[Rugby Union]

Scotland training squad.

Just noticed there is no mention of Strauss at all, is he being dropped completely?

[Rugby Union]

41 minutes ago, dogmc said:

Hastings has yet to play a game for Glasgow so probably too early to call him up yet. Burleigh covers 10 and centre and is a pretty smart player. Have liked him so far at embra but didn't realise he was eligible.

Bhatti I dont think has started a league game for Glasgow either, and Im sure he has played for Bath. He signed for Embra in 2014, so would be elligible at some point soon, my thinking is although we might get 2 or 3 years out of Burleigh I would rather be looking a bit more long term for back up at 10 / potential replacement for Finn

[Rugby Union]

Couple of strange picks in their but the stand out for me is, Phil Burleigh (is he in under 3 years residency or does he have a scottish granny?) at 30 over Jackson / Hastings / Thompson is a suprise

 

[Rugby Union]

From the sounds of the Tait piece on the BBC it makes out we are trying to identify exiles now residency is out the window and these tie up seem to be a way of getting exiles game time to help develop at a decent level without having to go to Glasgow or Edinburgh

[Rugby Union]

54 minutes ago, Doonhamer doon south said:

 

On the subject of two tiers I think this would be a good option after a few years time.

 

Go back to a PRO 12 with the 4 Irish, 4 Welsh, 2 Scots and 2 South Africans. This would likely be a very competitive league with teams capable of beating each other. Underneath this have 2 regionalised conferences EAST and WEST using the format being used in this years PRO 14. Play teams in same conference home AND away and play other conference home OR away. 6 teams in each conference gives 16 regular fixtures and add in play offs to fill out the season. The conference winners play each other to determine who will play in a Promotion/Relegation Playoff with the last place finish in the PRO 12.

Conference East  

2 Georgian Franchises

2 Romanian Franchises

2 Russian Franchises

 

Conference West 

2 Italian Franchises 

1 Spain Franchise

1 German Franchise

1 Namibia Franchise

1 Scottish (REDS)
 

This opens up a vast amount of opportunity to all the tier 2 nations. The Italians although dropping a level would be in a situation where they are winning more games and be competitive. Gives an opportunity for the SRU to develop a third pro team without worrying about the team not being competitive. By keeping the initial conference at 6 teams there is room for future expansion. The PRO 12 would be exciting at both ends of the table. The emerging nations would be part of a format where they can develop their players at club level on the international stage. 

On a side note I think there should be an unattached Americas Conference made up of

2 USA

2 Canadian

1 Uruaguay 

1 Argentina 

 

6 teams again but sticking to their own time zone. Best to do this at twice home and away for 20 league games. 

I think the issue would be that any 2nd tier would struggle for TV deal / advertising / sponsorship as it would be seen as a 2nd class competition. I agree that it is probably the best way forward, however it may be that some sort of conference system at the top level would need to be in place first until there is enough teams involved as it may put off new teams joining not being at the top table.

[Rugby Union]

been away so just catching up on things but thoughts on the following,

Pro14

The Pro12 needs much more income or all the best players are going move to France or England who have much more money to spend. The 2 SA teams are going to double the existing TV money as a start. 2 conferences is not ideal but 26 league games would be too many. I think it will stick at 2 conferences if / when the US & Canadians join, then move to 2 leages of 10 if they can find another 4 teams from somewhere. Dont like the additional derby game just so the Irish and Welsh  teams can play each other h&a, but its the best of a bad lot

Semi-Pro Super 6 league

Not sure what to make of this - something had to happen at the level below Pro14 in Scotland so kudos on the SRU for doing something, and I can see where they are trying to go with ringfencing all the professional players in one competition - it looks like 3 clubs each will come under the umberella (and obviously get fringe players from) Glasgow and Edinburgh so they are not spread as thinly as present ( at the moment in league games one club could be boosted by 2 or 3 pro's and the other wont have any). However the money they are talking about is peanuts - about £140 k over 35 players is £4k each or £200 a game. Also dictating that the other teams can pay players is abhorrent, does this include coaches etc as well? It means that players / coaches are not going to advance to bigger clubs as they are just going to stay local. I would like to see them trying to get involved with some cross border competitions with the Italian league or joining the 3rd tier European competition, but I suppose they should now at least be competitive in the B&I cup.

Super Rugby

I think the issue is their conference system was trying to copy the NFL system, and they also have a much shorter season traditionally than in hte NH hence only 15 games (and why they lose all the best players to France as they dont have as much income). Rugby has only recently introduced league systems (its only about 30 odd years since there was no league rugby in England and it was all just friendlies and the John Player cup). I dont know what format the Super Rugby are going to adopt now, I think its down to 3 conferences so will see how that pans out.

 

[Rugby Union]

How come Scotland ain't playing in the lassies world cup?

We lost to Spain in qualifying

[Rugby Union]

For me the only way this is going to work is taking the top six club sides at the moment, but caveat of decent facilities and location so they are spread out well. Then have a draft off all the institute of sport and other Glasgow & Edinburgh players who are going to be involved. If each club gets 7/8 players from there the £100k maybe pays for another 3/4 then they are still looking at funding 15 go 20 guys pt a year. Which is probably close to what most of them are already. Hopefully they may be able to get a few teams in the European challenge cup and the rest in the trophy for a few more matches although don't know if that clashes with b&I cup

[Rugby Union]

In terms of games it sounds like 6 b&I cup then 10 league then playoffs

[Rugby Union]

Its only £100k per team a year over 5 years, total £3m. Its not many games so don't know where the money is coming from to pay for players, unless it's all going to be institute of sport players loaned out to get game time

[Rugby Union]

You would have thought the likes of Ayr and Stirling would ve in the mix, as the others plus you would have thought the likes of additional borders teams. Maybe Dundee if n&m goes to Aberdeen

[Rugby Union]

3 hours ago, salmonbuddie said:

That's the part that's difficult to believe...

 

Its probably part of our new 5 year plan to win the world cup

[Rugby Union]

16 minutes ago, salmonbuddie said:

Nice to see Murchie get a good gig to (presumably) end his playing career.

I wonder if this is the reason he didn't get re-signed by Glasgow (and hasn't been snapped up by anyone else) if the SRU had planned for him to get this player coach role for quite some time. Does look like the SRU are actually doing some long term planning to get development players some decent game time

[Rugby Union]

First time I have heard of this

http://www.scotsman.com/sport/rugby-union/first-players-in-scottish-rugby-nice-exchange-revealed-1-4513746

A budget of €1.4m probably is bigger than the top Premiership clubs in Scotland, but surely they could have found a club a bit higher than the 4th tier in France? London Scottish is a much higher standard to start with

[Rugby Union]

Story on the BBC website makes it sound as if it is indeed a zebco

[Rugby Union]

2 hours ago, dogmc said:

Will they get to keep the history and the titles??

Dont think so as there's been too much walking away (and 4 years of history is not much to shout about!)

 

Had just looked back to see when they replaced Aironi and how bad had they been. Aironi lasted 2 years, and finished bottom both years, but probably not as bad as Zebre last year, were averaging about 4000 in crowds first year although lost 21 out of 22 picked up 8 losing bonus points and beat Bairitz in Europe, who topped their group, and next season won 4 beating Munster and Edinburgh

What caught my eye was that in 2010-11 Trevisio finished 10th, above Glasgow in 11th  with a won 9 lost 13 record (would have been above Connaught  if not for bp) and again in 2011-12 they finished 10th above Edinburgh with a won 7 lost 15 record, and Glasgow would finish 4th.

[Rugby Union]

The Italian federation took over the running of Zebre half way through last season as they were bust, and there has been talk ever since of a franchise in Rome. I wonder if this is just a pre-cursor of formally closing down the Zebre (and wiping out the debt) and creating a new club in Rome for a fresh start.

[Rugby Union]

Yeah he is waiting to sue anyone starting a pro rugby team in the US as he has an exclusivity deal for another season or so. Canadian rugby is in a worse state than the US to be fair, they are still amateur club and amateur regions, no pro rugby at all in Canada. They were in talks to set up teams with the US Pro league, and got a huge amount of stick by rugby fans in Canada for not going ahead with it, but seems they did the right thing.

[Rugby Union]

10 minutes ago, Doonhamer doon south said:

The pro league only lasted one season didn't it?

yeah, the guy that was running it (US RFU didnt have much involvement as far as I am aware) seems a bit of a charlatan, he basically set up and owned all the clubs, contracted all the players, etc etc and was expecting loads of sponsorship and tv money that didnt materialise. He didn't pay the players on time, if at all, but expected them to be held to the contracts and not go elsewhere. There were stories of restaurants that the teams were using not being paid for players lunches for weeks on end, coaches having to fork out their own pockets to feed the players etc.

Its what happens when you try to force through franchises over organically growing the club game (which is actually quite big in the US as is the college rugby programmes), you need deep pockets at the start as it takes time to build, although probably better long term.

[Rugby Union]

The us franchise would be in now if it wasn't for the legal wranglings with the us pro league that has just folded. Canadians would be in as well but there isn't a suitable stadium for them, would need to be indoor with correct astroturf

[Rugby Union]

Having just reread and there will be 3 derbies next season so the welsh and Irish can play home and away against all 4 clubs 21 games in total

[Rugby Union]

4 minutes ago, Salvo Montalbano said:

 

Aren't they doing 3 home, 3 away and then a home and away for a derby match? Gives 2 Edinburgh v Glasgow, 2 All-Italian and 2 All-South African games etc and although it does mean potentially more difficult games for some conference contenders it's what's done in other sports.

Thats how I understood it. Play everyone in your conference home and away for 12 matches, then everyone in the other conference once either home or away for another 7, then your "derby" team once for a total of 20 games.

IM hoping it works out well for next season, and to be fair each club is going to receive an extra £0.5m from SARFU plus i think it was £11m a year to share out in additional TV money. If things go well it could be a huge boost as the UK TV deal is up again at the end of the season and if its been a success may add quite a bit to that

[What Was The Last Movie You Watched?]

Bill and Teds Excellent Adventure 10/10

One of my fav movies ever, so was introducing it to the kids, still found it really funny, some bits have aged, but still dont think it affects the movie that much, still a really fun, incredibly stupid movie

Lone Ranger 5/10

ok-ish movie, a few laughs, and some ok action and some poor CGI a times. If you enjoy Johnny Depp doing Jack Sparrow, this is him doing basically the same, but as Tonto

[Rugby Union]

I think Samoa play off vs the 2nd team from Europe

[Rugby Union]

16 minutes ago, Doonhamer doon south said:

3rd pro team would make perfect sense in a conference system as highlighted. It would be expensive initially but I believe Scottish rugby is on the up and it may be wise to take advantage of that. It may well be that the sru are pursuing this but keeping cards close to the chest on it.

As it stands there are

4 Irish
4 welsh
2 Scots
2 Italian
2 SA tbc
1 American franchise 2018
1 team could either be as I see it a
3rd Scots team or a Canadian franchise or western European franchise team (Spanish or german)

I believe the sru should be making the effort to get a third team in if it's affordable and sustainable

Two conferences of 8 sounds really good to me top 4 of each go to playoffs.

There a few options in the mix for the last place to make it 16.

3rd Scottish team

Canadian team - they have been sounded out but would probably need an indoor stadium as cant play outdoor during winter

Spanish - They have a solid semi-pro league already, recent finals between the 2 Valladolid sides have attracted 15-20k attendances (held in  Real Valladolids stadium) Spanish RU have been asked but stated dont have the funds for a Pro team

Germany - Wild who owns Sunny Delight is the main backer of the German RU (runs the Wild rugby academy) but has just bought Stade Francias so probably not a good time for them

Georgia - good bet as have the govt backing and a lot of private investment in rugby infrastructure. Plenty of players available also, but same arguments as 6N's in what would they bring financially to the Pro12. Not huge TV market, probably no away fans coming over.