forever_blue Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Young F_B, how the feck do you think the British created an empire if they weren't an invading country ?, the British empire was built on invading and conquering lands for profit. The point was to F_B that our armed forces have been used in aggression to other countries. And some of those wars Britain started without good reason other than the British were more powerful and they had resources our ruling classes could exploit financially. Whilst Britain was fending off Germany, Britain was still ruler of an empire it built on aggression and invasion. So it sort of stinks of hypocrisy to point out Hitler was gaining territory whilst the British said it was wrong but still had the barefaced cheek to keep an empire it built up through aggression itself. you do reliase my orignal post you reffered to clearly stated "during the war" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkey Tennis Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 more than likely to be out for themselves in making a profit and naive Rangers fans fall for it. Unprecedented. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingrodent Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 The whole "war" thing has got out of hand in recent years. Politicians bang on about remembering this or that to drum up nationalistic sentiment and, in England anyway, are fighting each other to be involved in this nonsense so as to appear more British than the other guy. There seems to some sort of war-related "celebration" every year now. It's just got out of hand and it's time to move on. I buy and wear a poppy every year, but I don't want it on my team's strip. But I won't be making a fuss about it if they do. What has happened at both Ibrox and Parkhead in recent years is pretty distasteful, for different reasons, but no less distasteful for that. They call this kind of thing "Culture War" in America... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_war It's more likely that abortion or burning the flag or gun rights will be the excuse in the states, but all these issues are deliberately chosen to be stoked and inflamed because they a) appeal to people on a basic, emotional level and b) if you play the issue angry and stupid enough, it's impossible for the argument to ever actually end. Nobody can win, and intentionally so - the argument, rather than who is correct, is the entire point of the exercise*. That's about where the poppy argument is now, I'm afraid - a big convenient excuse to have a really shitty argument about an issue that will split most people one way or the other, then set them at each other's throats. It has nothing to do with the actual issue, and everything to do with getting as many people as possible on your side, so you can all hate the other side together. Sadly, there are a lot of folk around who just love those kinds of rows. That's why e.g. the Mail is still making scads of money, when all the other papers are nosediving. I can't even pretend not to be one of them, because I'm all over the internet taking part in fights enthusiastically, even though I know that they're bullshit non-issues that are only raised for the benefit of cranks. *See also: That Green Brigade William Wallace banner, which had no purpose at all except forcing Celtic fans to either side with the GB or against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 They call this kind of thing "Culture War" in America... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_war It's more likely that abortion or burning the flag or gun rights will be the excuse in the states, What melodramatic tosh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingrodent Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 What melodramatic tosh. You'd think, wouldn't you. Sadly, it's true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 You'd think, wouldn't you. Sadly, it's true. The US culture wars are a long running and bitter fued that is largely between fundamentalist Christians and liberals. To wear a poppy or not is something most people in the UK are pretty meh about and only comes up for about two weeks a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellbhoy Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 The last big acquisitive war of the UK was the Second Anglo-Boer War of 1898-1902. Since then the UK had become a liberal democracy with universal suffrage and the world had gained laws via the League of Nations, international laws. The UK acquired territories after WWI but technically these were temporary and to be administered towards independence. It had begun the early work of dismantling its empire, the dominions were independent, the Free State had fought its independence and Congress in India was pushing hard for the UK to leave, Iraq and other Arab states had been released from Mandate and were independent. When the UK chose to become involved in WWII it did so to protect the sovereignty of other countries. It did so knowing the debts would likely bankrupt it and the Empire would be very hard to hold onto. More over when all seemed lost they persisted with the war when the most likely outcome was to lose their existence. Clearly you have an anti British agenda with this, trying to conflate the UK of 1939 with Nazi Germany. Sterling copy n paste job. And also the state view on things not necessarily the truth but rather the political party spin to paint Britain in a better light. Aye, that hypocrisy against Hitler and Nazism, a right good kick in the arse us British needed. Yes Youngsy you'll remember the Victorian era won't you, when Britain forcefully created an empire whether or not those countries wanted to be ruled and occupied by the British. you do reliase my orignal post you reffered to clearly stated "during the war" Fcuk your spelling is getting worse young one or you've been tanning the Frosty Jack by the barrel load before posting. No matter what you posted my reply was about a particular part of your post in general. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellbhoy Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 The whole "war" thing has got out of hand in recent years. Politicians bang on about remembering this or that to drum up nationalistic sentiment and, in England anyway, are fighting each other to be involved in this nonsense so as to appear more British than the other guy. There seems to some sort of war-related "celebration" every year now. It's just got out of hand and it's time to move on. I buy and wear a poppy every year, but I don't want it on my team's strip. But I won't be making a fuss about it if they do. What has happened at both Ibrox and Parkhead in recent years is pretty distasteful, for different reasons, but no less distasteful for that. It has gotten so bad these days that if you do not wear a poppy in the media that you must be some sort of rebel against the armed forces. I do not look forward to the political circus on Remembrance Sunday where every fucking politician suddenly becomes overwhelmed by bereavement over people they couldn't give a flying fcuk about by sending more troops into battles to die they couldn't also give a fcuk about either if they should die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haggis pakora Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 I see hellboys just woke up from his previous hangover and back on the jungle juice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forever_blue Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Sterling copy n paste job. And also the state view on things not necessarily the truth but rather the political party spin to paint Britain in a better light. Yes Youngsy you'll remember the Victorian era won't you, when Britain forcefully created an empire whether or not those countries wanted to be ruled and occupied by the British. Fcuk your spelling is getting worse young one or you've been tanning the Frosty Jack by the barrel load before posting. No matter what you posted my reply was about a particular part of your post in general. Yes and the particular point you chose to respond to creates a completely different arguement to the point I was making, I am fully aware of Britain imperial past but in regards to world war 2 Britain was not an invading force, Germany was. Also if all you have is my spelling to point out which I have explained the reason why it is poor previously and pointing it out does not really bother me then it shows you are scrambling for something to save yourself some face as you reliase the absoloute arse you have made of yourself here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellbhoy Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 I see hellboys just woke up from his previous hangover and back on the jungle juice. Your puppy dug following all my posts is cute, if I throw a stick will you run into a wall face first ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingrodent Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 The US culture wars are a long running and bitter fued that is largely between fundamentalist Christians and liberals. To wear a poppy or not is something most people in the UK are pretty meh about and only comes up for about two weeks a year. Well, it's not true that this is just about fundamentalist Christians - a huge bloc in America, mind - and "liberals", but let's let that slide. If culture war is too dramatic for you, would you be willing to accept the poppy bullshit as the less exciting "wedge issue" instead? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wedge_issue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellbhoy Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Yes and the particular point you chose to respond to creates a completely different arguement to the point I was making, I am fully aware of Britain imperial past but in regards to world war 2 Britain was not an invading force, Germany was. Also if all you have is my spelling to point out which I have explained the reason why it is poor previously and pointing it out does not really bother me then it shows you are scrambling for something to save yourself some face as you reliase the absoloute arse you have made of yourself here. To put it blunty F_B, remembrance day should be for all of the fallen from all the wars Britain has fought in and not just the last two wars just because Britain for once didn't start them. Do you see the spin in there ?, it's a government promoted politically spinned agenda, let's forget all the wars we started and focus on the last two we didn't start. As for your spelling ?, let me help you padawan. When composing a new post, type a word, move the mouse pointer over it, right click and scroll down to the spellcheck option and choose UK English ffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
haggis pakora Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Your puppy dug following all my posts is cute, if I throw a stick will you run into a wall face first ? It should be "Your a" HTH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forever_blue Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 To put it blunty F_B, remembrance day should be for all of the fallen from all the wars Britain has fought in and not just the last two wars just because Britain for once didn't start them. Do you see the spin in there ?, it's a government promoted politically spinned agenda, let's forget all the wars we started and focus on the last two we didn't start. As for your spelling ?, let me help you padawan. When composing a new post, type a word, move the mouse pointer over it, right click and scroll down to the spellcheck option and choose UK English ffs. Again you are arguing a completely different point to my post , the reason Germans are not speaking English is because we were not an invading force in ww2 whereas Germany was , so if the Germans were successfull in invading Britain we would almost certainly have had German culture and language forced upon us just like the other countries Germany had already invaded. Also last two wars? Are you being genuinely stupid, Britains military forces has been involved in numerous wars and operations since ww2! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Sterling copy n paste job. That is a strong accusation. I take it you will not be able to back it up nor be mature enough to withdraw the accusation. And also the state view on things not necessarily the truth but rather the political party spin to paint Britain in a better light. I notice you left an actual counter argument out of your post. Most likely because you are not able to form one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 remembrance day should be for all of the fallen from all the wars Britain has fought in and not just the last two wars just because Britain for once didn't start them. Do you see the spin in there ?, it's a government promoted politically spinned agenda, let's forget all the wars we started and focus on the last two we didn't start. When were veterans of wars other than the two world wars excluded from remembrance services? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 he poppy bullshit as the less exciting "wedge issue" instead? A wedge issue for who? Who is split by it? You are just talking dingos kidneys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingrodent Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 A wedge issue for who? Who is split by it? You are just talking dingos kidneys. Have you noticed how every single year without fail recently, early November has been marked by papers and any vaguely political websites filling up with people e.g. angrily defending Our Brave Soldiers, or writing about how they think remembrance services have become overly jingoistic and nationalist/imperialist? You can't really miss it, unless you don't buy papers or visit vaguely political websites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 7, 2014 Share Posted November 7, 2014 Have you noticed how every single year without fail recently, early November has been marked by papers and any vaguely political websites filling up with people e.g. angrily defending Our Brave Soldiers, or writing about how they think remembrance services have become overly jingoistic and nationalist/imperialist? You can't really miss it, unless you don't buy papers or visit vaguely political websites. Do you know what a wedge issue is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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