Part Time V Full Time

[parsforlife]

Oh and there is a reason every single team that can afford a fully ft squad do so.

[Albino Rover]

IMO there should be more shame on full-time teams who lose midweek games to part-timers. It's not exactly a big deal when Dumbarton or Alloa win at the weekend but surely there can be no excuse for pro footballers to lose to a team who have had to rush to get to the game from their work.

[vikingTON]

IMO there should be more shame on full-time teams who lose midweek games to part-timers. It's not exactly a big deal when Dumbarton or Alloa win at the weekend but surely there can be no excuse for pro footballers to lose to a team who have had to rush to get to the game from their work.

If part-time players were working down a Soviet uranium mine during the day then you might have a valid point. As it is, there's no reason why working in an office or similar would cause a huge drop in performance in a match later in the day. Not ideal preparation but it's clearly not a decisive factor.

[Darren1872]

If part-time players were working down a Soviet uranium mine during the day then you might have a valid point. As it is, there's no reason why working in an office or similar would cause a huge drop in performance in a match later in the day. Not ideal preparation but it's clearly not a decisive factor.

What about getting up at 6am to go work in a factory, then slogging through your day to play a game of footy at 8pm. Opposed to having a full day of preparation and being fully rested.

[vikingTON]

Well let's run through that shall we? It's not 1952 - manufacturing is now a tiny fraction of the UK economy; many of the energy-intensive processes are carried out by machinery or robotics anyway; of the fraction of the workforce "working in factories", semi-professional footballers are likely even thinner on the ground than would be expected, due to the selective nature of physical occupations + physical part-time work.

For all the largely mythical sob stories, the bottom line is that the majority of part-time Scottish footballers will be engaged in hum-drum, white collar and service occupations, as much as anyone else. David McGurn for example was working as a sports science lecturer or similar at Cardonald College; not slaving to meet the demands of the Five Year Plan in Omsk. While such roles are not ideal preparation, they simply do not make part-time players physically exhausted and unlikely to perform to a high level on a Tuesday night. It's a red herring in 2016.

[Rovers_Lad]

In our case no great difference between part time and full time which has been most prevalent in our last two games

[Wilky1878]

Well let's run through that shall we? It's not 1952 - manufacturing is now a tiny fraction of the UK economy; many of the energy-intensive processes are carried out by machinery or robotics anyway; of the fraction of the workforce "working in factories", semi-professional footballers are likely even thinner on the ground than would be expected, due to the selective nature of physical occupations + physical part-time work.

For all the largely mythical sob stories, the bottom line is that the majority of part-time Scottish footballers will be engaged in hum-drum, white collar and service occupations, as much as anyone else. David McGurn for example was working as a sports science lecturer or similar at Cardonald College; not slaving to meet the demands of the Five Year Plan in Omsk. While such roles are not ideal preparation, they simply do not make part-time players physically exhausted and unlikely to perform to a high level on a Tuesday night. It's a red herring in 2016.

On the flipside alloa have had joiners, construction workers etc... Out on the tools all day. So for some it is tiring yes.

[Rovers_Lad]

f**k sake,don't pander to this muppet

[vikingTON]

f**k sake,don't pander to this muppet

Stick to 'accusing' posters you don't like of being homosexuals on the other thread champ, the adults are talking here.

[sonsanorak]

Assuming a ft and a pt time player can reach the same levels of fitness, the biggest difference is the opportunity to practise individually and within a team structure that ft time gives you.

The regular complaint from our manager is only having the players for a few hours between games in order to work on organisation, shape, set pieces etc as well as individual skills, roles or recovery.

The biggest benefit I see for a ft team is the opportunity to better the organisation and skills of the team.

[Rovers1992/1993]

Stick to 'accusing' posters you don't like of being homosexuals on the other thread champ, the adults are talking here.

[CowdenConvert]

What about getting up at 6am to go work in a factory, then slogging through your day to play a game of footy at 8pm. Opposed to having a full day of preparation and being fully rested.

This is what I've thought makes the difference. Full time players get better rest to allow muscle recovery.

In general though full time players are technically better than part timers hence the reason they've been signed by bigger full time clubs. You get the odd exception like mcgurn and chris turner from a couple of seasons ago but not many.

[George Parr]

Assuming a ft and a pt time player can reach the same levels of fitness

I'd say this is a pretty big assumption actually. I use the same gym as the QoS players, who appear to be in there almost every midweek afternoon for hours on end.

I should imagine most of the Dumbarton team would find it impossible to fit in that kind of commitment around their day job, football training and whatever else is going on in their personal lives.

Full time teams have a substantial advantage over PT and it shows when you look at general league positions. If the likes of Livvy or St.Mirren finish behind us this season we should all really be pointing and laughing.

[AsimButtHitsASix]

What Dumbarton has to offer ahead of most of the teams in their division is to offer the best part time footballers a half decent wage + their day job salary which is more at the end of the week than anyone else, bar two teams, in the division can offer. I don't think the wage between a Dumbarton or Alloa player is a huge chasm compared to what Morton, Livvy or Raith offer.

[Skyline Drifter]

I'm not sure physical fitness is that much of a factor in the FT v PT thing. The full timers have the benefit of being paid to be fit but most decent part timers will do enough gym work and running to be just as fit. The main difference is in the time to work together as a squad and work on tactics, set pieces, etc. Plus generally better players prefer to be full time so gravitate towards those clubs inherently making them better.

That said as much credit as Dumbarton and Alloa in particular deserve for their achievements in the last few seasons, the idea that they are both full of guys who spend their days in factories or down pits is fanciful. I would think circa half their players are effectively full time or close to it. Off the top of my head Dumbarton have Mark Brown, Steven Saunders, Darren Barr, Jamie Lindsay, the Waters boy, Tom Walsh, (Scott Brown until recently) who are full time. There are probably others. Some of the rest will have part time jobs they fit round their football. Alloa will be similar I expect.

[cameron2000]

6/11 of our starting team against raith were full time last season and mark brown wasn't playing.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

I'm not sure physical fitness is that much of a factor in the FT v PT thing. The full timers have the benefit of being paid to be fit but most decent part timers will do enough gym work and running to be just as fit. The main difference is in the time to work together as a squad and work on tactics, set pieces, etc. Plus generally better players prefer to be full time so gravitate towards those clubs inherently making them better.

That said as much credit as Dumbarton and Alloa in particular deserve for their achievements in the last few seasons, the idea that they are both full of guys who spend their days in factories or down pits is fanciful. I would think circa half their players are effectively full time or close to it. Off the top of my head Dumbarton have Mark Brown, Steven Saunders, Darren Barr, Jamie Lindsay, the Waters boy, Tom Walsh, (Scott Brown until recently) who are full time. There are probably others. Some of the rest will have part time jobs they fit round their football. Alloa will be similar I expect.

The only actual full-time players we have are the loan boys.

Barr, Brown, Wright, Saunders etc are only on part-time contracts and judging by Twitter some of them have starting working outside of football.

I do tend to agree with your post though. Guys putting a shift in on a building site may obviously suffer a bit physically but I'm not sure we even have any builders/labourers or the likes. The main issue is the squad only having 2 evenings a week to work on tactics and shape. Aitken and previously Murray have listed this as their main frustration and biggest disadvantage against full-timers.

[Jan Vojáček]

The only actual full-time players we have are the loan boys.

Barr, Brown, Wright, Saunders etc are only on part-time contracts and judging by Twitter some of them have starting working outside of football.

I do tend to agree with your post though. Guys putting a shift in on a building site may obviously suffer a bit physically but I'm not sure we even have any builders/labourers or the likes. The main issue is the squad only having 2 evenings a week to work on tactics and shape. Aitken and previously Murray have listed this as their main frustration and biggest disadvantage against full-timers.

Wright's a personal trainer now and Brown works for Vitality Health Insurance, don't know about the other two though.

SD, "The Waters boy" If I wasn't in a rush just now I'd photoshop him onto a DVD cover

[MrDust]

A part time team has a win/decent result and questions are usually asked what's the difference.... I know I have when its happened.

Alloa last season had a superb record v Rangers in losing only one in five games, the budget difference alone is bewildering never mind full time v part time, I think in general players are now fitter, taking care of the body more than yesteryear and a good few of the part time players have played at a higher level being full time, in which training isnt going to improve them as a player.

I dont think there is a big difference over full time v part time in a single match, if the part time team has the right mix of fitness, attitude, skill and organisation, its long term that makes the difference where games come thick and fast, 3 games over 7/8 days must effect part time teams and the longevity of a whole league season.

Alloa and Dumbarton over recent years have shown to have better teams than Livvy and have carried the flag for the part time teams, I have to say Dumbarton have taught us a lesson or two at the TFS, albeit a few year ago

[NewBlue]

Having been a full time athlete before reverting to part time (not football but an endurance sport) I thought I would throw in my 2 pence and say there is a huge difference. This year I will be aiming to train 12 hours a week (2 hours a day, 6 days a week) but it is the way I train that creates the difference. I used to do my first session in the morning then have lunch and sleep and then train again in the afternoon, and that rest makes a huge difference. Also I have to limit the time I can allocate to sessions. A two hour training session in the evening after a long day at work is tough to fit in, especially if I have to take the weather into account as I don't really have any flexibility to change my training schedule. Also nutrition is a problem, if something unexpected pops up at work then I might miss lunch or not be able to have my afternoon meal so that then impacts on any training I want to do. As someone said earlier physio and facilities can make a huge difference, for me the first sessions to get dropped are things like that as well as long stretching and recovery sessions as sometimes there just isn't time for them. So although I can match a full time athlete as a one off or a good performance from me, I couldn't do it consistently as they will recover quicker and be better conditioned for any intensive periods of competition.

In football I notice that when we play full time teams they always seem to be bigger and more physical so I guess there maybe is a difference, although at lower levels there are a lot of ex full time players who can probably help close the gap for part time teams.