Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[Guest]

BBC Sportsound ‏@bbcsportsoundLord Glennie proposes case go back to the #SFA appeal tribunal that upheld the initial decision by a judicial panel to impose 12 month ban

So, they run off back to the SFA who will do nothing more than ruffle Rangers' hair, tell them to run along and that will be that?

FFS.

[Ric]

Quite an embarrassing outcome, potentially.

First off, this xInfinity

[1] people are saying "well if you can't embargo, then expel them"; but that's hampered by the original judicial panel having said expulsion was too severe a punishment for the offence... I'd suggest it's difficult for them to say "no sorry we were kidding", as it'd leave them open to accusations (and re-appeals) that they were expelling them to cover-up their incompetence or hit them for going to court

They could of course back down from their initial ruling as they thought that a transfer embargo was both suitable and a punishment available to them. In reflection they could now say that in comparison to the only available punishments then expulsion is the closest.

That said, expulsion would obviously mean Rangers going through the appeals process (again).

[Skudbook]

1338305263[/url]' post='6283988']

As I said, they might struggle to justify it, even if they did have the balls. If it's correct that it's been sent back to the appeals panel since they cannot uphold the transfer embargo part... then they can give them 'lesser' punishments (Scottish Cup etc.) or the 'bigger' punishment (expulsion). But the panels, in their previous judgements, have already said that expulsion was too harsh?

Appeals panel are allowed a different view of course , otherwise there is no point in having them!

[Johnny van Axeldongen]

The SFA will teach Rangers a lesson by punting them from the Scottish Cup for a year and hammering them with a massive £15,000 fine.

[Claymores]

I can see the logic in the verdict. Simply a case of the sanctions not being available to the independent tribunal. It does ask some questions about what the tribunal members were thinking, even though they went to great lengths to explain the wrong-doing. That in itself was impressive, but I guess they havered, since, given the seriousness of it, expulsion was on the cards.

The tribunal does have the power to impose a further fine, of course - one that could cover theirs and Rangers' court expenses. They might just add a bit more to the total as well, just enough to make coming out of administration impossible until the end of the transfer window. In the meantime, the transfer embargo is lifted.

It doesn't - the fines were already at the maximums listed

[HibeeJibee]

The SFA should come out and say they do not recognise the jurisdiction of the COS in this matter and will refer the whole case to FIFA as the world governing body. We know where they stand on these matters. Simple get out of jail card for the SFA and directs all anger from Ibrokes towards the world governing body. That then means Rangers have to take on FIFA and all other member associations including the real big clubs that involves.

Firstly I doubt a mechanism exists to "not recognise the jurisdiction of the Court of Arbitration in Sport and refer the whole case to FIFA" (and what is "to FIFA": the world congress of 216 members?!?!). It's not Star Wars.

Secondly... if SFA really didn't have transfer embargos permitted under their rules, and really didn't sufficiently permit appeals to CAS, then there's no certainty FIFA would wholly side with them IMO.

[LinkinFighter]

Joke of a decision, Rangers will get out of this.

Hopefully FIFA or UEFA get involved.

[7-2]

I thought 1 maybe 2 of the SFA panel that made the decision were law lords or such therefore the decision was watertight?

They should not have anything to do with the SFA again and any fee they charged for sitting on the panel should be reimbursed to the SFA.

[rustyarabnuts]

The SFA should come out and say they do not recognise the jurisdiction of the COS in this matter and will refer the whole case to FIFA as the world governing body. We know where they stand on these matters. Simple get out of jail card for the SFA and directs all anger from Ibrokes towards the world governing body. That then means Rangers have to take on FIFA and all other member associations including the real big clubs that involves.

Lets see then how much of a global brand with a big world following they are......no drama, the stakes just got higher. Beautiful

was gonna give you a greeny as thats a cracking idea , but ive ran out

[The Master]

As I said, they might struggle to justify it, even if they did have the balls. If it's correct that it's been sent back to the appeals panel since they cannot uphold the transfer embargo part... then they can give them 'lesser' punishments (Scottish Cup etc.) or the 'bigger' punishment (expulsion). But the panels, in their previous judgements, have already said that expulsion was too harsh?

Harsh in the context of what they thought was available to them, surely?

So if the punishments available to a judge in a GBH trial were 10 hours of community service, 10 years in prison or life, then life is too harsh, so he goes for 10 years. But if the middle option weren't there, it has to be life and perhaps a recommendation to review the sentencing guidelines.

If the SFA have balls, that's what they'll do - suspend or expel, but with a recommendation that a transfer embargo be made available.

EDIT: which, worryingly, is kind of what Ric said.

Edited May 29, 2012 by The Master

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

Three observations on this:

[1] people are saying "well if you can't embargo, then expel them"; but that's hampered by the original judicial panel having said expulsion was too severe a punishment for the offence... I'd suggest it's difficult for them to say "no sorry we were kidding", as it'd leave them open to accusations (and re-appeals) that they were expelling them to cover-up their incompetence or hit them for going to court

[2] if as is being suggested, the embargo punishment was not allowed for under SFA's own rules, that's a major boo-boo considering they were rewritten by lawyers only 1yr ago

[3] if as is being suggested the rules didn't sufficiently establish the right of appeal to CAS, then Rangers can't really be done for going to court... where were they supposed to go?

Quite an embarrassing outcome, potentially.

This is massively contentious issue and two senior judges disagree on the reading of SFA rules. Lord Carloway explicitly said that the punishment was available to the tribunal a CoS judge says otherwise. If CoS was the only option for an appeal then Rangers shouldn't face punishment. The SFA should expect scorn, CAS should always be the final arbiter of sporting rules and forcing Rangers to the law courts has been damaging to the game.

If CAS told the SFA that a transfer embargo were illegal that would open a can of worms in many other leagues but it would be accepted since CAS is an impartial judge and specially created to resolve these situations.

[sjc]

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2m Grant Russell ‏@STVGrant

FIFA said just before verdict passed that Scottish FA will be told to take action so club "withdraws its request from the ordinary courts"

definately gonna get messy !

[HibeeJibee]

Appeals panel are allowed a different view of course , otherwise there is no point in having them!

Aye, but didn't the previous appeals panel agree with the original panel, i.e. that expulsion was too severe?

Rangers would be right off to CAS (or back to court) if the next appeals panel says "no no expulsion is actually a reasonable punishment". Which may still happen, granted.

[ray_of_licht]

from @STVGrant

Quote from FIFA on Rangers just before verdict: "FIFA will closely monitor the situation so that the issue is resolved as fast as possible."

FIFA said just before verdict passed that Scottish FA will be told to take action so club "withdraws its request from the ordinary courts".

FIFA eyes now on Scottish FA to uphold their rulebook and punish Rangers for taking this matter to court.

[welshbairn]

What's the difference between expelling them from the game, and terminating their SFA membership? What one hurts more?

[Colin M]

That said, expulsion would obviously mean Rangers going through the appeals process (again).

There would, by their own admission, be no further appeal process. The decision has been referred back to the Appeal Tribunal - they presumably could not take it to court again, as the court has judged that 1) they did bring the game into disrepute and 2) the punishment should be one chosen from the list.

I'm in the "banned from the cup for a year" camp.

[kildog]

...and back down again

Damn this thread!!!

They're still going to die... right?

[ScottR96]

Disband the cheating b*****ds immediately and make them start out in the non-leagues. The decision sums up Scottish football. A total joke.

[NeilPar72]

Grant Russell ‏@STVGrantFIFA said just before verdict passed that Scottish FA will be told to take action so club "withdraws its request from the ordinary courts".

Grant Russell ‏@STVGrantFIFA eyes now on Scottish FA to uphold their rulebook and punish Rangers for taking this matter to court.

[GordieBoy80]

Hardly surprising.

I fully expect Rangers to be in all Scottish competitions next season and start the season on 0 points because the governing bodies are all shitebags.