The Arch Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I hadnt seen the score. I'm at work. My comment was based on what I would have said before a ball was hit Understandable. I'm still of the opinion that one set per match would be a success. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Understandable.I'm still of the opinion that one set per match would be a success. It's unbelieveable that our dross can't even match their dross. Maybe the comeback is on.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 Let me know when the idiot loses the third set as well. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arch Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 I'm pretty sure he's lost, considering I went to the feed and they were shaking hands, then walked off. The British guy looked delighted that he'd managed to drag out 3 sets for longer than an hour. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 (edited) Three tie breaks - a moral victory. I know why Lloyd didnt do it, but Bogdanovic should have played. Edited March 6, 2009 by H_B 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pantene proV Posted March 6, 2009 Share Posted March 6, 2009 (edited) Three tie breaks - a moral victory.I know why Lloyd didnt do it, but Bogdanovic should have played. Think it's 'cos he's looking to the future. Boggo will never make it and playing him in Davis Cup after his oh-so-many wild card Wimbers failures makes no sense. edit* sorry, I read your post wrong! Edited March 6, 2009 by pantene proV 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 7, 2009 Share Posted March 7, 2009 Thought Fleming did pretty well today. Was a decent performance from him and Hutchins, though they never looked likely to win at any point. Great experience for a guy like him though, who was playing Central Districts tennis on a Thursday just a few years ago. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Maybe not the right thread for this but we lost 4-1 to Ukraine with Eaton getting a consolation fifth rubber 7-5 in the 3rd. Highly debatable that Murray would have made much difference? He would almost certainly have gotten two singles but would he have played doubles? And would he have won even if he had played? I suspect had Murray been available it would have been Eaton who didn't play so we'd most likely still only have gotten two singles and it would only have been relevant if Murray had played and won doubles and I don't think it was Lloyd's intention that he do so was it? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 I don't think it was Lloyd's intention that he do so was it? Lloyd will do as Murray tells him. Sadly, he calls the shots, even though once again he has bloused out with a pathetic excuse. He will probably win Indian Wells next week. He should have been at Braehead supporting the team as well, even if not playing. I think he'd have played three matches. Him and hutchins are good pals, so he'd have played with him. I think they might have won as well - Stakhovsky and Bubka were no better than average. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Savage Henry Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Maybe not the right thread for this but we lost 4-1 to Ukraine with Eaton getting a consolation fifth rubber 7-5 in the 3rd.Highly debatable that Murray would have made much difference? He would almost certainly have gotten two singles but would he have played doubles? And would he have won even if he had played? I suspect had Murray been available it would have been Eaton who didn't play so we'd most likely still only have gotten two singles and it would only have been relevant if Murray had played and won doubles and I don't think it was Lloyd's intention that he do so was it? If somebody got a singles victory, that'll be, I think, the first victory by anyone not named Rusedski, Henman or Murray since 1997. Somebody mentioned that stat on Five Live earlier today, I didn't think it could possibly be true... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yer Maw Has a Sac. Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 I was there on the Friday. The Ukranians were poor, which just shows how bad we were. Goodall's bad start to each set cost him the match. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 (edited) If somebody got a singles victory, that'll be, I think, the first victory by anyone not named Rusedski, Henman or Murray since 1997. Somebody mentioned that stat on Five Live earlier today, I didn't think it could possibly be true... Why not? I'd have thought it might have been longer actually. That's only ten years, the vast majority of which has seen some combination of the three names above being the singles players and, when any of them weren't there, Alex Bogdanovic stepping in and we all know about his infamously atrocious David Cup record! The presence of those three, particularly the first two has also had us playing Davis Cup sometimes at a level higher than we would normally be and when anyone else has occasionally had a game they've faced someone much better than them normally. I recall Arvind Parmar chucking away a winning position in one or two games when he breifly flattered to deceive about being a half decent player. EDIT - Actually on checking the spelling of Parmar's name on Wiki I see it claims he DID win a Davis Cup tie match in 2006 so your stat is wrong it would seem (or Wiki is but it's very specific). I think it's more likely the stat given was that no-one other than those three has won a rubber that wasn't dead in that time. And if so then it's still true as the game was already lost before Eaton's win today. FURTHER EDIT - ApparentlyJamie Baker won a dead 5th rubber in the last tie in Argentina too. Alan Mackin won a dead 5th rubber v Israel in 2006 and, astonishingly enough, Bogdanovic won one against Todd Woodbridge of Australia in 2003. Records on Wiki only go back to 2002 in terms of individual match results. In 1997 we won 3-2 against Ukraine and lost 4-1 to Zimbabwe. presumably this win for someone else was in one of those two games, more likely the former. Edited March 8, 2009 by Skyline Drifter 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Andrew Richardson was the last guy to win a "live rubber" not one of those three. And that was against Zimbabwe. An utterly disgusting record. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 Andrew Richardson was the last guy to win a "live rubber" not one of those three. And that was against Zimbabwe. An utterly disgusting record. I've never even heard of him! I'm not sure it's that disgusting though is it? Like I suggested before, I'd imagine for most of that time only those three played live rubbers? I know there'd have been injuries from time to time but how many live rubbers were actually played by anyone else? And how many of those by someone other than Bogdanovic? We only play a couple of Davis Cup matches a year. Since 1997 there will have been what, the low 20's in matches? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theentomologist Posted March 8, 2009 Share Posted March 8, 2009 utter rubbish. fairly clear had Murray been able to play they would have at least had to win 3 as he would have wiped the floor with the ones he played -in fact he could probably have played the doubles as well and still killed them -they were that bad. one point i'm not clear on though -why no sign of the other murray? if its the whole not doing much on the doubles scene argument that rubbish, he's not doing anything cause he has that muppet what's-his-face as a partner, he's still the only selectable player to have won anything remotely good (mixed doubles wimber?) other than his brother. in fact murray (a)/a.n. other and murrays in doubles would probably been enough. nayway is it poland I heard we have to play next to avoid relegation -question actually, where do we get relegated to! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 utter rubbish.fairly clear had Murray been able to play they would have at least had to win 3 as he would have wiped the floor with the ones he played -in fact he could probably have played the doubles as well and still killed them -they were that bad. one point i'm not clear on though -why no sign of the other murray? if its the whole not doing much on the doubles scene argument that rubbish, he's not doing anything cause he has that muppet what's-his-face as a partner, he's still the only selectable player to have won anything remotely good (mixed doubles wimber?) other than his brother. in fact murray (a)/a.n. other and murrays in doubles would probably been enough. nayway is it poland I heard we have to play next to avoid relegation -question actually, where do we get relegated to! Jamie Murray wasn't picked because he's hardly won a game for a year and is way out of form. He's got better pedigree than anyone else available but no form to speak of. If we were to be relegated it would be to Group 2 of the Euro African Zone where we'd face the likes of Ireland! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 I know there'd have been injuries from time to time but how many live rubbers were actually played by anyone else? A lot more than you'd think. I'd go for at least 20. That may be conservative actually. I'm sure Bogdanovic has lost double figures on his own. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Radford Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 I too have never heard of Andrew Richardson and I have a good memory for duff British tennis players! Part of the problem is obviously the lack of incentive for these guys to play but not just in financial terms but in terms of pride. The Americans or Spanish for instance, will see it as more of an honour to be picked ahead of fellow top class players but Murray and Henman and Rusedski knew they'd be picked and it takes away the edge. If we had three top class players, you can bet Murray would have made more of an effort to be available. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 (edited) A lot more than you'd think. I'd go for at least 20. That may be conservative actually. I'm sure Bogdanovic has lost double figures on his own. Well that's why I actually said in the first post, "How many were played by anyone other than Bogdanovic?" Seriously though, since that game against Zimbabwe we've played 25 Davis Cup ties according to Wiki. Wiki has detailed results for the most recent 16 but not the 9 before that. In the most recent 16, the following players have played a live singles rubber other than the big three: 2009 v Ukraine - Josh Goodall lost in 3 sets (all tiebreaks) to Marchenko ; Chris Eaton lost in 4 sets to Stakhovsky 2008 v Argentina - Jamie Baker lost in 3 sets to Nalbandian ; Bogdanovic lost in 3 sets to Calleri 2008 v Austria - Bogdanovic lost in 4 sets to Melzer & in 4 sets to Peya 2006 v Serbia - Arvind Parmar lost in 3 sets to Djokovic 2006 v Israel - Bogdanovic lost in 3 sets to Okun ; Jamie Delgado lost in 5 sets to Okun 2005 v Israel - Bogdanovic lost in 3 sets to Okun 2005 v Switzerland - Alan Mackin lost in 3 sets to Federer 2004 v Luxembourg - Parmar lost in 5 sets to Muller 2003 v Australia - Mackin lost in 3 sets to Philippoussis ; Bogdanovic lost in 3 sets to Hewitt 2002 v Thailand - Martin Lee lost in 3 sets to Srichaphan So, in the last 16 matches, there's been 15 live rubbers played by someone other than the big three, of which two were this weekend and Bogdanovic played six of the other 13. That's only seven other failed attempts. Of the seven failures, one was against Federer. No shame there. One also against Djokovic. No real shame there either. Jamie Baker couldn't seriously have been expected to beat Nalbandian, nor Mackin to beat 'The Scud' either. Which leaves what? Delgado's defeat to Noam Okun and Parmar's to Gilles Muller. And possibly Martin Lee's loss to Srichaphan, although the Thai was a bloody good player for a while. I would imagine even more of the pre 2002 games were played by Henman and Rusedski so I'm not expecting an awful lot more lost live rubbers in the group I don't have results for. I'm not saying it's good, clearly it's not, I just don't think it's quite as disgraceful or "disgusting" as it's being made out to be. EDIT - Apart from Bogdanovic obviously! RE-Edit - I've worked out how to interrogate the Davis Cup website for historic results. Those other 9 ties failed rubbers for non big 3 players: 2000 v Czech Republic - Delgado lost in 3 sets to Jiri Novak 2000 v Ecuador - Parmar lost in 5 sets to Giovanni Lapentti 1997 v Zimbabwe - Delgado lost to Byron Black on Day 2 AFTER the Richardson win. So actually in all the time since Richardson beat Black in 5 sets we've had 18 "live" singles rubbers in a row lost by someone other than Henman, Rusedski and Murray, four of which were in the last two ties. Bogdanovic had 5 of the other 14 and most of the rest were simply the result of playing against better players. A couple of winnable losses for Parmar, both in five set matches, and maybe a couple for Delgado is all that's really disappointing. Edited March 9, 2009 by Skyline Drifter 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theentomologist Posted March 9, 2009 Share Posted March 9, 2009 Jamie Murray wasn't picked because he's hardly won a game for a year and is way out of form. He's got better pedigree than anyone else available but no form to speak of. If we were to be relegated it would be to Group 2 of the Euro African Zone where we'd face the likes of Ireland! form is temporary. statistically true, but look at the rubbish he is playing with. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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