Raven

Day 2 complete. Europe 8-2. Sky already making plans for how to fill in 4 hours on Thursday.

Bump, that time of year again. Unusual looking Team Europe with no Neils Feijen or Darren Appleton, and no English players at all. The Mosconi experience is provided by Ralf Souqet, and there is Scottish interest once again with Jayson Shaw returning having secured the winning point last year (and just in time for me to scuttle off to Camden with 15 mins to spare before Jaya The Cat took to the stage at the Underworld). The euro team is completed by Nick Van Den Berg, David Alcaide and first timer Joshua Filler. The betting odds are behind another European win. It has to be more competitive than last year.

Fair point , but not inconsistent with other sources. I get the impression that its role as the "Spanish economic powerhouse" is being overstated in some articles.

The BBC has it at 19% http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-29478415 "It is one of Spain's wealthiest regions, making up 16% of the national population and accounting for almost 19% of Spanish GDP."

Madrid tried to beat the hell out of Messi. What a finish.

Didn't seem that long a wait in the arena tbh, time for a slash and getting the next beers in. Bit of booing for it being cut short but everyone should have known going in it would happen unless USA got some wins. The announcer had to pretend it was for reasons other than the USA team being 'uncompetitive'. If Europe win 3 tonight it could mean walking up that bloody hill tomorrow for one game.

Back at the action.. Mark Gray looked bang on form and a couple of the Europe players dug out results when they were having to fight for it. Not counting chickens yet but there's a gig on Friday night I might be at after the mosconi win

Was sat next to one of the more dickish ones. Group behind us being fairly funny and this attention seeking twat trying to copy and making a dick of himself. Hopefully he got the message.

Luton Town have announced their preferred site for a new stadium. Announcement has gone down well with fans as it bucks the trend for out of town bowls.

5-3 now. Am heading to Blackpool tomorrow for the rest of the tournament. US team making a better match of it than last year.

I recently received a powerpoint from a project manager which on one slide advised us that dates were both "moving out" and "moving to the right". i had to ask him about his aversion to the word "later".

Cheers for that, I think we have our 'victors'

If there are no victors, what happened to everyone who got a bit richer with a bloody big loan, now once again absolutely confirmed as loans, that nobody seems to want back?

Their apology amounted to admitting that the cops lied to them and that they chose to lead with, and sensationalise, this misinformation without any validation or corroboration. Since that's the standard of their 'journalism', I don't need them sticking this dross through my door. If they choose to do so, they can have it back. I'd like to say passed through a cow first, but that wouldn't be fair on the cow, the posties, or the temps they'll be taking on to open the extra mail that week. I suspect it's not legal to post such things either (if anyone has experience in this, please confirm), and I wouldn't wan't the cow to get in trouble.

Seems like he has worse effect on his own playing partners with the crap he's spouting. He won't want to make eye contact with Darren when this is all done though

Plus, the positioning of the racked balls.

Nipples can withstand fire if soaked in Martini.

Since you bring up the Ghana one.. bloody harsh sending off. Didn't see the Ghana players verify with the referee, if they had benefited from a temporary suspension in the offside rules. No - every single one, as the cliche goes, "played to the whistle". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B44k3-Z9aCE 2 mins in.

and the crowd went wild Brilliant shot!

Find Hatch more of a wind up merchant than Strickland ever was-but it's just part of the act from him. All good entertainment. Looking forward to getting down there on Wednesday.

Repeated it once. It clearly wasn't the most important point. Consider it closed. No scattergun required. Target those responsible. And learn the lessons, some of which did happen. Starting with, prevent those convicted from travelling to future games. The accounts of the witnesses had to be considered, to learn those lessons, and innocent people who were in that stadium did want questions answered about why they were put in that situation. Just have to leave it at that then, we disagree. I don't see the 'fanbase' as being a unit, where the views of some reflect on others. I'd be offended to be associated with the views of some of them, and I don't feel any personal link to their views. If that leaves me open to being included in your definition of a hypocrit, so be it. And then we can get back on topic.

Search far and wide? Behave. You're talking to one. Every single person who provoked or took part in the violence there is to blame and should be held accountable for their own actions. Far more than the 14 that were convicted, obviously. Again, please do point me to any idiots who denied any Liverpool fans responsible should have been brough to justice. I'd hate to think such an opinion went unchallenged. The ludicrous claim here was that calls from Liverpool fans for justice are hollow because of what other Liverpool fans did or said about Heysel.

Glad you clarified that. Sorry, I contributed to the suggestion of that needless point scoring exercise - it detracts from my point. Yes, you will find plenty who mention other factors which you can consider as deflections, if it suits you to. Example- The fact that the ground was a crumbling hole isn't relevant if noone fights - noone gets hurt. Once there was trouble, it's a huge factor in the safety of everyone there- including the innocent fans. Is it a deflection to mention factors relevant to the security of the paying customer - no. Can you point me instead towards the ones who have said that anyone from the UK (or the Liverpool fans) guilty of provoking or taking part in the violence should not be brought to justice and held accountable for their own personal actions? BTW, my whole problem with this is the labelling of the "Liverpool fanbase" or any other clubs fans or football fans in general based on whatever idiots are in there midst. That attitude had a huge part in the fences being put up in grounds in the first place. If you find anyone with the view in the question above - ****'em, but they dont represent anyone i know.

Consistency doesn't mean that the families, relatives, friends of the victims, and to a lesser extent others who were there that day, and decent football fans in general, and taxpayers of this country, are denied justice because of your, or anyone else's, percieved bad taste due to comments made by someone else about a different incident, just because they might happen to support the same football team. Consistency should mean bringing those responsible to face justice. Not covering up for 23 years, paying some off on enhanced pensions. It should mean taking the correct actions,just like after Heysel, when the government were quick to round up and deport some of those involved to face manslaughter charges. Should have been more. There are plenty of LFC fans who agree with that. You can no doubt point to some examples of deflection.. there will always be some defensiveness. You can't deny the many more who were shamed by the hooligans in their "own" supports, and those who were embarrased and shamed even watching similar at football grounds up and down the country at the time..shamed that it was going on around football and wanting the whole lot dealt with, not this point scoring of this lot are worse than our lot.

worthwhile reading that Post-Hillsborough disaster editorial.