BerwickMad Posted October 28, 2015 Share Posted October 28, 2015 I'm the phobic one because I don't think people should be bullied for holding non-mainstream views? The world truly is upside down. Please point out the homophobic part of what I wrote out to me. I'm open to learning. Who's being bullied? It's perfectly acceptable to pull someone up for holding such an opinion in 2015. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miguel Sanchez Posted October 28, 2015 Share Posted October 28, 2015 The initialism LGBT is intended to emphasize a diversity of sexuality and gender identity-based cultures. It may be used to refer to anyone who is non-heterosexual or non-cisgender, instead of exclusively to people who are lesbian, gay, bisexual, or transgender.[2][5] To recognize this inclusion, a popular variant adds the letter Q for those who identify as queer or are questioning their sexual identity; LGBTQ has been recorded since 1996.[6] HTH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menzel Posted October 28, 2015 Share Posted October 28, 2015 I'm not talking about calling anybody anything. I am talking about the right to hold beliefs. I have the right to believe whatever the hell I like without fear of being bullied for it. You just called us the "LGBTQFGUANNE (or whatever the hell they call themselves these days" community. And no, I don't defend your apparent "right to believe" in hate speech either. Deliberately misgendering people is hate speech, and puts people in danger. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 28, 2015 Share Posted October 28, 2015 Your post was so dismissive of the lgbt community. I believe you when you say that wasn't your intention but the fact that you don't have much time for them was screaming out from that post. It was disrespectful. I agree with you that bullying is not the way to go. I think education is the key to winning people over in this issue. It's not the same as racism - there are scientific issues at play that people genuinely don't understand (I certainly didn't until pretty recently when a TV documentary (actually a couple of them) finally made up my mind). I don't have time for many lobby groups as I believe they tend to cause more issues than they solve. They can also be a dangerous vehicle which can end up radicalising people to such an extent that they actually become more intolerant than those they are opposing (some radical feminists are a prime example of this). This is not an extreme or homophobic view. The fact that some peoples initial reaction to me was to scream "homophobe" without knowing the slightest thing about me or my beliefs is a perfect demonstration of the intolerance that these supposed "tolerant" groups can cultivate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menzel Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I don't have time for many lobby groups as I believe they tend to cause more issues than they solve. They can also be a dangerous vehicle which can end up radicalising people to such an extent that they actually become more intolerant than those they are opposing (some radical feminists are a prime example of this). This is not an extreme or homophobic view. It is the view of a complete w****r though. Sorry for not caring about the rights of white, straight cis people bleating about how they are allowed to call anyone what they want though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Who's being bullied? It's perfectly acceptable to pull someone up for holding such an opinion in 2015. It's impossible to control what he thinks, but I would say what he thinks is unacceptable and should be challenged in every lawful way possible, up to and including bullying if necessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 It is the view of a complete w****r though. And I think you are a w****r for thinking that your views are more legitimate than those of somebody you disagree with. That's real bigotry right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menzel Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 And I think you are a w****r for thinking that your views are more legitimate than those of somebody you disagree with. That's real bigotry right there. But I thought it was my absolute right to call anyone what I wanted...? The views of people of colour on racism, LGBT people on homophobia and transgender people on transphobia are more legitimate than yours. It's not too difficult to understand why either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Last refuge of racists and bigots everywhere that. "I have a right to my own opinion." Surely everybody has a right to their own opinion in any civilised society? To argue against that is very Orwellian. Yes, but only if you can justify it with rational argument. Just saying that someone in a dress with a cock is still a man doesn't cut it. And as he was talking about someone locked up in solitary in a military prison probably for the rest of her life whose identity is probably close to all she has left, I don't really give a f**k about Wing's right to his opinion on this issue. Otherwise, he's doing a great job, keep it up. Bit annoyed about no reply there. Free world I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 But I thought it was my absolute right to call anyone what I wanted...? The views of people of colour on racism, LGBT people on homophobia and transgender people on transphobia are more legitimate than yours. It's not too difficult to understand why either. I never argued that. Nice strawman. My right to believe something is just as legitimate as yours. Is a gay mans views on transgender people more legitimate that mine? Is a transgender persons views on homosexuality more legitimate than mine? Is my view on heterosexuality more legitimate than that of a bi transexual? Maybe we need some sort of graph to show who should be allowed to hold views and who shouldn't. Unless, you are dumping all members of the *insert appropriate acronym here* community into one big group? That wouldn't be very open minded of you, would it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Bit annoyed about no reply there. Free world I suppose. Sorry, for what it is worth I absolutely agree with you. I don't agree with what Wings said on the subject but I must admit I do understand his PoV and I will defend his right to hold and express that PoV. If that makes me the next Hitler then this really is a fucked up world we live in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menzel Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I don't think that you actually "don't get it", I think it suits you that you don't want to get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I don't think that you actually "don't get it", I think it suits you that you don't want to get it. I don't understand what you are even trying to say here. If you have a point, make it. If you don't then maybe you should just bow out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Sorry, for what it is worth I absolutely agree with you. I don't agree with what Wings said on the subject but I must admit I do understand his PoV and I will defend his right to hold and express that PoV. If that makes me the next Hitler then this really is a fucked up world we live in. It might be better world if we just called people what they wanted to be called. That's not denial of freedom or political correctness, it's just old fashioned being polite, no rocket science involved, no freedoms torn from God loving people. Night night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Like I said in one of my previous posts, live and let live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Do you think a cis male should be allowed to call a transwoman by male pronouns? I have absolutely no idea what this actually means. I am pretty sure that it has no bearing on the content of my previous post which was nothing to do with calling anyone anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Is there a right to self determination in the UK? This is a genuine question as I thought you had to apply for some sort of certificate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMMjag Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 I'm firmly in the live and let live camp but Ah, classic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Ah, classic. Fantastic contribution! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted October 29, 2015 Share Posted October 29, 2015 Wow! So, now people should be bullied if they happen to hold views that differ to the LGBTQFGUANNE (or whatever the hell they call themselves these days) lobby? I'm firmly in the live and let live camp but I find some of this right-on fascism (let's call it what it is) genuinely terrifying. We should bully racists, homophobes, transphobes and sexists if it is thought necessary and expedient to change their behaviour, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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