18May1991 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 17 minutes ago, C4mmy31 said: me too...... FFS. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
18May1991 Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 5 minutes ago, YassinMoutaouakil said: Maguire has been anonymous every time I've seen him but surely he's still a better option at centre back than Lamie? I'd rather not notice somebody being on the park than start at least one goal down every week. I thought he was ok today. As you say, better option than the alternative. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well fan for life Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 7 minutes ago, YassinMoutaouakil said: Maguire has been anonymous every time I've seen him but surely he's still a better option at centre back than Lamie? I'd rather not notice somebody being on the park than start at least one goal down every week. Dig a hole at centre back and it'll probably have a better chance of catching a forward. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) Possibly one of the more 'yer da' type posts I've made but listening to Robinson's comment post-match where he said (and I'm paraphrasing) that we basically chucked it after the first penalty and we didn't really have much belief of getting back in the game it made me wonder just how much we're missing the leadership element of folk like Hartley and Tait. Looking at the players we've brought in there's not one that you can imagine bringing the sort of attitude that either of them did. Edited September 27, 2020 by capt_oats 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 That is quite "yer da" but I'm inclined to agree. I thought Big Dec would be a cracking captain but he's not as combative as I thought he would be. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Busta Nut Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 Carson and Campbell are the only two who get any pass marks this season for me. The rest have been or are utter shite. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well fan for life Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 23 minutes ago, Busta Nut said: Carson and Campbell are the only two who get any pass marks this season for me. The rest have been or are utter shite. Carson & Campbell get pass marks. Lang & Watt have improved recently. The rest have been varying degrees of shite. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) So that was Robinson's heaviest defeat against Rangers at Fir Park since he's been manager. It also equals the biggest margin of defeat against the Old Firm at home on his watch (there is no Old Firm etc). I've thrown his results against Celtic at FP in there because, why not? Interestingly he had a better record against Rodgers at Fir Park than he does Lennon and Gerrard. 06/08/17 - vs Rangers 1-2 (L) 29/11/17 - vs Celtic 1-1 (X) 18/03/18 - vs Rangers 2-2 (X) 31/03/18 - vs Celtic 0-0 (X) 26/08/18 - vs Rangers 3-3 (X) 05/12/18 - vs Celtic 1-1 (X) 07/04/19 - vs Rangers 0-3 (L) 10/08/19 - vs Celtic 2-5 (L) 15/12/19 - vs Rangers 0-2 (L) 05/02/20 - vs Celtic 0-4 (L) 27/09/20 - vs Rangers 1-5 (L) To be clear that's not a criticism of Robinson but I'm definitely finding it hard to imagine this iteration of a team going down to 10 men against Celtic and keeping a clean sheet. Edited September 27, 2020 by capt_oats 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casagolda Posted September 27, 2020 Author Share Posted September 27, 2020 21 minutes ago, capt_oats said: So that was Robinson's heaviest defeat against Rangers at Fir Park since he's been manager. It also equals the biggest margin of defeat against the Old Firm at home on his watch (there is no Old Firm etc). I've thrown his results against Celtic at FP in there because, why not? Interestingly he had a better record against Rodgers at Fir Park than he does Lennon and Gerrard. 06/08/17 - vs Rangers 1-2 (L) 29/11/17 - vs Celtic 1-1 (X) 18/03/18 - vs Rangers 2-2 (X) 31/03/18 - vs Celtic 0-0 (X) 26/08/18 - vs Rangers 3-3 (X) 05/12/18 - vs Celtic 1-1 (X) 07/04/19 - vs Rangers 0-3 (L) 10/08/19 - vs Celtic 2-5 (L) 15/12/19 - vs Rangers 0-2 (L) 05/02/20 - vs Celtic 0-4 (L) 27/09/20 - vs Rangers 1-5 (L) Would that not be due to the change in style of play? Looking at that, you can’t help but notice that ‘big physical Motherwell’ had a far superior record against the OF at Fir Park than our current set up. We only lost 1 out of 6 games and even that was by a single goal(a penalty if memory serves me correct). Whereas the 5 games since the Jan 2019 change in playing style, we’ve lost them all by an aggregate score of 19-3... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, Casagolda said: Would that not be due to the change in style of play? Looking at that, you can’t help but notice that ‘big physical Motherwell’ had a far superior record against the OF at Fir Park than our current set up. We only lost 1 out of 6 games and even that was by a single goal(a penalty if memory serves me correct). Whereas the 5 games since the Jan 2019 change in playing style, we’ve lost them all by an aggregate score of 19-3... Absolutely. That 3-0 defeat against Rangers was the sexy Motherwell 433 edition. Like I said in my edit above, it's not a criticism as such but there's a definite point at which it's clear we've erm...found it more difficult. Edited September 28, 2020 by capt_oats 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well fan for life Posted September 27, 2020 Share Posted September 27, 2020 I think this is a very fair point to make. Campbell puts a shift in and would 50-50 his granny but he's not a shithouse. Tony Watt is decent at being a shit up top but is there anyone else that could fit that mould? I'd say not. I'm not saying we need to return to full thunderdome mode but we are exceptionally soft these days. We can play pretty football at times but we are crying out for someone who is just a total and utter b*****d. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YassinMoutaouakil Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 From that wee period in 2017 onwards I went into most OF games expecting a point at least and fearing a narrow defeat at worst. I remember finding out the score in the Arfield 0-3 game at work and being genuinely shocked at the scoreline. Pretty striking to see the difference laid out like above. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well fan for life Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 It's definitely something that's disappeared from the team. Even thinking about that incident right on half time on Thursday night. In seasons past you'd have seen Aldred/Hartley/definitely Tait steaming in ready to fight some c**t. Instead it seemed to be Tony Watt and about 9 Beersheva players hounding the referee. It just seems like nobody looks like they want to fight for a result. [/yerda] 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 I mean, in terms of the result yesterday I think it's naive to think that a round trip to Israel, playing a 90 mins in testing conditions with a day recovery wouldn't have an impact physically and mentally. From our starting XI yesterday only Bev didn't play a part on Thursday. Rangers rotated a bit after a trip to Holland and in the end had a fairly comfortable 4-0 win. That mitigates things to an extent. Having said that, Robinson put forward the same point in his post-match but admitted himself that it wasn't really an excuse for the result. He wasn't necessarily chucking players under a bus as he did post-Livi but there's definitely an implied question about mentality when he's talking about "players looking for excuses". I thought his comment about the club not necessarily judging themselves by results against the Old Firm, but he judges himself by those results was...interesting. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crazylegsjoe_mfc Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 (edited) What a character reference it is for the thunderdome era that we signed a guy whos done time for serious assault and all his pals and somehow managed to become softer. Edited September 28, 2020 by crazylegsjoe_mfc 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Desp Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 I know things are a bit shite just now, but we're not pining for the return of Richard Tait, are we? The same guy who was kept out of our team for months by Liam Grimshaw? Tait done well for us, but by the end he was done. One goal for St Mirren doesn't change that. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
capt_oats Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Desp said: I know things are a bit shite just now, but we're not pining for the return of Richard Tait, are we? The same guy who was kept out of our team for months by Liam Grimshaw? Tait done well for us, but by the end he was done. One goal for St Mirren doesn't change that. Agree with that tbh, for me it's more a question of the attitude side of things rather than anything Tait did on the park (certainly last season since as you point out he was hardly in the team). McGinley looks and carries himself like a fucking estate agent FFS. Edited September 28, 2020 by capt_oats 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ropy Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 1 hour ago, capt_oats said: I mean, in terms of the result yesterday I think it's naive to think that a round trip to Israel, playing a 90 mins in testing conditions with a day recovery wouldn't have an impact physically and mentally. From our starting XI yesterday only Bev didn't play a part on Thursday. Rangers rotated a bit after a trip to Holland and in the end had a fairly comfortable 4-0 win. That mitigates things to an extent. Having said that, Robinson put forward the same point in his post-match but admitted himself that it wasn't really an excuse for the result. He wasn't necessarily chucking players under a bus as he did post-Livi but there's definitely an implied question about mentality when he's talking about "players looking for excuses". I thought his comment about the club not necessarily judging themselves by results against the Old Firm, but he judges himself by those results was...interesting. I don’t think he said how the club judges themselves more that he hears we are not judged in these games, he could hear that from anywhere 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
well fan for life Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 18 minutes ago, Desp said: I know things are a bit shite just now, but we're not pining for the return of Richard Tait, are we? The same guy who was kept out of our team for months by Liam Grimshaw? Tait done well for us, but by the end he was done. One goal for St Mirren doesn't change that. I don't think anyone is saying we should be getting Richard Tait back but it does seem as though we are lacking a leader in this team akin to him or Hartley. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke92 Posted September 28, 2020 Share Posted September 28, 2020 To be honest our record recent record against the Old Firm, particularly at home is starting to piss me off. We seem to be swept aside far too easily. I look at lesser teams in the league and they seem to compete a bit better in this type of game than ourselves. It might be a bit of nostalgia but even going back to when we were relegation candidates it felt like we would give the Old Firm more of a game at Fir Park. You could argue the Old Firm has improved signficantly over the last couple of years, as well as this you could probably say that stylistically we maybe aren't as well catered to defend as well as some of the other teams in the league but for me it feels like we go in with pretty much the same game plan every time expecting a different result. Clearly the likes of Rangers are not our bread and butter but our record against Rangers is shocking, and sooner or later getting consistently pumped by them at home is going to rub the fans up the wrong way. At the very least, I expect us to be able to compete with them at Fir Park and make things difficult. Yesterday was just too easy. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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