Jaggy McJagface
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Posts posted by Jaggy McJagface
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6 minutes ago, andyg83 said:
It's really quite simple. Scotland games should be a time for everyone to bury their club allegiances and get behind the team. It never used to be political even in the aftermath of the 2014 referendum.
Since when did you have to be a nationalist to support the team? The thing I like about the games is that it is different from all the club and sectarian sh1te that we get for the most part throughout the year.
It's also hilarious that folk seem to think I am a bootlicking Unionist who supports the monarchy. Those that know me that this is definitely NOT how you would describe me in real life.
Aside from all this. The queen died a year ago. why are we even bothered about it know.
We do put our club allegiances on the back burner at Scotland games. The only ones who don’t, it seems, are royalist rangers fans who want a wee greet about an anthem being booed. Funnily enough, my politics aren’t based on which team I support anyway, so that shouldn’t be particularly relevant.
Scotland fans have been booing GSTQ since the 70’s when the SNP were basically irrelevant. The c***s moaning about it now and blaming it on Scottish nationalists very clearly have an agenda of their own.
Again, if it bothers you, just don’t go to England games. It’s not going to change.
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37 minutes ago, andyg83 said:
No just keep politics out of Scotland games.
There just no need for it as it is meant to be a team for everyone in Scotland but just folk with certain political views. A unifying force for good.
Plenty folk accuse the OF of behaving like knuckledraggers for the same reason.
They put politics into Scotland games when they held a minutes applause for the queen before the Ukraine game. England using GSTK is also politically charged and is always going to get blowback.
The thing about people like you is you only seem to get upset about it when it’s political sentiment you don’t like that gets an airing.
The TA have been booing GSTK/Q since the 70’s. It’s genuinely mind boggling that people are only now trying to make a big deal out of it. It’s almost as if the bed wetting complainers have a certain political agenda at play…
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2 minutes ago, Brother Blades said:
Good on the lad Sloss for being upfront. But why not say something sooner? Lawyers & a rich guy? Probably.
I think Catherine Ryan basically said it was a combination of not wanting to be sued into oblivion by his army of lawyers and the fact she wasn’t a victim herself so it wasn’t her place to make it public. I imagine that’s why others were the same.
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53 minutes ago, Ziggy Sobotka said:It is a societal issue. It just manifests itself more noticeably within football (or more particularly within a couple of clubs) these days.
Football is the only thing that continues to give it oxygen.
Sectarianism in Scotland came about due to a lot of political, cultural, economic and religious friction due to large scale immigration from Ireland (from both communities) and the nativist anti-Catholic response to that immigration.
Nowadays basically nobody goes to church, and the vast majority of those descended from Irish immigrants see themselves as primarily Scottish and are accepted as such. Catholics and Protestants no longer compete for jobs or political influence as they did in most of the 20th century.
In short, most of these societal issues that led to sectarianism being rife in Scotland no longer meaningfully exist.
There’s zero reason for young guys in the 21st century to be singing about the troubles or the UVF or whoever else as it’s completely irrelevant to their lived experience. The only reason they do that is because they think that’s what they need to be into in order to be a “proper Rangers man”.
A large portion of the sectarianism you still see in Scotland is essentially a hangover from this period that is kept around because the two biggest football clubs based their identity around exploiting these cultural issues to build their support bases when they were still relevant, and neither have made an effort to shed them.
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On our day we can be lethal in attack but I don’t think we’ll have the consistency or the defence to challenge the Arabs.
We finally coped well under a prolonged spell of pressure last night though, so hopefully we’ll see more of the same in that regard.
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17 minutes ago, HighlandWarrior said:
No not at all - I was replying to a poster who stated "Think we've only booed Israel and England that I'm aware of." & mentioned the pockets/individuals booing the Republic of Ireland, Costa Rica & Georgia anthems as an example of what I've heard
Surely a smattering of individuals that are promptly told to be quiet isn’t comparable the widespread booing throughout the anthems of England/Israel?
I wouldn’t boo any European anthem apart from those two and I suspect a large portion of Scotland fans are the same going by what can be observed from recent years.
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17 minutes ago, Ewanandmoreagain said:
The vast majority of national anthems should not be booed
The vast majority of anthems are not booed at Hampden.
GSTK and Israel are the only ones I’ve seen get booed and they are both fair game.
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1 hour ago, HuttonDressedAsLahm said:
Exactly. Spain still have Cyprus (A) and Georgia (H) to go. Even if we'd scored another few, in the above scenario, the best we could have hoped for would be an approximate equal GD with Spain going into the final two games. They could easily score another 10 without reply, and there just isn't a planet where we'd do the same (or better) against Georgia/Norway.
It's useful knowing that being 1-0 down doesn't massively change everything. A draw is enormous for us, but even losing a late goal wouldn't be catastrophic.
As has been mentioned above/elsewhere, going into the last two games having already qualified and knowing 2/2 wins wins us the group would the type of pressure this team would enjoy. As much as the Ukraine game remains painful, we've done exactly what was required in the latter stages of WCQ, and the UNL, so I'm pretty positive about this team's ability to grind results against teams of a weaker/similar level to us.
To note: Norway are the complete opposite. They lost late goals against Serbia in the Euro 2020 playoff; bottled WCQ by drawing 1-1 away to Turkey; drawing 0-0 at home to Latvia; and losing 2-0 away to Netherlands in their last 4 games.
They then started with 4 wins and a draw in the UNL, before losing away to Slovenia and again at home to Serbia.
We're also aware of their profligacy against Georgia away, and their poor performance/result against us.
If there was a nation in Europe more likely to 'bottle' an opportunity than us historically, then it's this current Norway side.
Norway haven’t qualified for anything since 2000.
They chucked away 3 points against us in the last minute at home and then almost did the same against Georgia this week.
Even if we completely collapse from here, Norway don’t have the bottle to capitalise.
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Can people please stop trying to draw a false equivalence between the ableist Harry Kane chant and Lizzie’s in a box.
The Kane one needs binned pronto.
The royals are fair game and you should be expecting that GSTK gets booed and the Lizzie chant gets sung against England. If that’s not for you then you might be better off at the rugby.
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14 minutes ago, realmadrid said:
People who want to go are making sure they have the points
In our group we have one who is on 12 just now, who was studying overseas for a few years and only got a membership at Christmas 21, hes got flights to all 3 upcoming away games and with 1 home to go hopes to get to 19 points by the end of the year, another who has had a membership for a few years but tends to only do 1 away every couple of years is on 13, he cannot do Spain but has booked flights for France and Georgia to get to 17 by the year end when we expect the tickets to go on sale.
With not many getting points in Faroe islands or Moldova (despite the number who went) id expect to see a lot more members in the 14 to 18 point bracket than there was in the delayed Euros.
Not everybody has the money or holiday allowance to go to multiple away games before Germany 2024, though.
I’d expect there to be a large amount of people on 12 points who’ve been to every home game scrambling to try and get tickets.
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2 hours ago, Derry Alli said:
Let's not make it out it's just Rangers and Celtic fans. Plenty of times people have posted on here about their own fanbases shouting stuff, be it racist, homophobic or whatever. When asked if they done anything at the time it's always "Nah, there was a few of them/I had my children with me".
Turning a blind eye and bleating about it online is a problem in our society as a whole.
You’ll get a few bad apples in any football crowd or walk of life.
This isn’t a good comparison though, because in the case of rangers it’s clearly not just “a few bad apples” engaging in bigotry because a culture of sectarianism remains rife throughout the club at all levels. In many ways the club’s very identity has been built upon it.
Nobody expects people to start squaring up with people in the stand.
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36 minutes ago, Jives Miguel said:
I really can't emphasize how much of a wet wipe, loser you have to be to be offended at booing of a song at a football match.
It's OK apparently for us to chant about England being a shitehole, for them to chant about us getting battered everywhere you go, or for us to harass and bully Harry Maguire. But how DARE you make a noise out your mouth when there's a piece of music playing over the tannoy
absolute disgrace!!
Royalists really are a precious bunch
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1 hour ago, nate said:
I agree. Norway beating Spain isn’t as unlikely as some are suggesting, given the probable group situation/mentality at the time. You have a home side throwing the kitchen sink at Spain knowing it’s win or out. And you have a Spain side with two easy matches still to come, ensuring them top spot whatever. Norway will be the more motivated on this occasion. This scenario is of course dependent on Spain beating us in Seville, which unfortunately I think is very probable. We had an outlandishly meagre 25% possession against them at Hampden, which might be some kind of record for a winning underdog at International level (anyone know if it actually is?). Expect similar stats in Seville. And Spain will certainly not be as complacent/arrogant this time around by changing 8 players from their previous match. If we get anything from this fixture it will be joyous surprise imo.
If Spain don’t beat Norway then finishing top is no longer in their hands, even if they skelp us 10-0 in Seville. They won’t be treating it like a kick about.
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1 minute ago, PrestersKTID said:
I'm on 9. I can get to 10 points if i go to Norway and there's another home game between then and the euros. Didn't go to the Poland game so it would drop off.
Had the week booked off for cyprus but had to cancel.
What's the chances of under 10points getting a ticket? If you go to every home game you can only get to a maximum of 12. Current list has that at 7132.
Annoying because there's always empty seats at major finals, probably tickets snapped up by touts or sponsors. the actual teams competing get pretty low allocations.
I am in a similar boat as you and should be on 11 by the time the tournament comes around. Looking at the updated points table, I suspect it’s going to be very difficult to get tickets through the SSC unless you’ve gained points from at least 1 away day.
A thing I’m holding out hope for is that there may be a few people who can only make one week of the tournament and won’t be applying for all 3 games.
Furthermore, if we get drawn in a group with some less glamorous teams like Albania or Finland then it might be easier to get tickets on the public sale or UEFA resale app due to reduced demand from locals/neutrals.
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2 hours ago, Smokerson said:
Dont think I have said they are, its just two chants I have heard following scotland in the last week that I dont particularly like. I also appreciate that people are different and this kind of stuff floats their boats, each to their own
Lumping them in together like you did implies that you do.
Any royal is fair game and chants/boos aimed at them are par for the course, I wouldn’t be overly concerned by stuff like that.
The Kane chants I fully agree need to be put in the bin.
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31 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:
I think you’re being unnecessarily personal here.
BUT, this does come back to one of your original points that was maybe a bit hyperbolic that remove football context and rangers would be shut down.
I doubt they would be shut down but you’d like to think if this shit wasn’t so normalised in Scottish football culture that any regulatory body would come down like a ton of bricks on any member trying to commercially exploit a bigoted culture. It simply wouldn’t fly.
Rangers seem to get away with some cheery campaigns and then a shrug of the shoulders and ‘we’ve done everything we can’.
I don’t doubt AJF is genuine and I’m sure everybody has met plenty Rangers fans that aren’t bigots in their life.
The thing that sticks out to me though is that all the “good ones” basically have to stick their heads in the sand to a certain degree, or minimise the extent of the problem, because by doing otherwise they’d have to reflect on how they support a club which encourages and normalises bigotry and has a hugely detrimental effect on society in the west of Scotland.
I often wonder what I’d do if I’d ended up a Rangers fan growing up (could have happened - my dad was one) assuming my values and politics are the same as they are now. I can’t imagine how I’d be able to stomach supporting such an organisation and I find it hard to understand those who do. I think that’s why a lot of people think even the “good ones” tacitly endorse the bigotry by continuing to support the club in spite of it.
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18 minutes ago, Smokerson said:
Been going to Scotland home and away games for over 30 years and the lizzie in a box and harry kanes a mongo chants are just cringeworthly. I can understand wee drunken neds singing this crap as some of them genuinely don't know what planet they are on but grown men shouting about someone who died and mocking a disability is just plain pish craic. Surely we are better than this? Thankfully people around me were telling them to shut up.
We have some good songs about scotland and our players and also the wee diego maradona dig, we should stick to this.
One of these things is not like the other.
I’ve seen a few people draw a false equivalence between the two already and it’s really tiresome.
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2 minutes ago, Jambomo said:
GSTK is a terrible choice for an anthem tbh.
I can’t imagine that even all of the English players necessarily love the royals, and even they may not want to sing a song that has almost nothing to do with England but is 100 % about supporting and serving the Royal family.
Let’s be honest, most of them blindly lap it up.
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2 minutes ago, deadasdillinger said:
Atmosphere at kick off was massive. Nothing on the pitch to get at all excited about so everyone ended up flat. It killed any potential atmosphere.
That’s kind of what I’m on about though. If we had a dedicated singing section we could get songs going throughout the match even when things aren’t going well. It could give the players a wee boost when things are looking tough.
As it is, the atmosphere seems entirely dependent on how well we are playing at any given moment.
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8 minutes ago, Stevie Kirk said:
Easy to sing when you are winning. They were very quiet when we got a goal back.
The atmosphere was dead against Cyprus and Georgia as well though. We could be doing a lot more to make Hampden a bit more intimidating to visiting teams.
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As an aside, I thought the atmosphere last night was a bit flat at times. That’s something I’ve noticed at Hampden on quite a few occasions recently, with the Spain game being a notable exception. The Nigel’s had a drum and were all singing and making lots of noise.
Might it be a good idea to get a dedicated singing section at Hampden rather than random disjointed pockets of the crowd trying and failing to get a song going?
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3 minutes ago, AJF said:
And we have since went through quite an extensive board room reshuffling with said individual no longer acting at the club.
I find it hard to believe that someone like Bisgrove, our new CEO (who came in previously as a marketing director or something along those lines) who had no prior affinity or connection with Rangers and isn’t even Scottish is now all of a sudden driving sectarianism at the club due to his own bigotry.
It’s not even been 12 months since he left. It’s not credible to argue that Rangers are all of a sudden no longer a bigoted institution due to a boardroom reshuffle when they happily had a guy who was overtly bigoted in such a senior role so recently.
It points to there being a culture within the club at the highest level that is tolerant of people with these views.
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1 hour ago, AJF said:
Why would me attending matches contradict my opinion that sectarian/bigoted chanting needs to stop?
And brushed it off how? I literally agreed that it happens but was likely motivated by commercial reasons rather than an actual sectarian structure at the club. It wasn’t me who originally made that point.
I personally think the “nobody involved at the club are bigots themselves, but just know how to make money off of them” argument is being very generous to Rangers.
This is a club that deemed it appropriate to appoint an Orangeman and DUP councillor as PR chief and later to the board. Not exactly a sign of a club that deems sectarianism to be unacceptable.
These attitudes remain rife throughout the club from the boardroom to the terraces.
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1 minute ago, DA Baracus said:
He's a p***k, bootlicking, servile w**k. Some good commentary doesn't change that. Almost certainly a huge Tory too.
I read that he and the other Rangers players in the squad refused to play for Scotland on the day of Diana’s funeral, which almost cost us points as the SFA had to scramble to get UEFA to agree to a last minute postponement.
Scandalous that he doesn’t get slaughtered for that.
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Behaviour of our Fans
in Tartan Army Ramblings
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Do you think large sporting events occur in a social and political vaccum? Any Scotland-England game will have a bit of an edge to it. I don’t see you complaining about the England fans political statements throughout.
Holy f**k you are tedious.
Ah, so you are okay with politics in football, but only if it’s a special occasion for the monarch. Gotcha.