Antlion Posted October 23, 2015 Author Share Posted October 23, 2015 Scottish MP's will still get to have a say on matters discussed at the UK parliament which affect Scotland, that's good for me. I don't see why the Scottish MP's feel they should have a say on English only matters (as long as they don't affect us in any way) when English MP's don't get the same opportunity to have a say on Scotland only matters. And yet its the Scottish MP's who are being reduced to 'second-class politicians'. Our MP's will still get a say in the final votes on matters which affect another part of the UK and don't have any bearing on us. EVEL hasn't gone far enough. Still, Salmond, Sturgeon, Sheridan and the other Yes losers will cry foul at any old thing in the hope of portraying big, nasty Westminster in a bad light. The very fact that you are gleefully pointing out that their are "Scottish" MPs who should not have a say on matters which should be the preserve of "English MPs" is exactly what "Yes" supporters have been pointing out for years now. The myth of Westminster being the executive, sovereign home for "British" MPs (since all MPs were meant to be British and never restricted in voting or debating on any matters in that house) is now, as you have tacitly admitted, dead. Now the Treaty of Union has been revoked by the Tories in the pursuit of breaking up the House of Commons by nationality, why not repeal the thing entirely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRob72 Posted October 23, 2015 Share Posted October 23, 2015 That's because you're total c***s you blinkered fuckwit HTH another f*ckin keyboard hard boy who would never speak like that to a stranger in the street! Deary me ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRob72 Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 1445617708339.jpg The club was liquidated, it's not breaking news, we're still here following our team, 1872 or 2012, no one gives a f*ck apart from the Rangers hating hordes because they've nothing else to get excited about. Follow your own team mate, could be a good year eh!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarusQPFC Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 British Nationalism is for idiotic Sevco supporters, the kind of arseholes who throw girls to the ground, tear a Scottish flag from thier hands, burn it and cry "We love Scotland more than you" the kind of morons who would love to see every street lined with Union Jacks and publicly endorse Tory rule, EVEL and people being sanctioned literally to death. The kind of fuckwitts who hold on to this notion that Britain is still great and not becoming a victorian nightmare that needs it's precious nuclear weapons to protect us from the bad people. I have 0 respect for any no voters and never will again, shower of c***s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 British Nationalism is for idiotic Sevco supporters, the kind of arseholes who throw girls to the ground, tear a Scottish flag from thier hands, burn it and cry "We love Scotland more than you" the kind of morons who would love to see every street lined with Union Jacks and publicly endorse Tory rule, EVEL and people being sanctioned literally to death. The kind of fuckwitts who hold on to this notion that Britain is still great and not becoming a victorian nightmare that needs it's precious nuclear weapons to protect us from the bad people. I have 0 respect for any no voters and never will again, shower of c***s. You been out tonight Edgar? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarusQPFC Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 You been out tonight Edgar? Nah, just pissed off with this EVEL shite and being stuck in this union where we are now actually second class citizens. And I'm even more pissed off that we had the opportunity to get away from this and some short sighted cowards voted against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevthedee Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 I have 0 respect for any no voters and never will again, shower of c***s. Another tears and snotters rant against no voters,accept the democratic will of the people and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scary Bear Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 What happened to the 56 Marching on Westminster and bouncing off the walls mate?The 56 are a lasting reminder that no matter which party Scotland votes for - even it votes for one party en masse - England rules.I noticed this article the other day. http://www.economist.com/blogs/bagehot/2015/10/another-crack-union?fsrc=scn/fb/wl/bl/st/englishonlyvotessetbritainonthepathtofederalisationorbreakup 'The country should be an unwieldy, unstable beast: few multi-part polities in which one segment is much mightier than the others work out. But Britain’s union, 84% of which is England, has lasted for three centuries because the English have for centuries allowed their political identity to be blurred into that of the British state (as I argued more fully in a recent column, pasted below this post). Today’s vote draws a line under that; a faint one, perhaps, but a line nonetheless.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlion Posted October 24, 2015 Author Share Posted October 24, 2015 Anyone who voted yes must be absolutely delusional. Why is that? Because Scotland could never, possibly, ever be a sovereign state (unlike every other sovereign state in the world, none of which are desperately seeking London rule)? "No" voters generally seem to fall into one of several camps: British nationalists who identify the UK as their country and Scotland as their region; people who think Scotland is too poor, wee and/or stupid to survive without a failing, incompetent government mercifully elected by non-Scottish voters to run it; Uncle Tams who know Scotland could be better off as an independent state, but want it to remain in the union because it's still worth something to their masters. Historically, Scotland has a culture of cringing inferiority, which has only begun to erode in the last few decades. For centuries (and still in the eyes of many), our identity was contingent on being "British", and we were encouraged to see the union as being a civilising influence which elevated us from the embarrassing failure we Scots were at running their own country. That's how we ended up with creatures like "Jesus created the union" Question Time loonie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Psychosis Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 It would be easier to be pleased about a decline in British Nationalism if it weren't accompanied by a rise in Scottish Nationalism. Nationalism of any flavour is worrying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 It would be easier to be pleased about a decline in British Nationalism if it weren't accompanied by a rise in Scottish Nationalism. Nationalism of any flavour is worrying. Why ? Billions of people around the globe love their country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 It would be easier to be pleased about a decline in British Nationalism if it weren't accompanied by a rise in Scottish Nationalism. Nationalism of any flavour is worrying. Too simplistic a view I'm afraid. There are very different versions of nationalism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlion Posted October 24, 2015 Author Share Posted October 24, 2015 It would be easier to be pleased about a decline in British Nationalism if it weren't accompanied by a rise in Scottish Nationalism. Nationalism of any flavour is worrying. That sounds very much like something you've been told to think rather than something you do. At any rate it's incredibly platitudinous. The reality is, nationalism *can* be, (depending on its "flavour") worrying; it needn't be. Aggressive, ethnic nationalism is worrying (and this has long been associated British nationalism); welcoming, civic nationalism (which has thankfully become associated with Scottish nationalism, the opponent of British Nationalism) is not particularly worrying. The truth if, if nationalism "of any flavour" is worrying, then every single recognised nation on earth is worrying. Every state liberated from occupation is worrying. Every former colony that regained independence is worrying. Every nation which reformed after having been annexed is worrying. Every nation which formed out of a number of smaller kingdoms is worrying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Psychosis Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 That sounds very much like something you've been told to think rather than something you do. At any rate it's incredibly platitudinous. The reality is, nationalism *can* be, (depending on its "flavour") worrying; it needn't be. Aggressive, ethnic nationalism is worrying (and this has long been associated British nationalism); welcoming, civic nationalism (which has thankfully become associated with Scottish nationalism, the opponent of British Nationalism) is not particularly worrying. Right enough, the endless chat from the Scottish Nationalists about "traitors" and "shitebags" and "Uncle Tams" all over this forum and all over social media are definitely not aggressive, not worrying, and doubtless make people feel very welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 Right enough, the endless chat from the Scottish Nationalists about "traitors" and "shitebags" and "Uncle Tams" all over this forum and all over social media are definitely not aggressive, not worrying, and doubtless make people feel very welcome. They're full of frustration. It's not in any way aggressive to anyone outside of Scotland who is thinking if coming here. I don't agree with it but it's solely directed at no voters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlion Posted October 24, 2015 Author Share Posted October 24, 2015 Right enough, the endless chat from the Scottish Nationalists about "traitors" and "shitebags" and "Uncle Tams" all over this forum and all over social media are definitely not aggressive, not worrying, and doubtless make people feel very welcome. Are you suggesting that, in an independent Scotland, "no" voters would be in some kind of danger and/or social pariahs? Personally, I reckon everyone would get along perfectly well and pull together to build a strong nation.In fact, even during the referendum campaign, I can't recall any outbreaks of violence or real acrimony (except from a few instances of British Nationalists attacking others). To claim that people feel unwelcome in this country because of fruity political language is to suggest that no one feels welcome in this country. After all, how often do read about "Tory scum", "pinko commies", "enemies of the state", "loony lefties" (and that can just be the Houses of Parliament!). Is "worrying nationalism" to blame for political abuse heaped on just about everyone for every affiliation (whether it be of class, ideology or party)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevthedee Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 That sounds very much like something you've been told to think rather than something you do. At any rate it's incredibly platitudinous. The reality is, nationalism *can* be, (depending on its "flavour") worrying; it needn't be. Aggressive, ethnic nationalism is worrying (and this has long been associated British nationalism); welcoming, civic nationalism (which has thankfully become associated with Scottish nationalism, the opponent of British Nationalism) is not particularly worrying. The truth if, if nationalism "of any flavour" is worrying, then every single recognised nation on earth is worrying. Every state liberated from occupation is worrying. Every former colony that regained independence is worrying. Every nation which reformed after having been annexed is worrying. Every nation which formed out of a number of smaller kingdoms is worrying. So you class scottish nationalism as not worrying,maybe you should read some of the comments on here and other sites from people who like to abuse and make threats to others just because of how they voted or if they dare to question the Scottish National Party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Psychosis Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 Are you suggesting that, in an independent Scotland, "no" voters would be in some kind of danger and/or social pariahs? Personally, I reckon everyone would get along perfectly well and pull together to build a strong nation. I'm suggesting that Nationalism has a history of ending badly and should always be treated with caution, not making predictions about hypotheticals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antlion Posted October 24, 2015 Author Share Posted October 24, 2015 I'm suggesting that Nationalism has a history of ending badly and should always be treated with caution, not making predictions about hypotheticals. It's not radium! As for nationalism having a history of ending badly then I'm afraid humanity is screwed, as the nation state is the dominant sociological construct on the planet and has been for centuries. We must be on our way to ruin, the lot of us, until we have one single Earth Government with no concept of nations or borders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Psychosis Posted October 24, 2015 Share Posted October 24, 2015 It's not radium! As for nationalism having a history of ending badly then I'm afraid humanity is screwed, as the nation state is the dominant sociological construct on the planet and has been for centuries. We must be on our way to ruin, the lot of us, until we have one single Earth Government with no concept of nations or borders. No, its not radium but the very reason why the phrase "civic nationalism" has been used in Scotland so much for the last three years is exactly because large parts of the independence movement agree with me when it comes to capital-N Nationalism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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