H_B Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Try saying this " Self governance ". Go on. Let the words slip off your tongue. We already have self governance. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 So by your definition, a person who wishes independence for Scotland because the believe they will be better served by that scenario, is not a nationalist. Not in the way of the concept of nationalism that your original post alluded to anyway. My first post of a criticism of someone saying that the only things to consider were, if Scotland was a country or not, and if you believe in democracy. I don't think they are the only two questions to consider. I'm not a nationalist. If I was Scottish and I was given the options I would look at how the status quo or independence would effect me. Whether I consider Scotland as a country or not wouldn't even come into it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 We already have self governance. Great. I think we should cut our International Aid Budget...... what is that? we don't control this... OK then how about cutting back the defence budget..... we don't control this either hmmmmm. Well in that case what about: Increasing Immigration, No? Data Protection, No? Broadcasting, No? foreign policies, No? Out of work benefits, no? Pensions, No? Well surely as the largest oil producing area of the EU we will at least be able to self govern in relation to this.................What - No again!!!!! Funny shade of self government we have in Scotland. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Great. I think we should cut our International Aid Budget...... what is that? we don't control this... OK then how about cutting back the defence budget..... we don't control this either hmmmmm. Well in that case what about: Increasing Immigration, No? Data Protection, No? Broadcasting, No? foreign policies, No? Out of work benefits, no? Pensions, No? Well surely as the largest oil producing area of the EU we will at least be able to self govern in relation to this.................What - No again!!!!! Funny shade of self government we have in Scotland. You won't control it post independence either. You'll just have a say at a general election when you consider who you vote for, just as you do now. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I am rather proud of my blue eyes. Fascist. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 That's right. I believe in the individual, and an individual's rights and achievements. There's no achievement in having been born on a particular part of the planet. Nobody said there was. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
git-intae-thum Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 My first post of a criticism of someone saying that the only things to consider were, if Scotland was a country or not, and if you believe in democracy. I don't think they are the only two questions to consider. I'm not a nationalist. If I was Scottish and I was given the options I would look at how the status quo or independence would effect me. Whether I consider Scotland as a country or not wouldn't even come into it. Lets further your line of thought then. In a hypothetical scenario, your argument suggests that you would be content that Berwick (or wherever you stay) was taken over by, for example, a greater German state. As long as it suited your individual circumstances? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Great. I think we should cut our International Aid Budget...... what is that? we don't control this... Right. What control will you have over this as part of a collection of 5,000,000 plus individuals with contrasting views? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BerwickMad Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Lets further your line of thought then. In a hypothetical scenario, your argument suggests that you would be content that Berwick (or wherever you stay) was taken over by, for example, a greater German state. As long as it suited your individual circumstances? Well yes, that's what I have been saying. I would weigh up the pro's and cons like I would with any decision. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Well yes, that's what I have been saying. I would weigh up the pro's and cons like I would with any decision. Yes, I'd likewise have no problem with this in theory. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 And the band played believe it if you like... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
git-intae-thum Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Well yes, that's what I have been saying. I would weigh up the pro's and cons like I would with any decision. Ok???? I respect that, if I find surprising. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antiochas III Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 We already have self governance. Hmmmm...... Right. What control will you have over this as part of a collection of 5,000,000 plus individuals with contrasting views? Hmmm.... So which one is it? We already have self governance or we'll never have self governance? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 And the band played believe it if you like... What would be your problem with this? The only issue I'd have would be increasing the scale exponentially would increase the likelihood of corruption on a massive scale, as has been evidenced with the EU. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 (edited) Right. What control will you have over this as part of a collection of 5,000,000 plus individuals with contrasting views? What 5m+ voters in Scotland? The SNP have surely taken this too far if they have given everyone the vote. When you add a 4 to the start of your number you begin to see how much less influence I have in the UK. Even less so given the FPTP system used for Westminster. Was I the only one that voted for proportional representation????? (even in the crap AV guise that it was offered!) Edited August 20, 2014 by strichener 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Hmmmm...... Hmmm.... So which one is it? We already have self governance or we'll never have self governance? I don't think you understand what self-governance is. Herre's a clue. We don't have our own persona; army and health service. I can't phone up Alex Salmond or David Cameron and tell them that actually they need to change their policies because I've decided I don't like them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 I don't think you understand what self-governance is. Herre's a clue. We don't have our own persona; army and health service. I can't phone up Alex Salmond or David Cameron and tell them that actually they need to change their policies because I've decided I don't like them. You actually can. If you lived where I do you could even go and chap on Alex's front door as I have done in the past. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 When you add a 4 to the start of your number you begin to see how much less influence I have in the UK. Even less so given the FPTP system used for Westminster. Was I the only one that voted for proportional representation????? (even in the crap AV guise that it was offered!) Sorry what? Your original point was about governmental policies you personally want changed hypothetically. You used the example of cutting the International Aid budget. What control will you have over whether we do this in an Independent nation of many millions of people? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 (edited) You actually can. If you lived where I do you could even go and chap on Alex's front door as I have done in the past. Which policy did he change on your say so? Are you Brian Souter? Edited August 20, 2014 by H_B 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaven Posted August 20, 2014 Share Posted August 20, 2014 Fascist. Don't you mean Nazi? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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