St Johnstone vs Rangers, Wednesday 21 April, 2021

[G51]

the real epidemic is people using “clownshoes” as an insult

[RandomGuy.]

1 hour ago, G51 said:

the real epidemic is people using “clownshoes” as an insult

Its not an insult when using it in reference to Clark, its an adjective.

[The Marly]

the real epidemic is people using “clownshoes” as an insult

f**k off Clownshoes.

[Fife Saint]

I love McCann as a player. I'd really like to sign him, and with a midfield needing rebuilt we might pay the money.

Youd imagine his international mentor Davis will have brought it up with Gerrard.

[G51]

17 minutes ago, The Marly said:

1 hour ago, G51 said:

the real epidemic is people using “clownshoes” as an insult

f**k off Clownshoes.

it reminds me of when middle-class libs used to call Trump a “wankpuffin”

[Zamora Fan]

Disagree with that one. He barely gets any push off from his dive, if he moves his feet quicker and is more agile he gets across to tip it wide. As a goalkeeper, he’s simply too static, for example I’ve no doubt a Jack Alnwick would have saved it. 

Look at the save Colin Doyle (I think) makes for Killie at 4.30ish here.

Arguably a harder save to make than the one Clark let in yet he makes it because he actually pushes off with the intention of saving it... sometimes feel Clark just chucks himself in the direction of a ball without seriously thinking he could save it, tbh. Like when he does a star jump to save shots/headers coming across the goal rather than trying to react to where it’s going. It sounds harsh but I don’t think there’s any getting away from the fact he’s a poor keeper for this level.

[Lang Toon Saintee]

We all can see the deficiencies in Clark's game its the same things time and time again.I will say this until I'm blue in the face..If we can all see it WTF is our Head of Goalkeeping doing to remedy it.

[Widge]

38 minutes ago, Lang Toon Saintee said:

We all can see the deficiencies in Clark's game its the same things time and time again.I will say this until I'm blue in the face..If we can all see it WTF is our Head of Goalkeeping doing to remedy it.

I'm not sure there's anything you can do to help an immobile, tall keeper that's gone this far in his career with the same deficiencies. But I agree, it's a worry that your every day fan can see the issues and what he struggles with, yet our paid professional coach can't even improve it slightly. 

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

2 hours ago, Zamora Fan said:

Look at the save Colin Doyle (I think) makes for Killie at 4.30ish here.

 

 

 

 

Arguably a harder save to make than the one Clark let in yet he makes it because he actually pushes off with the intention of saving it... sometimes feel Clark just chucks himself in the direction of a ball without seriously thinking he could save it, tbh. Like when he does a star jump to save shots/headers coming across the goal rather than trying to react to where it’s going. It sounds harsh but I don’t think there’s any getting away from the fact he’s a poor keeper for this level.

 

Whit?

The Dundee united shot is absolute pish. It is a high floaty effort that the keeper doesn't even need to move his feet for. And Colin Doyle is complete gash too.

 

[Radford]

4 hours ago, Zamora Fan said:

 Like when he does a star jump to save shots/headers coming across the goal rather than trying to react to where it’s going. 

That is very true. There was also a save from Allan McGregor in the Old Firm game when Elyounoussi took the bad touch and he dived at his feet. Clark would have been doing his starfish impression and the attacker would probably have got away with a chronic first touch. He never makes saves like that. When you factor in the eyes-shut, one-handed punch technique, critics might suggest he needs to be a lot braver in his keeping. 

Edited April 23, 2021 by Radford

[glenrothes 1884 saint]

Zander did react to a bad touch in the first half,possibly Wright,and blocked the effort

[The Saintee]

13 minutes ago, Radford said:

That is very true. There was also a save from Allan McGregor in the Old Firm game when Elyounoussi took the bad touch and he dived at his feet. Clark would have been doing his starfish impression and the attacker would probably have got away with a chronic first touch. He never makes saves like that. When you factor in the eyes-shut, one-handed punch technique, critics might suggest he needs to be a lot braver in his keeping. 

It's my belief that he's regressed since the Sunderland game when he ended up with the concussion.

[Mr Positive, sometimes.]

8 hours ago, G51 said:

the real epidemic is people using “clownshoes” as an insult

I'm really surprised someone hasn't replied to this with a clip of him sprinting  out the box to cut out a ball in behind from a few weeks ago where he completely missing the ball when attempting to kick it as that would sum up the whole cloneshoes thing perfectly.

Mon @RandomGuy. You're slacking. 

[glenrothes 1884 saint]

Whilst I agree Zander isnt flawless, he’d not be at Saints if he was,but Rooney made a mess  of a challenge 40 yards out,two cb’ s didn’t press the scorer nearly as quick as they should’ve, so to point the finger at Zander is harsh,it just takes the wrong weight on  the wrong  foot at the wrong time to scupper you. No one seems to remember Liam and Guys poor efforts first half 

Edited April 23, 2021 by glenrothes 1884 saint

[PauloPerth]

1 hour ago, glenrothes 1884 saint said:

Whilst I agree Zander isnt flawless, he’d not be at Saints if he was,but Rooney made a mess  of a challenge 40 yards out,two cb’ s didn’t press the scorer nearly as quick as they should’ve, so to point the finger at Zander is harsh,it just takes the wrong weight on  the wrong  foot at the wrong time to scupper you. No one seems to remember Liam and Guys poor efforts first half 

Agreed.  It's called confirmation bias apparently. People have formed opinions on Clark, and look for every opportunity to prove it.  

It was a howler by Rooney for the goal.

Dont get me wrong, Clark's certainly regressed over the past few seasons from when he was being touted for a Scotland squad call up, and definitely needs genuine competition for the starting place.  He's had a couple of dreadful performances; rangers at home the first time, Dundee away, for example, but he's also played a big part in the league cup quarter and semi final victories.

Its fine to say we need another keeper or you don't rate him or whatever, but calling a current Saints player clownshoes, who is one of only 2 Saints keepers in our history to start in a major trophy win, is pretty pish.  

It's the kind of thing you usually get from OF fans, or they folk who claim to support the likes of Man Utd and slaughter all the players they don't rate cos they don't win every match.

Different if he carried on like Rowan Vine or Andy Rhodes and had no respect for the club, but that's not the case with Clark.

[RandomGuy.]

I'm quite tickled by the emphasis on the "clownshoes" insult being a step too far, considering some of the things that get thrown about

[Radford]

8 hours ago, PauloPerth said:

Agreed.  It's called confirmation bias apparently. People have formed opinions on Clark, and look for every opportunity to prove it. 

Personally, I feel I try really hard to not subscribe to that. I would make a joke about giving Clark more clean slates than he has sheets but the irony is he actually keeps quite a few. And that is why the defence get little stick, because they prove themselves over and over again in their protection of him. Maybe that works against Clark as he doesn't get an opportunity to showcase his ability, regularly only facing a handful of shots on target per game.

I'm wary of what you say about players (and hate to think of him or his family reading any criticism) but even if stuff can sometimes be laced with (poor) humour as in the clownshoes jibes it's always just an honest assessment. 

If I thought saying nothing about Zander Clark would improve things, I'd do that but really unfortunately I think the opposite is the case and only more dissenting voices are likely to remedy the situation. 

[Ric]

On 22/04/2021 at 17:22, tree house tam said:

I think he would.

Nah, he likes acting like a big man on here, but we both know the truth.

 

[Jamie_B]

The only thing I’d say about that stat is that its notable how much fewer shots on target Clark has faced this season than other keepers who are first pick. That’s obviously down to the way we defend which forces teams to take a lot of wayward long range efforts against us.

On the flip side, I have felt that quite often when we *do* allow chances inside the box they tend to often be extremely good chances. Eg rebounds that fall right to the feet of a striker (O’Hara’s goal at Mcdiarmid for Motherwell, Hayes at Aberdeen) or otherwise extremely high percentage chances. That often feels like a function of how we play - ie if you do get behind our defence you are rewarded with a good chance. That’s the opposite of a lot of what we did earlier in the season (loads of headers under pressure from an infinite number of crosses).

Thats why we hear a lot of “a better keeper would have saved that” about Clark. There’s definitely an element of that which is true, and he is definitely not at the level he was at when he first became number one. But equally I think that save percentage stat paints a very slightly false picture.

Put it this way - I don’t think there’s many goals that he’s been absolutely definitely to blame for this season. There’s also a clear case that there have been some goals that, for example, Siegrist may well have saved. On balance though, I’d rather have Clark than several of the names on that list who are above him (Laidlaw, Rodgers, Chapman and Archer for a start). Even the likes of Stryjek at Livingston have looked extremely dodgy against us this year.

I also think Paulo’s point has some merit. There are some who look for a fault with Clark at virtually every goal. We had people trying to blame Clark for Hayes’ goal at Pittodrie the other week. That was a guy who was one on one six yards out dead centre and with the defenders on their arse. That’s extremely harsh.

We definitely need to bring in a quality keeper in the summer - either to be number one or to get the best out of Clark. Parish is way above him on that table and I don’t think anyone would want him taking over permanently. I’m not sure that player exists elsewhere in the Scottish top flight just now - or at least not one who we’d get without a fee because anyone I’d like (Alnwick, McLaughlin, Kelly) are all under contract or likely to remain at their current clubs. Maybe Gary Woods? But is that a big upgrade? Hard to know.

Edited April 24, 2021 by Jamie_Beatson

[RandomGuy.]

2 minutes ago, Ric said:

Nah, he likes acting like a big man on here, but we both know the truth.

 

You're a grown man, presumably in his 50s/60s, trying to get a stranger on a football forum to "come say that to my face".

It's not me "acting like a big man", m8.