safer on the streets. I'm lucky enough to live in a town where there's little or no graffiti, never mind violent crime. There's very little unemployment, and people to me seem more contented with life than they were a generation ago.

The only thing I'd really change is to get the potholes repared.

 

It's telling that this is the sort of person that the SNP now appeal to.

[ICTChris]

The not voters really are the true force of Scottish politics.  Scottish Parliamentary election turnout has never hit 60%, the first election was 59% and the subsequent turnouts have hovered around the 50% mark with only the 2016 vote bumping up to 55%.

I think this probably helps the SNP as I can imagine that SNP/Yes voters are more likely to vote than people who are opposed to them.

[Anonapersona]

As someone who has no voting rights whatsoever, I'll just say everyone should vote and be happy you get a say.

[GordonS]

16 minutes ago, G51 said:

It's telling that this is the sort of person that the SNP now appeal to.

How else would you expect to get more than 50% of people in Scotland supporting you? This is slap-bang in the middle of the electorate.

[scottsdad]

10 minutes ago, Anonapersona said:

As someone who has no voting rights whatsoever, I'll just say everyone should vote and be happy you get a say.

I've always voted. Even in the AV referendum of 2011, even the European elections. But this time I'm just feeling really disillusioned. 

I'm hoping that I see a leaflet or advert that catches my eye and sparks my interest again. Like I said originally, the Tory leaflet was Ruth Davidson and that Ross gut standing with arms folded, and every word about saying no to Indyref 2. The utter lack of policies struck me, and then I thought - I'm not sure what anyone's policies are right now. I know Covid has sucked the life out of the election (and possibly me) but I just want someone to give me something worth voting for.

[GordonS]

19 minutes ago, Pato said:

Edward O. Wilson on progress:

 

Fukuyama-tastic.

There have always been periods of relatively rapid and intense change and it's naive to think that has come to an end. We've all grown up and lived in the longest period of peace and prosperity in European history and, instead of crediting the hundreds of thousands of people who made that happen by building a post-war consensus, we treat it as though it was somehow inevitable.

Put it this way, for 400 years the Jews of Poland lived in peace and safety. They were important members of society, valued for the skills and contributions to the community. At one point over half of all Jews in the world lived in Poland and it was more the homeland of the religion than anywhere. It was known as 'Paradise of the Jews'. After 400 years they probably thought nothing would ever change too. And then, from 1772, came the Russians, the Austrians and the Germans. 

[G51]

21 minutes ago, GordonS said:

How else would you expect to get more than 50% of people in Scotland supporting you? This is slap-bang in the middle of the electorate.

Would disagree that "Things should stay the same except the potholes should get fixed" is slap bang in the middle of the electorate, but appreciate that's difficult to prove.

A party like the SNP has the power to move the Overton window because the majority of people supporting it are doing so for reasons that have nothing to do with non-constitutional politics.

It's pretty clear that they simply don't have the inclination to do that. It means that the SNP's support base among younger people is going to completely evaporate post-independence.

[GordonS]

23 minutes ago, Pato said:

A bit Godwin-y. The point he's making it for the most part, things get better so slowly that if you don't study it you might not notice it. I think that's behind quite a bit of the 'stale SNP' narrative we're seeing compared to actual tangible progress in things we all like (except potholes which are on a level with winter 2010!).

The SNP came out with a lot more left wing rhetoric between 2015 and 2017, but it didn't win them votes as folk mostly just care about potholes. I don't think it's in their power to shift things dramatically after that. It's boring politics until independence and then the banter era begins.

Are you calling my reply Godwin-y because I mentioned Germans among two other countries, about events that were more than 150 years before the Nazis?

The point he's making is a bit more than what you're saying, it's also saying that progress is inevitable and I'm calling bollocks on that. History does not move "decisiely" in any direction.

Coming back to Scotland in 2021, I agree with you, and anyone who thinks the SNP can get more than 50% to support independence on a radical left agenda has never taken a walk round a typical Scottish cul-de-sac. 

[GordonS]

58 minutes ago, G51 said:

Would disagree that "Things should stay the same except the potholes should get fixed" is slap bang in the middle of the electorate, but appreciate that's difficult to prove.

A party like the SNP has the power to move the Overton window because the majority of people supporting it are doing so for reasons that have nothing to do with non-constitutional politics.

It's pretty clear that they simply don't have the inclination to do that. It means that the SNP's support base among younger people is going to completely evaporate post-independence.

I think they have moved the window - in 2003 they were humped on a proposal to keep income tax the same while England was having a cut, but now nearly half of Scots pay more and a big chunk pay about £1,500 more per year than they would in England. I think they've played a big leadership role in our attitudes to immigration and race and they've been strong on universal benefits. Obviously it's a matter of opinion how much more they could and should have done, but personally I'm pretty pessimistic about human nature. 

[jakedee]

I think they have moved the window - in 2003 they were humped on a proposal to keep income tax the same while England was having a cut, but now nearly half of Scots pay more and a big chunk pay about £1,500 more per year than they would in England. I think they've played a big leadership role in our attitudes to immigration and race and they've been strong on universal benefits. Obviously it's a matter of opinion how much more they could and should have done, but personally I'm pretty pessimistic about human nature. 

You have to earn almost £100k p/y to pay £1.5k more tax in Scotland.
I suppose a " big chunk" is perspective.

[GordonS]

2 minutes ago, jakedee said:

You have to earn almost £100k p/y to pay £1.5k more tax in Scotland.
I suppose a " big chunk" is perspective.

Afraid you're mistaken, you only have to be a higher rate tax payer. Someone on £50k in Scotland is paying £1,493.67 more income tax than the same salary in England. That's almost a fifth of income tax payers in Scotland.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-55847671