Things that are eroding British Nationalism

[~~~]

Wallowing in self persecution, it's the food and drink the separatists crave for. Just don't understand the constant need to hold so tightly to this inferiority complex.

"Separatists"

I'm cringing for you. That is awful chat.

[forever_blue]

Education and healthcare are free?

Did the Government (past and present) find a money tree somewhere?

You know fine well what I meant , anyone who thinks that we in 21st century scotland resemble anything close to 2nd class citizens need to take their heads out their arse and live in the real world

[~~~]

You know fine well what I meant , anyone who thinks that we in 21st century scotland resemble anything close to 2nd class citizens need to take their heads out their arse and live in the real world

So you're saying Scotland is part of a "Union of equals" one that "leads the UK"

Really?

[Antlion]

Wallowing in self persecution, it's the food and drink the separatists crave for. Just don't understand the constant need to hold so tightly to this inferiority complex.

Are you seriously attempting to claim that the regionalist argument was not predicated on Scotland being too poor, weak and stupid to govern itself?

http://www.betternation.org/2012/10/scotland-isnt-too-wee-for-independence-its-just-too-poor/

http://newsnet.scot/?p=106850

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-debate/a-separated-scotland-pound-foolish/article20566276/?service=mobile

Inferiority complex? The regionalists were certainly happy to claim Scotland was so inferior it must remain a region of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, lest its poverty, weakness and stupidity be unleashed.

[forever_blue]

So you're saying Scotland is part of a "Union of equals" one that "leads the UK"

Really?

Do you honestly believe we are treated as 2nd class citizens ?

[~~~]

Do you honestly believe we are treated as 2nd class citizens ?

Outstanding deflecting from my questions. If you answer mine, I'll happily answer yours.

[forever_blue]

Outstanding deflecting from my questions. If you answer mine, I'll happily answer yours.

Your question is a different matter entirely , we are certainly not second class citizens here in Scotland , anyone who genuinley believes so is a fucking idiot to put it mildly

[~~~]

Your question is a different matter entirely , we are certainly not second class citizens here in Scotland , anyone who genuinley believes so is a fucking idiot to put it mildly

Fucking hell

Is Scotland in a "union of equals" as part of the U.K.?

If you keep dodging the question, I can only assume you believe we are not, but either too stubborn or embarrassed to admit it.

So, are we?

[RedRob72]

Are you seriously attempting to claim that the regionalist argument was not predicted on Scotland being too poor, weak and stupid to govern itself?

http://www.betternation.org/2012/10/scotland-isnt-too-wee-for-independence-its-just-too-poor/

http://newsnet.scot/?p=106850

One bloggers view means the rest of us are all of the same mindset does it eh!? The guy tries to make an economic argument that's all, some agreed some didn't. Where does he say that we are too wee and too stupid, did I miss that bit?

[~~~]

One bloggers view means the rest of us are all of the same mindset does it eh!? The guy tries to make an economic argument that's all, some agreed some didn't. Where does he say that we are too wee and too stupid, did I miss that bit?

What about you Rob, do you believe Scotland is an equal member of this political union?

[forever_blue]

Fucking hell

Is Scotland in a "union of equals" as part of the U.K.?

If you keep dodging the question, I can only assume you believe we are not, but either too stubborn or embarrassed to admit it.

So, are we?

Yes in my view we are , however it is a question which is a completely different debate from what I am going about , anyone who thinks we are oppressed or treated as second class citizens is deluded , if you agree with that statement as I said you a re a fucking idiot

[Antlion]

One bloggers view means the rest of us are all of the same mindset does it eh!? The guy tries to make an economic argument that's all, some agreed some didn't. Where does he say that we are too wee and too stupid, did I miss that bit?

These were simply samples of the arguments which formed the basis of the ongoing campaign to keep Scotland a region of the UK. Yes, you clearly did miss the various articles' (now edited to include three) claims that we are too wee, poor and stupid to govern ourselves. Each claim is predicated on one of these arguments. We were told we would lose our "clout" on the world stage and become swallowed up by the EU (too wee); that there would be a net loss to Scotland's trade, a fiscal black hole, a dependency on oil, a capital flight, an inability to pay our pensions (too poor); and that we'd willingly and blindly become a jack-booted one party state if we tried to become an independent country (too stupid).

[~~~]

Yes in my view we are

So, not only Scotland, but all nations that make up the UK all have equal say and influence within the UK.

If that's the case, then why does English MPs out number the rest of the U.K. put together.

That doesn't day equal to me, that kinda suggestions what 1 nations wants, the rest have to go along with it.

Trident, bedroom tax, privatisation of Royal Mail, etc.... are just a few things that spring to mind. Not to mention on things like the EU, if Scotland, Wales and NI vote to stay a member, and England votes to leave.

What would happen in that scenario?

But please, do explain why we are equals within this political union.

[forever_blue]

So, not only Scotland, but all nations that make up the UK all have equal say and influence within the UK.

If that's the case, then why does English MPs out number the rest of the U.K. put together.

That doesn't day equal to me, that kinda suggestions what 1 nations wants, the rest have to go along with it.

Trident, bedroom tax, privatisation of Royal Mail, etc.... are just a few things that spring to mind.

But please, do explain why we are equals within this political union.

You are the one who has started this debate , I answered yours and you said you would answer mine? Do you actually See us 2nd class citizens ?

[~~~]

You are the one who has started this debate , I answered yours and you said you would answer mine? Do you actually See us 2nd class citizens ?

Another deflection.

No, we are not 2nd class citizens in the UK, legally speaking if you commit a crime in Cornwall you'll be treated the same as someone from Belfast, Cardiff or London.

Our representatives within the UK at Westminster are 2nd class now as Parliament has voted to remove certain rights for them, to make them unequal.

Unfortunately this means a Scottish, Welsh or NI MP are effectively barred from becoming PM.

So, still going to tell me this is a union of equals?

[forever_blue]

Another deflection.

No, we are not 2nd class citizens in the UK, legally speaking if you commit a crime in Cornwall you'll be treated the same as someone from Belfast, Cardiff or London.

Our representatives within the UK at Westminster are 2nd class now as Parliament has voted to remove certain rights for them, to make them unequal.

Unfortunately this means a Scottish, Welsh or NI MP are effectively barred from becoming PM.

So, still going to tell me this is a union of equals?

What rights have been removed ?

[Antlion]

So, not only Scotland, but all nations that make up the UK all have equal say and influence within the UK.

If that's the case, then why does English MPs out number the rest of the U.K. put together.

That doesn't day equal to me, that kinda suggestions what 1 nations wants, the rest have to go along with it.

Trident, bedroom tax, privatisation of Royal Mail, etc.... are just a few things that spring to mind. Not to mention on things like the EU, if Scotland, Wales and NI vote to stay a member, and England votes to leave.

What would happen in that scenario?

But please, do explain why we are equals within this political union.

The population densities of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland preclude these regions of the U.K. from ever being equal partners in its governance. The claim that we were equal partners was never anything than an outrageous, laughable lie designed to sound good and appeal to the hard of thinking.

Similarly, the "family of nations" line has been abandoned by Cameron, who specifically said at the Tory Party conference that he loved "all the regions of our one great nation".

In terms of representation and voting power, no nation (or former nation) can call itself an "equal partner" in an incorporating union of which it comprises 10%.

[~~~]

What rights have been removed ?

You not been paying attention to whats happening in the UK parliament?

[RedRob72]

What about you Rob, do you believe Scotland is an equal member of this political union?

Yep we are 'as equal' as our partners within the Union for me. I don't have a problem at all with devolved powers to Scot, NI Wales or Eng with regards to legislation that affects those nations alone, why would anyone object to that?

Our MP's will still have the power to veto all proposed changes that have any implication whatsoever for Scotland.

[Antlion]

What rights have been removed ?

The rights of "British" MPs who happen to represent Scottish, Welsh or Northern Irish constituencies to play a full role in forming and blocking legislation have been curtailed. The U.K. Parliament has, for the first time, broken down the right of British MPs along national lines.