SodjesSixteenIncher Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 No, you're right. The EU economy is simply booming. Well that's an embarrassingly weak climb down there, have I ever said the EU economy is "booming"? As all the evidence shows, even with a stagnant European economy, it has remained a remarkably stable market for Britain. Some increased and decreases here and there, in terms of the various sub-measurements of our balance of trade, but stable nonetheless. How's the "rest of the world" economy doing then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 4, 2014 Author Share Posted November 4, 2014 Well that's an embarrassingly weak climb down there, have I ever said the EU economy is "booming"? As all the evidence shows, even with a stagnant European economy, it has remained a remarkably stable market for Britain. Some increased and decreases here and there, in terms of the various sub-measurements of our balance of trade, but stable nonetheless. How's the "rest of the world" economy doing then? No climbdown at all. I said the EU economy was declining in importance to the UK (as it shrinks and our trade with other places increases) this will continue apace as it has done for the past four or five years. Fairly obvious to all but the most prissy of Europhiles such as yourself. I notice you still haven't managed to come up with any evidence for your ludicrous, claim that I (or anyone else) wanted to see an end to trade with the countries that make up the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 We are now exporting 12% more goods and services to the rest of the world than we do to the EU. They are no longer "our biggest market". No climbdown at all. I said the EU economy was declining in importance to the UK (as it shrinks and our trade with other places increases) this will continue apace as it has done for the past four or five years. Fairly obvious to all but the most prissy of Europhiles such as yourself. Did ye, aye? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 4, 2014 Author Share Posted November 4, 2014 Did ye, aye? Yep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodjesSixteenIncher Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 No climbdown at all. I said the EU economy was declining in importance to the UK (as it shrinks and our trade with other places increases) this will continue apace as it has done for the past four or five years. Fairly obvious to all but the most prissy of Europhiles such as yourself. I notice you still haven't managed to come up with any evidence for your ludicrous, claim that I (or anyone else) wanted to see an end to trade with the countries that make up the EU. Just pretending this thread hasn't happened and repeating the same, demonstrably false statement over and over again isn't really helping you to cover your fish out of water / Eurosceptic out of Twitter performance here. And aye, we've covered that. Once you aknowledge the basic - literally proven on this thread fact - that Europe is our "dominant market" (source: ONS), we'll discuss why it is that you would possibly want isolated from that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 No climbdown at all. I said the EU economy was declining in importance to the UK (as it shrinks and our trade with other places increases) this will continue apace as it has done for the past four or five years. Fairly obvious to all but the most prissy of Europhiles such as yourself. I notice you still haven't managed to come up with any evidence for your ludicrous, claim that I (or anyone else) wanted to see an end to trade with the countries that make up the EU. http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/business-21127037Apparently we do more trade with Germany alone than we do with the US. But yeah, Europe's declining in importance whilst we seek riches from powerhouse economies in South America and Asia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 4, 2014 Author Share Posted November 4, 2014 http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-11-04/europe-triple-dip-recession-goldmans-internal-model-finds Triple dip anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkston5 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 We are proportionally represented in Europe, like everyone else. Merkel's position - that you are moronically comparing to Hitler's - is that we're in the European community and we should either continue to play by the same rules as everyone else, or we can leave and do our own thing*. The British position of we want to stay in but we also want to stamp our feet and pick and choose how everything works to suit us, is typical of Britain's post-imperialist delusional arrogance. I can only assume it's not countries being dominant in matters of international relations that bothers you, but that it's not Britain calling the shots for everyone else. It's nothing to do with comparing. Germany's aims were to control Europe and just because the methods differ, it's the same result. What you've done which is what most liberals do is to ignore the evidence. Do Germany control the terms of loans to Greece and the other Eurozone countries which were brought to its knees during the ongoing recession? Do Germany have the ultimate say in the freedom of movement within European borders? Did Angela Merkel threaten Britain with expulsion if they failed to abide by the terms which were set for EU membership? Your last point is infused with liberal prejudice. You think that this is about me being a proud Briton galling at our lack of power and "it all started with the way we lost India"? It's more rational that that. Think about the fact that we have to hand over money based on our economic performance and have no say in that. I say gtf Europe. Actually as an Independence supporter, you should also realise that Salmond's contention was that Scotland was too valuable to the rest of the UK, not to negotiate to its benefit. He was wrong of course about that but in the case of Europe, that is spot on. Europe need the UK and we should stop bending over them to negotiate a better deal for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double Jack D Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Scotland is by far and away a bigger asset to the UK than the UK is to Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodjesSixteenIncher Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 It's nothing to do with comparing. Germany's aims were to control Europe and just because the methods differ, it's the same result. What you've done which is what most liberals do is to ignore the evidence. Do Germany control the terms of loans to Greece and the other Eurozone countries which were brought to its knees during the ongoing recession? Do Germany have the ultimate say in the freedom of movement within European borders? Did Angela Merkel threaten Britain with expulsion if they failed to abide by the terms which were set for EU membership? Your last point is infused with liberal prejudice. You think that this is about me being a proud Briton galling at our lack of power and "it all started with the way we lost India"? It's more rational that that. Think about the fact that we have to hand over money based on our economic performance and have no say in that. I say gtf Europe. Actually as an Independence supporter, you should also realise that Salmond's contention was that Scotland was too valuable to the rest of the UK, not to negotiate to its benefit. He was wrong of course about that but in the case of Europe, that is spot on. Europe need the UK and we should stop bending over them to negotiate a better deal for us. What you've posted there contains nothing remotely close to "evidence" that Germany seeks to control the world like Hitler did. Germany doesn't control the free movement of people or the implementation of a GDP based contributions system - they are facets of the European community, which Britain has to decide whether it wants to be involved with or not. I personally would choose to stay in but that's a personal opinion based on my assessment of the situation - I could respect an opposite viewpoint if it was a rational one. What we tend to get is absolute waffle such as your Nazi comparisons, Reynard's litany of failure earlier, Tryfield's 80% of our laws pish in previous threads etc. If Eurosceptics got their act together and stopped basing their arguments on complete and utter lies/delusional nonsense, we might actually get people scrutinising the EU's failings properly (which absolutely should happen), instead of it being the sole domain of uber right-wing Britania rules the waves simpletons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 5, 2014 Author Share Posted November 5, 2014 Scotland is by far and away a bigger asset to the UK than the UK is to Europe. You aren't much of an asset to Scotland though. Swings and roundabouts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/eu-migrants-uk-gains-20bn-ucl-study UK Gains £20Bn from EU migrants. Reynard'll have a fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkston5 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/eu-migrants-uk-gains-20bn-ucl-study UK Gains £20Bn from EU migrants. Reynard'll have a fit. NET gain. Why not make that a gain by us being able to introduce controls? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted November 5, 2014 Author Share Posted November 5, 2014 http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/nov/05/eu-migrants-uk-gains-20bn-ucl-study UK Gains £20Bn from EU migrants. Reynard'll have a fit. No I won't you thick c**t. I'm all for as much immigration as we can possibly have. It will utterly destroy the welfare state that way and it will introduce people that want to work over here rather than us grafters having to carry a bunch of feckless, toothless poverty stricken drug addled workshy c**t Dundonians on our backs via the welfare system. More the merrier I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 NET gain. Why not make that a gain by us being able to introduce controls? Yes, net gain after benefits, etc. What the f**k are you on about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkston5 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Yes, net gain after benefits, etc. What the f**k are you on about? People who've come here and committed crime? Any mention of them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Yes, net gain after benefits, etc. What the f**k are you on about?Don't bother with him. He spent an hour debating with me on the issue because, try as he might, he couldn't understand what the term "net contributor" meant. I put him on ignore afterwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkston5 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Don't bother with him. He spent an hour debating with me on the issue because, try as he might, he couldn't understand what the term "net contributor" means. I put him on ignore afterwards. Net means remaining after deductions and your example was what all liberals say which is "in spite of the negatives". I think we can reduce these negatives and make immigration more beneficial Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 People who've come here and committed crime? Any mention of them They're part of the net loss, dimwit. "despite newspaper headlines linking new migrants to crime, offending rates among mainly Polish, Romanian and Bulgarian communities are in line with the rate of offending in the general population" http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2008/apr/16/immigrationpolicy.immigration?guni=Article:in%20body%20link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Net means remaining after deductions and your example was what all liberals say which is "in spite of the negatives". I think we can reduce these negatives and make immigration more beneficial I'll do you the courtesy of asking for evidence regarding this miracle before I call you a UKIP voting racist moron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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