All things Dundee FC

[LM_0803]

30 minutes ago, Ludo*1 said:

Derry Vieira but every so often has a game where you're like - why has he forgot how to play football?

He's an absolute class act 90% of the time. A destroyer.

I was desperate for us to find a way of us signing Boateng as I think if Docherty found a way they could play together and keep McCowan and Cameron in the team (tall order admittedly) we'd have a very tasty midfield.

He massively needs support though. Was well off it today, but generally, he's the only player that's even attempting to protect the defence. It's quite unreal how well he does it sometimes all on his own!

Today was another example of him having to do it on his own and failing though, so for that reason the mulligan shouts beforehand were justified. At least with JM you get pace, aggression in the tackles and his ability to run with the ball, so I thought it would've been a better fit than LC to start. 

[Shadow Play]

4 minutes ago, Fifespud said:

I agree re Cameron, the majority of posters on here (not me) were saying Mulligan should start ahead of him, and they have been proven right. First half McCowan and Sylla were both guilty of giving the ball away with under hit passes etc, second half I thought they were both immense. 

I thought Sylla and McCowan were very good second half as well.  I don’t want to sound like a broken record but Lyall isn’t yet good enough defensively for certain types of games (I mean physically, not clearing it off the line).  Sylla has to do too much defensively when Lyall is on and conversely McCowan can’t be free enough to be more attacking.

[Ludo*1]

8 minutes ago, Fifespud said:

I agree re Cameron, the majority of posters on here (not me) were saying Mulligan should start ahead of him, and they have been proven right. First half McCowan and Sylla were both guilty of giving the ball away with under hit passes etc, second half I thought they were both immense. 

 

Just now, LM_0803 said:

Today was another example of him having to do it on his own and failing though, so for that reason the mulligan shouts beforehand were justified. At least with JM you get pace, aggression in the tackles and his ability to run with the ball, so I thought it would've been a better fit than LC to start. 

Yeah, I never really posted about it on here but I thought it'd have been harsh to drop Cameron for today's game. With hindsight though and going forward, I think Mulligan provides more balance.

I said last season at one point that the perfect Dundee midfield is either McCowan or Cameron but not both and currently, McCowan brings a lot more to the team.

Consider me signed up to the Mulligan being paired with Sylla thought process as the way forward.

[peebles_Dee]

1 hour ago, Fifespud said:

Need to watch the highlights but I’ve never rated Portales as high as you Ludo. Seems like a headless chicken. I actually don’t rate any of our CH’s if I’m honest. 

Great on the ball but he is an awful defender. If we dominate possession he will look unbelievable. I’d cash in on him. A South American team o could see him going to or Greece.

if people disagree that he is awful defensively. Tell me his defensive qualities.

[peebles_Dee]

55 minutes ago, Pens_Dark said:

Docherty had said in his interview after the game that he was disappointed that it took a change of system in the second half to change the game rather than the players finding solutions in the first half themselves. I have to say I totally agree with that. Too easy to blame the system and formation when the other team have your number but you need some sort of independence from your players to solve the problems themselves. 

I said a few months ago that I really thought we should be looking for an upgrade on Sylla and I'm sticking with that. That isn't just me unfairly picking on him today as I thought, on a whole, all the midfielders were terrible. He can be really clumsy in possession and a lot of the joy that united were getting in terms of counters today were from mistakes (not only) from him. 

Cameron was basically as good as not being on but fair play for his desire to get back and clear the ball off the line. 

I thought the defending in both goals was absolutely pathetic btw. Where is Ingram for both and what the f**k is Portales doing? No communication between them whatsoever. 

It’s Portales man. Ingrams man was Ferry. It’s happened against 3 teams that same goal.

[peebles_Dee]

Seen people suggesting Clark Robertson in the middle of a 3 earlier. He’s either a LCB or a LB. He’s not dominant in the air.
 

It’s evident that we are going to play a 4 at times. Kilmarnock and Arsenal for example play 4 centre backs. The potential signings of Jack and Donnelly confirm this formation in my opinion. It will allow Tiffoney to play who I believe that he will be a very important player this year.

Graham will easily play in the middle of a 3 if Robertson and McGhee are beside him. 

[Dee Bliss]

2 hours ago, peebles_Dee said:

I was really disappointed in Portales today and Larkech. Larkech didn’t know what the game meant and was rolling about. Docherty wasn’t impressed with him. Portales at fault and Ingram gets the blame from fans. Portales mistakes making Ingram look like he’s in the wrong. 
 

He’s been at fault for the goal at Bonnyrigg, 1/2 at Dens and one at Annan.

Not sure about that tbh. Portales defending 1 on 1 is excellent and his use of the ball is very good. Not sure how we’ve managed to end up with McGhee playing centrehalf again. Right back or right wingback should be his position if he’s in the team. 
 

Astley was dropped so Portales could be moved across to the right where he’s more comfortable. Graham came on as sub in the Annan game then started the Inverness game so played his way into the team. Thought he looked better in the Inverness game than what Astley did in the Annan one. 

[peebles_Dee]

Might be an unpopular opinion but Alex Lowry would be smart signing for us. I know some of his former youth coaches who have said he has the ability to play for Rangers but has been frustrated with lack of opportunities. He’s had a tough at a young age. His mum passing away recently and injuries like the one which ended his Hearts loan spell. Him and Clement don’t like each other either. He’s been put to their B team.

 

A loan til the end of the season and a free in the summer. Can play Left, right and middle.

 

[Dee Bliss]

17 minutes ago, peebles_Dee said:

Might be an unpopular opinion but Alex Lowry would be smart signing for us. I know some of his former youth coaches who have said he has the ability to play for Rangers but has been frustrated with lack of opportunities. He’s had a tough at a young age. His mum passing away recently and injuries like the one which ended his Hearts loan spell. Him and Clement don’t like each other either. He’s been put to their B team.

 

A loan til the end of the season and a free in the summer. Can play Left, right and middle.

 

He’d be a tremendous signing. Was Hearts best player in the game we won 1 nil at Dens last season. Tore us apart at times in that game. Won’t happen though. 

Edited August 4 by Dee Bliss

[peebles_Dee]

31 minutes ago, Dee Bliss said:

He’d be a tremendous signing. Was Hearts best player in the game we won 1 nil at Dens last season. Tore us apart at times in that game. Won’t happen though. 

He needs a move and we would be his best offer

[LM_0803]

1 hour ago, peebles_Dee said:

Seen people suggesting Clark Robertson in the middle of a 3 earlier. He’s either a LCB or a LB. He’s not dominant in the air.
 

It’s evident that we are going to play a 4 at times. Kilmarnock and Arsenal for example play 4 centre backs. The potential signings of Jack and Donnelly confirm this formation in my opinion. It will allow Tiffoney to play who I believe that he will be a very important player this year.

Graham will easily play in the middle of a 3 if Robertson and McGhee are beside him. 

Out of interest how likely is Jack signing in your opinion? Surely just logical thinking at this point in time due to Doc coaching him before, as we've not heard much to suggest he'll sign other than Docherty hinting in his pre match presser. 

Donnelly is a different one on the other hand. In the minority here but i can't say I'm excited for that one if it goes through, just having flashbacks of him getting bodied by Bair for the 3-2 defeat at Dens. Don't think he'll drastically improve the defence more than the players we currently have there,  with the exception of young Luke I suppose. 

[LM_0803]

5 minutes ago, peebles_Dee said:

He needs a move and we would be his best offer

It's a similar one to the Scott Fraser rumours we heard a fortnight ago, would only really make sense if McCowan and/or Cameron were leaving. Isn't Lowry an attacking midfielder that can maybe play wide? 

[peebles_Dee]

1 minute ago, LM_0803 said:

It's a similar one to the Scott Fraser rumours we heard a fortnight ago, would only really make sense if McCowan and/or Cameron were leaving. Isn't Lowry an attacking midfielder that can maybe play wide? 

He’s a great option to have. We can’t just depend on Lyall and Luke. Docherty wants a mix of physical, athletic and versatile players. Lowry can play Lw,RW and AM. It might not be Lowry but I reckon we will see a similar type signing. The bench today there was no creative options.

 

on your point about Donnelly. He won’t improve us but he can play LB. If we get Donnelly I highly doubt we will get another CB. We will play a 3-5-2 with just Sylla against poorer opponents (not many teams in SPFL), 2 sitting DM covering a weaker CCB or a 4-2-3-1 with a back 4 of out and out centre backs.

[johnnydun]

Don't get the comfort with McGhee playing Centre Half. I think he gets dragged about too much leaving us a bit exposed. Much better and more effective as a Full Back imo.

[peebles_Dee]

Watching the highlights back and It’s mad that Dodgson is better defensively.

[Pens_Dark]

11 hours ago, peebles_Dee said:

It’s Portales man. Ingrams man was Ferry. It’s happened against 3 teams that same goal.

It was Portales man, yes, but he gets dragged on to another player that he shouldn't have from his own poor defending. Ingram for both goals sees the game in front of him and can see Portales getting dragged. Focus on the immediate danger ffs rather than focusing on Ferry who's miles away from the game. Like I say it was a clear show of poor communication between both.

[stu2910]

Refuse to slate the defence as we all knew that was going to be the problem area.  For me, Portales and McGhee were fine but can be better, though I'd rather McGhee wasn't at CB.  Graham and Larkeche weren't quite good enough but both understandably so and I think both have more than enough potential to be good enough in time.  Ingram was a bit disappointing as he's had a bit more time to bed in but didn't really assert himself at either end, but I'm still confident he can come good eventually.  For the latter 3, we will need to wait until October to know how they're actually going to be, but considering it wasn't that long ago that our back line was something like Kerr/Meekings/Kusunga/O'Dea/Ralph, I'm more than content with what we have.

Main frustration for me was that for the first hour, the midfield seemed to never be deep enough to pick up the ball and play through them, but also never high enough to pick up the loose balls being knocked down.  It's no surprise that we started to dominate as Utd tired as it allowed us to do what we are actually good at, plus seeing Main, Tiffoney and Mulligan coming off the bench for the opposition when you've already been running for an hour will be terrifying for many this season.

Think SPH deserves more attention on here and from the media.  He does everything Bakayoko did but with an added level of chaos and goal scoring know-how.  Reckon he could become a star as the season progresses and if he could improve in the air and his first touch he'd be unplayable.

Long story short, we went away to a likely mid-table rival where we've had horrendous results in recent years, with a back 5 containing 2 players at 21 and another at 20 playing their first game in the league, played well within ourselves and still came away with a deserved point.  If this is what's considered bad these days then bring it on.

 

[hk blues]

9 minutes ago, stu2910 said:

Refuse to slate the defence as we all knew that was going to be the problem area.  For me, Portales and McGhee were fine but can be better, though I'd rather McGhee wasn't at CB.  Graham and Larkeche weren't quite good enough but both understandably so and I think both have more than enough potential to be good enough in time.  Ingram was a bit disappointing as he's had a bit more time to bed in but didn't really assert himself at either end, but I'm still confident he can come good eventually.  For the latter 3, we will need to wait until October to know how they're actually going to be, but considering it wasn't that long ago that our back line was something like Kerr/Meekings/Kusunga/O'Dea/Ralph, I'm more than content with what we have.

Main frustration for me was that for the first hour, the midfield seemed to never be deep enough to pick up the ball and play through them, but also never high enough to pick up the loose balls being knocked down.  It's no surprise that we started to dominate as Utd tired as it allowed us to do what we are actually good at, plus seeing Main, Tiffoney and Mulligan coming off the bench for the opposition when you've already been running for an hour will be terrifying for many this season.

Think SPH deserves more attention on here and from the media.  He does everything Bakayoko did but with an added level of chaos and goal scoring know-how.  Reckon he could become a star as the season progresses and if he could improve in the air and his first touch he'd be unplayable.

Long story short, we went away to a likely mid-table rival where we've had horrendous results in recent years, with a back 5 containing 2 players at 21 and another at 20 playing their first game in the league, played well within ourselves and still came away with a deserved point.  If this is what's considered bad these days then bring it on.

 

They probably performed better than expected and us a little worse so the point isn't to be sniffed at but the fact that it possibly should have been all 3 if Main had been a bit more composed at the end is where the disappointment lies for me.  The balance to that is, of course, they should've been 3-1 up long before.

 

[Pens_Dark]

Just now, hk blues said:

They probably performed better than expected and us a little worse so the point isn't to be sniffed at but the fact that it possibly should have been all 3 if Main had been a bit more composed at the end is where the disappointment lies for me.  The balance to that is, of course, they should've been 3-1 up long before.

 

Yep, the balance is correct. They could have been well ahead and we were riding our luck. 

I came away from the game happy we managed to salvage a point rather than being raging that we didn't get all three.

[peebles_Dee]

9 hours ago, peebles_Dee said:

Watching the highlights back and It’s mad that Dodgson is better defensively.

Than Larkeche