Jack Harper

[PrestersKTID]

I'd have both him and Gauld in the squad for the Malta game. Whats the harm? If we are battering them 3/4 nil then bring them on and see what they can do, if it's tight then don't risk it. It's the perfect type of game to try to bring in new faces. 

[oneteaminglasgow]

8 minutes ago, PrestersKTID said:

I'd have both him and Gauld in the squad for the Malta game. Whats the harm? If we are battering them 3/4 nil then bring them on and see what they can do, if it's tight then don't risk it. It's the perfect type of game to try to bring in new faces. 

Why on earth would you have Harper in the squad?

[Gordopolis]

12 minutes ago, PrestersKTID said:

I'd have both him and Gauld in the squad for the Malta game. Whats the harm? If we are battering them 3/4 nil then bring them on and see what they can do, if it's tight then don't risk it. It's the perfect type of game to try to bring in new faces. 

Perhaps as squad boys (as Strachan did with a few younger players in the last campaign to have a look at certain youngsters). Then, as you say, if we're cruising, maybe even give them a taste of the game for the last 10 mins or so.

[haggisbeastie]

Yes, he very much could.  

The lord of gloom speaks!

#weescotland

Let's be safe in our mediocrity...

[conley]

I'd have both him and Gauld in the squad for the Malta game. Whats the harm? If we are battering them 3/4 nil then bring them on and see what they can do, if it's tight then don't risk it. It's the perfect type of game to try to bring in new faces. 

Never in a hundred years will we be battering Malta 3/4 to 0...

[forameus]

11 hours ago, haggisbeastie said:

 

The lord of gloom speaks!

#weescotland

Let's be safe in our mediocrity...
 

 

Deary me...

Since some people seem far too thick, I'll explain it in more words.

Troopio said that " he couldn't do any worse".   Let's analyse that.  During this campaign, we didn't qualify, which was a failure.  But in a wider context we improved.  We improved our seeding to the point where we were one win away from securing pot 2 status.  We had far better performances earlier on as well, to the point where it genuinely looked like we could beat Poland and Ireland to qualifying, and perhaps even finish top if Germany continued their difficult campaign.  Alas, we lost in Georgia, Germany pumped us, and we blew it in the last minute against Poland (despite a decent performance).  We finished in a position that would have been enough for a play-off spot had we beat Georgia.  That's the reality.

So, troopio's "he couldn't do any worse" pish.  Of course they could!  We could have lost both games against Poland.  We could have lost both games against Ireland!  We could have absolutely shat the bed against Gibraltar when they scored their first international goal and gone on to drop points there.  It absolutely boggles the mind that someone can say "couldn't do any worse".  That's the usual "och we're shite anyway" attitude that holds the country back.  And it would be followed up by "see, I knew he was pish" when the new players you've brought in for the sake of it don't perform.  

This sort of argument is fine for a Gibraltar or San Marino.  They're rock bottom, bottom pot, likely to lose every game in a qualifying campaign.  To countries like that, you're absolutely right.  They're as well throwing in any old player to see what sticks.  Not Scotland, a team who are in a group of nations that start each campaign knowing they have a chance of qualifying.

And the biggest irony in the shit sandwich that was your post was that my post was far, far more positive than the one I was quoting.  So aye, "Lord of Gloom".  

[troopio]

you really do love Steven Fletcher don't you?

[forameus]

15 minutes ago, troopio said:

you really do love Steven Fletcher don't you?

All of that post, and that's all you can say?  Suppose I shouldn't have expected much better from you.  

Actually, if you could point out where I actually mentioned him at any point during my post - in a thread about Jack Harper - then that'd be great.  Seek help you absolute moron.

[troopio]

you bite so easily it is hilarious, the only person who needs help is you for the fact you get wound up so easily by complete randoms on an internet forum!

Edited July 22, 2016 by troopio

[Monkey Tennis]

34 minutes ago, troopio said:

you bite so easily it is hilarious, the only person who needs help is you for the fact you get wound up so easily by complete randoms on an internet forum!

Sorry, but posts like that are the preserve of the moronic.

Saying something daft and having it torn apart does not represent a triumph for he who said something daft.  Using the tiresome angling analogy does not help you.

[Tommy Nooka]

7 hours ago, forameus said:

Deary me...

Since some people seem far too thick, I'll explain it in more words.

Troopio said that " he couldn't do any worse".   Let's analyse that.  During this campaign, we didn't qualify, which was a failure.  But in a wider context we improved.  We improved our seeding to the point where we were one win away from securing pot 2 status.  We had far better performances earlier on as well, to the point where it genuinely looked like we could beat Poland and Ireland to qualifying, and perhaps even finish top if Germany continued their difficult campaign.  Alas, we lost in Georgia, Germany pumped us, and we blew it in the last minute against Poland (despite a decent performance).  We finished in a position that would have been enough for a play-off spot had we beat Georgia.  That's the reality.

So, troopio's "he couldn't do any worse" pish.  Of course they could!  We could have lost both games against Poland.  We could have lost both games against Ireland!  We could have absolutely shat the bed against Gibraltar when they scored their first international goal and gone on to drop points there.  It absolutely boggles the mind that someone can say "couldn't do any worse".  That's the usual "och we're shite anyway" attitude that holds the country back.  And it would be followed up by "see, I knew he was pish" when the new players you've brought in for the sake of it don't perform.  

This sort of argument is fine for a Gibraltar or San Marino.  They're rock bottom, bottom pot, likely to lose every game in a qualifying campaign.  To countries like that, you're absolutely right.  They're as well throwing in any old player to see what sticks.  Not Scotland, a team who are in a group of nations that start each campaign knowing they have a chance of qualifying.

And the biggest irony in the shit sandwich that was your post was that my post was far, far more positive than the one I was quoting.  So aye, "Lord of Gloom".  

I don't know where you are getting that shite from, we're officially cannon fodder these days. We might think we have a chance of qualifying but I'm pretty sure other teams see us as a good draw now.

9 failures in a row, the oldest player in the current Scotland squad wasn't even old enough to get into a pub the last time we played in a major tournament.

 

[forameus]

9 minutes ago, Tommy Nooka said:

I don't know where you are getting that shite from, we're officially cannon fodder these days. We might think we have a chance of qualifying but I'm pretty sure other teams see us as a good draw now.

9 failures in a row, the oldest player in the current Scotland squad wasn't even old enough to get into a pub the last time we played in a major tournament.

 

I imagine most sides thought of Northern Ireland and Wales the same way before the last campaign.  Like it or not, we are in the group of sides who can qualify.  But that pool is much, much larger than the number of available spaces.  One terrible match blew our playoff chances.  We had a chance to qualify, we failed.

But by all means, keep the wailing and the gnashing of teeth going about how everything is just awful.  And I'm the negative one...

1 hour ago, troopio said:

you bite so easily it is hilarious, the only person who needs help is you for the fact you get wound up so easily by complete randoms on an internet forum!

MT said it best.  Call you a moron, you post like a moron...aye, it's probably a moron.  I'll take that back if you can actually come back to any of the post of mine with any coherent point, rather than...well, whatever you usually do.

[haggisbeastie]

Deary me...

Since some people seem far too thick, I'll explain it in more words.

Troopio said that " he couldn't do any worse".   Let's analyse that.  During this campaign, we didn't qualify, which was a failure.  But in a wider context we improved.  We improved our seeding to the point where we were one win away from securing pot 2 status.  We had far better performances earlier on as well, to the point where it genuinely looked like we could beat Poland and Ireland to qualifying, and perhaps even finish top if Germany continued their difficult campaign.  Alas, we lost in Georgia, Germany pumped us, and we blew it in the last minute against Poland (despite a decent performance).  We finished in a position that would have been enough for a play-off spot had we beat Georgia.  That's the reality.

So, troopio's "he couldn't do any worse" pish.  Of course they could!  We could have lost both games against Poland.  We could have lost both games against Ireland!  We could have absolutely shat the bed against Gibraltar when they scored their first international goal and gone on to drop points there.  It absolutely boggles the mind that someone can say "couldn't do any worse".  That's the usual "och we're shite anyway" attitude that holds the country back.  And it would be followed up by "see, I knew he was pish" when the new players you've brought in for the sake of it don't perform.  

This sort of argument is fine for a Gibraltar or San Marino.  They're rock bottom, bottom pot, likely to lose every game in a qualifying campaign.  To countries like that, you're absolutely right.  They're as well throwing in any old player to see what sticks.  Not Scotland, a team who are in a group of nations that start each campaign knowing they have a chance of qualifying.

And the biggest irony in the shit sandwich that was your post was that my post was far, far more positive than the one I was quoting.  So aye, "Lord of Gloom".  

OK. I take back the " lord of gloom" comment.

I do think there is too much worrying about our seeding, as a team which concentrates on getting better can blow that out of the water (for example, Belgium & Iceland in recent times).

[forameus]

OK. I take back the " lord of gloom" comment.

I do think there is too much worrying about our seeding, as a team which concentrates on getting better can blow that out of the water (for example, Belgium & Iceland in recent times).

I get your point about those teams, but we absolutely should be worrying about seeding. It can make a massive difference to who you get in a group. The higher you are, the more chance you have, simple as that. Of course a poorer team could beat us, and of course we could beat a better team. But I'd still rather face the weaker ones

[54_and_counting]

On 22/07/2016 at 09:19, forameus said:

 We finished in a position that would have been enough for a play-off spot had we beat Georgia.  That's the reality.

id argue that you have sugar coated a ton of problems that we have, the squad is full of failures, its not like we can say "ah well the guys will learn from this campaign and take it to the next one" not one of the current scotland squad has ever played in a major finals, that is a shocking statistic

 

 

[LinkinFighter]

They've not? Incredible.

[forameus]

41 minutes ago, 53_and_counting said:

id argue that you have sugar coated a ton of problems that we have, the squad is full of failures, its not like we can say "ah well the guys will learn from this campaign and take it to the next one" not one of the current scotland squad has ever played in a major finals, that is a shocking statistic

No, I've very much not.  What is incorrect about what i said?  We beat Georgia, we would have been in a play-off spot.  That's saying nothing about any other "failures", real or imagined.  And funnily enough, saying nothing about those failures is exactly what people would be doing had we beaten Georgia, gotten through the playoffs and gone to the Euros.  

And as I keep saying, because it's true, the Northern Irish and Wales squads were chock full of "failures" prior to this summer.  And now they're not.  

[LiviLion]

59 minutes ago, 53_and_counting said:

not one of the current scotland squad has ever played in a major finals, that is a shocking statistic

We need to call up Christian Dailly imo.

[54_and_counting]

2 hours ago, forameus said:

No, I've very much not.  What is incorrect about what i said?  We beat Georgia, we would have been in a play-off spot.  That's saying nothing about any other "failures", real or imagined.  And funnily enough, saying nothing about those failures is exactly what people would be doing had we beaten Georgia, gotten through the playoffs and gone to the Euros.  

And as I keep saying, because it's true, the Northern Irish and Wales squads were chock full of "failures" prior to this summer.  And now they're not.  

but we didnt beat georgia, and every campaign since 1998 has been littered with failures like georgia almost, the fact is you make it sound like the rest of the campaign was excellent other than the georgia game, it wasnt, we choked against the poles twice and ireland once while in a leading position

the fact is the current lot only know failure, they have done it time and time again and i doubt the best manager in the world could change that in them, they have proved that they do not have what it takes to not just qualify, but at least get us to the playoffs for a 2 leg shot at a tournament, ffs vogts was a nightmare but at least he made the playoffs,  

[forameus]

21 hours ago, 53_and_counting said:

but we didnt beat georgia, and every campaign since 1998 has been littered with failures like georgia almost, the fact is you make it sound like the rest of the campaign was excellent other than the georgia game, it wasnt, we choked against the poles twice and ireland once while in a leading position

the fact is the current lot only know failure, they have done it time and time again and i doubt the best manager in the world could change that in them, they have proved that they do not have what it takes to not just qualify, but at least get us to the playoffs for a 2 leg shot at a tournament, ffs vogts was a nightmare but at least he made the playoffs,  

And yet none of that changes what I actually said, which was, again, if we did beat Georgia, we would've been in a playoff spot.  How is that so hard to understand?  I never said anything about the rest of the campaign.  Although for the record, it's nowhere near as bad as people make out with hindsight.  You talk about Poland like they were no-marks - a draw in Warsaw was a good result, and I completely agree we should have closed it out in at least one of the games - probably Hampden.  But Poland have proved this summer that they are a good side.  And we didn't "choke" against Ireland, we got it back to 1-1 after they scored first.

The only reason I go on about the Georgia game in this context is because had we won it, and got through the playoff, then no-one would be saying a peep about the rest of the campaign.  But we lose that one, end up not qualifying, and suddenly the retcon is that we were absolutely shite.  We weren't.  We were fair-to-middling for most of the campaign, and shite in one game.  Ireland were pretty average for most of the campaign, and amazing for one game.  That's the way it goes sometimes.