Handsome_Devil

Your journalistic criticism is entirely fair, it's just not necessarily fair to direct it at GM. I mean it might be but nobody other than him or his sports desk know that. As for folk needing sacked, well, that's pretty subjective as well. There's no doubt breaking a non-NDA is serious and not to be done lightly but if someone (some two? three?) in FP sees the more, eh, gung-ho members of our support get carried away by the mistaken thought of riches, and Erik setting a narrative in the BBC they believe to be false having seen the details, are they not to be commended for taking personal risk in a bid to set the record straight a little?

I absolutely love Scottish football at times, we must be the only industry that is desperate for customers that frequently makes it so needless hard to actually go to games.

He fannied the Killie comparison for sure but I think he'll turn out to be straight down the on piste with this one when we see the details...time will tell.

It's definitely not poor from all involved, it's literally GM's job to dig out stories And sure, whoever is leaking may have an agenda but for GM all that matters is it's factually true - now everyone will judge themselves whether to believe the rumours we've seen but personally when I weigh up what has been said and by whom, my reading of various financials and balancing the probabilities, I'm pretty confident he's reporting the truth in terms of the deal. And if it stinks, well that's certainly problematic in one way, yes, but if the media is the only way those in the know can alert us early to perceived danger or risk, is that still a bad thing? Remember the irregular verb from 'Yes, Minister': "I give confidential security briefings. You leak. He has been charged under section 2a of the Official Secrets Act." So hat-tip to GM for me ,assuming he's got his sources checked properly, and a wrap on the knuckles for his subbie.

We've all heard the rumours of what the deal was, I suspect GM has it from sources. I find it a little sloppy from the Herald this wasn't made clear. Put it this way, despite the soft soap words on the BBC, if you had to bet right now on whether the deal saw us lose control or not, I know where most people would put their chips. We obviously don't need to do that but if that's the offer, even if he's an interesting guy, I'd be telling him to jog on.

Quite the change for a club that doesn't even bother tweeting the youth team games! I'm not especially into these things but hasn't that been done before?

Yeah, you're not wrong in principle but football clubs, not just ours, have leaked like sieves for years and probably always will.

If I'm feeling optimistic, I'd say that's a very positive interview. If it's true, he should understand our concerns and have a partnership where he can get some return while we protect ourselves. Alternatively if he says all that then still insists on 51% it would be quite the red flag. My only worry is some of our fans would happily hand over control based on an interview where he promises to be nice!

Not an if as in you believe him or not an if as in you think he's full of shit? One person's rumour is another's inside scoop...up to you.

Fair play, if that's true, it's almost impossible to argue with on principle. However, that's still a big if for me. It certainly doesn't tie in with what was said at the AGM or the rumours about the early talks. And it's far from convincing on just why he's bothering to do this if he's not after profit... buying some wee club thousands of miles away as a toy just cause you like football? Nah... But he's talking a good game which at least seems to show some understanding of our potential concerns. An interesting start, for sure.

Can only echo what's been said but while you can easily predict a five or six goal thriller, I could also imagine Dundee winning early drains the energy from our game and it's goalless or 1-0 either way. Would like to see SOD in for Devine, Miller for Halliday.

Dundee having a last game after Saturday definitely changes things, potentially to their advantage. Couple of examples assuming Rangers won tonight I'd dreamt up for out thread. If we're 0-0 v Hibs with 15 to go (don't laugh, or call it 2-2) and Dundee are losing 1-0, of course we need to risk everything and go for it but Hibs are in a wonderful dilemma. They'll know Dundee will also be risking everything for a goal so do they shut up shop for their draw and rely on Aberdeen holding on as well or do they keep pushing for a winner incase Dundee score? If both games are draws late on, Dundee will also know a late winner likely at Fir Park (because both will be playing 2-3-5 at this point) which means they'll probably feel obliged to go for it a bit as well (in case the goal falls for Hibs) which opens the risk Aberdeen mug them. I'm not overly fussed because 1) we've been shite and don't deserve it 2) I didn't think you'd lose on Saturday 3) even if it worked out we've no chance of catching St Mirren 4) the sheer joy of the Rangers statement So batter in and play next Wednesday. I am curious though, could the spfl have ordered a venue change as plan B, is that in the rules? Dundee obviously don't give a f**k about the split so there's no way they volunteer to do anything other than what they've done. I imagine Hibs and their fans will generally feel more hard done by than me mind.

Rangers have taken the news in the calm and dignified manner you'd expect.

There were also eyebrows raised on the Dundee thread the other day about their season ticket prices for next year. The club currently will charge fans as much as we can, while balancing short and long-term benefit, and you know 100% that any excess money will be reinvested in the club/community. Have an investor in charge and it's entirely possible your season ticket price increase is labelled profit and sent to someone else who gives precisely zero fucks about the club beyond 2027. I seem to have fallen into the trap of appearing to be very against all investment, I'm actually not. It's a nuanced thing and everyone should come to personal judgements weighing up risks, rewards and god knows how many ifs, buts and maybes. But seeing people treat this as a cut and dried case because fan ownership has "failed" and "investment is needed to take us to the next level" makes me want to bang my head against the wall.

Or if we could look and see the medium/long-term success stories from other clubs with investors.

Anonymous.

If we'd just styled it out at the AGM we'd be looking like geniuses right now. But yeah, as much as this chunk of decision making has turned out brilliantly, I don't think there's too much credit to be had - circumstances have just clicked to make us look better than we were. There's also a lesson I hope that is learned which is it's one thing holding off till deadline in summer, in January the risk of doing that is much greater. If we're after a 'nice to have' addition or a player in a soft position to fill (speedy English wing-back etc), sure, wait and take our chances. But if through injury, recalls etc, we have no choice but to fill a key shirt, accept the expense and pay what's needed to get that confirmed in the first half of the month. The last 48 hours, when everyone is desperate and there are only shiters on the market anyway, is a total lottery.

I can no longer remember the massive list of guys we failed to get but there was more than half a dozen and not one of them makes you think we missed out on much at all. So far, at least.

It's obviously not an exact comparison but I find the current time kind of reminiscent of the late 90s/early 00s when all manner of clubs were spending money wildly. Back then there was the hope/expectation that the TV money would be never ending and financial reality was ignored. Eventually the whole house came crashing down - and while the absolute wave of administrations didn't happen as predicted, those who avoided our fate still went through some brutal restructuring. St Johnstone were one of the few who didn't get involved in that pissing contest but it's worth remembering (unless my memory is playing tricks, you'll know better than me), this wisdom was hardly warmly welcomed by fans, who were instead raging you got relegated and frustrated it took years to return. Nowadays the numbers are not quite so mental but the basic premise remains the same - tonnes of folk are investing heavily and the path to profit here is, shall we generously say, optimistic on current projections. Is there a belief TV/media rights/sponsorship/European competition will change things dramatically? I think you can definitely argue Scottish football is undervalued but to this extent...hmm. St Mirren have steadied a lot and but assuming Ogren pushes the boat to ensure survival next season even without replicating earlier madness, you have the big city clubs, both from Dundee and Killie's lad combing to guarantee that someone will be spending a lot of money - that in the majority of cases they clearly don't have - to finish no higher than eighth. And it's hardly impossible one of the Saints or ourselves have an okay season to squeeze into the bottom of that pile even while being financially dull. You don't need to be businessman of the year to suggest that this, like 20 odd years ago is unsustainable. Maybe I'm just overly cautious, no doubt lots of our fans don't remember the previous implosion etc but it still strikes me as mental that people look at our current stable state of affairs and conclude that handing the keys to an investor to join this lunacy is a good idea.

The Conference League was a game-changer for Hearts, who started with an advantage and could spend more knowing there was finally a viable way to win that money back that didn't involve beating the Old Firm. But for everyone else that carrot comes with a huge amount of risk...we could invest literally millions on top of what we'd naturally be able to spend and for what, we're still well off the revenue Hearts can make so the chances of winning it back playing football are low. Even Hibs and Aberdeen are currently a whack behind Hearts and they're clearly levels above us. So just how Ogren intends to get his money back, god knows...if Dundee have a viable cunning plan then fair enough but when you look at what they've sunk in already, it needs to be going some to bring a profit.

Aye... I mean, I should clarify that I was being facetious, Dundee have been a financial basket case for decades (or so it seems) so maybe these guys are doing the best they can to pick up the broken pieces. I've totally forgotten the details of how they got here. But it is highly amusing that we present our stable as anything accounts and some people demand investors because the likes of Dundee might get away from us only for them to publish that total black hole. To be fair, there is no indication their current owners aren't committed and of course in that scenario you can live with losses for a bit...but still. Rather them than us 100%, even if they do outbid us now and again.

Can't wait for us to get an investor.

I dunno if Kettlewell is capable of keeping these chats short but I like to imagine him simply showing Wells the gaping holes in the budget for next season and throwing him a number eight shirt.

Obviously I wasn't out there planting a boot on the pitch last Saturday but essentially it looked absolutely fine... you'd hope whatever temporary fixes Dundee have work again. If you could net on it, I reckon it'll get played Wednesday as planned. Personally I wouldn't mind it being delayed a week if needs must but you imagine Motherwell (and Hibs obviously) would go tits about sporting integrity given forcing Dundee to play behind closed doors on Thursday, say, would suit us perfectly.

Very fair. Rangers are clearly fragile as well, score a couple early and great but a massive bottle job from them wouldn't surprise you either.