whiskychimp Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 8 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said: I don't doubt it. That's I why I support these changes as one part of a suite of tools to help parents. You really are thick as f**k. The easy read executive summary I posted there clearly isn't the entirety of the body of work. You will have noticed my cut and paste has citations in it which the casual reader would assume would link to the primary studies on the efficacy of legislation in changing attitudes. Even if you didn't grasp that the text itself states that the studies took place across numerous comparator sites so your "correlation =/= causation" statement is bollocks. I admire your confidence though in dismissing an international study of academic work by the WHO, UNICEF etc However, as you are clearly keen to get to the primary sources you can find them starting on p33 here including the Swedish case study referenced some pages ago. Let me know how you get on http://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/notes/2016/new-strategies-violence-children/en/ He does seem thick but to be fair to him I gloss over your drab legal posts as well 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jmothecat2 Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 Using sleep deprivation and stress as a justification for doing something you think is wrong? Stress and tiredness make people want to do all sorts of things they stop themselves from doing because they know it's wrong. It might explain why people do things but it doesn't justify them. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whiskychimp Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 1 minute ago, Jmothecat2 said: Using sleep deprivation and stress as a justification for doing something you think is wrong? Stress and tiredness make people want to do all sorts of things they stop themselves from doing because they know it's wrong. It might explain why people do things but it doesn't justify them. I don't think it's justifiable either but I don't see any posts justifying it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 6 minutes ago, whiskychimp said: He does seem thick but to be fair to him I gloss over your drab legal posts as well We're you not demanding precise legal definitions of assault from PMS the other night? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 9 minutes ago, The Chlamydia Kid said: You think it’s damaging for a child to hear men bawling and shouting at the football? God almighty what a Wee sensitive soul you must be. I think children seeing their parents engage in violence or threaten violence to other adults is detrimental to their perceptions of violence. I don't see that in any way controversial. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whiskychimp Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 5 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said: We're you not demanding precise legal definitions of assault from PMS the other night? Don't remember doing that. Plus, even if I did, his delivery isn't anywhere near as drab 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chlamydia Kid Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 Anti- smacking brigade: Should you be able to place your child in a state of fear or alarm by shouting at them? Does fear inducing behaviour not have a “detrimental impact” upon development? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 Moar delicious posts, plz. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/a-dad-said-he-banished-his-3-year-old-as-punishment-police-may-have-just-found-her-body/ar-AAtVlBt?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=HPCOMMDHP15 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Skidmarks Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 The CK was regularly beaten for not reading all of his Daily Mail. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 2 hours ago, Jacksgranda said: http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/a-dad-said-he-banished-his-3-year-old-as-punishment-police-may-have-just-found-her-body/ar-AAtVlBt?li=BBoPWjQ&ocid=HPCOMMDHP15 Who puts their naughty step up an alley. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banana Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) On 10/22/2017 at 12:58, invergowrie arab said: The financial penalties and criminal charges you are talking about are penalties for non payment of fines issued by a legal authority, same as if you don't pay your parking ticket, fly tipping fine etc They are not specifically linked to the school absence issue. When parents enrol a child in school (they don't have to) they are then legally responsible and obliged to ensure the child attends school. It's not a state imposition it's a contract. The supreme court case ended up in the supreme court as the family took it there. FWIW I think it's entirely sensible that local authorities have the the power to refer non payment of fines to a criminal court in general but, as is the case in Scotland, Wales and N.Ireland, don't think it is suitable in this circumstance. If it helps you sleep better at night since June 2016 I have taken my niece out of school for trips away on three occasions for a cumulative total of 7 days and not a word has been said. These are all weasely rewordings and sneaky attempted re-contextualising - the state has in position legal ramifications for parents taking full guardianship for a child when the parents decide its necessary. If there's no penalty (there is), none of this should be in place in the first place. If I decide I want to take my kids out for the afternoon, or campervanning around Europe for 6 months, this should have f**k all to do with the state or or whatever relevant governing bodies. No prior notice necessary, no headmaster permission necessary, no questions asked. I do realise that having grown up in a situation where the state gets (is expected to get) it's paws into almost everything, it's a big shift in mindset to realise that this is not the only way and is actually pretty creepily fucked up. Edited October 23, 2017 by banana 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banana Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 On 10/22/2017 at 14:01, The Chlamydia Kid said: It also tells us absolute nothing about the impact of smacking on kids and I’ve not seen anyone present any specific examples of the detrimental impact thus far. Read up on domestic violence (i.e. physical violence in the home) being generational. That is, hit kids tend to hit their kids/partners, who also tend to hit their kids/partners, and so on. I realise violence is on a continuum from light tapping of a kid's hand once in a blue moon to regular beatings. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 So adults actually smack there kids ?They need locked up, for the safety of there children Serious post or piss take? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomp my root Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 16 minutes ago, banana said: Read up on domestic violence (i.e. physical violence in the home) being generational. That is, hit kids tend to hit their kids/partners, who also tend to hit their kids/partners, and so on. I realise violence is on a continuum from light tapping of a kid's hand once in a blue moon to regular beatings. Phew, my folks only hit me from time to time and not each other, I'd hate to wake up with a bread knife in my chest for giving the missus a 'love tap' after rolling in pished. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 Read up on domestic violence (i.e. physical violence in the home) being generational. That is, hit kids tend to hit their kids/partners, who also tend to hit their kids/partners, and so on. There's absolutely no way you could accurately measure that, as they'll only actually be looking at people who have committed a domestic violence crime. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banana Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 3 minutes ago, 1320Lichtie said: There's absolutely no way you could accurately measure that, as they'll only actually be looking at people who have committed a domestic violence crime. No measuring is perfect, but it's been studied plenty in various ways, and there are meta-studies on top. It's been 3 or 4 years since I read the papers, watched the presentations, so do your own digging - generational violence. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy85 Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 Violence breeds violence. Hardly a shocking revelation tbh. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, banana said: Read up on domestic violence (i.e. physical violence in the home) being generational. That is, hit kids tend to hit their kids/partners, who also tend to hit their kids/partners, and so on. I realise violence is on a continuum from light tapping of a kid's hand once in a blue moon to regular beatings. Are we now talking about battering kids or are we still discussing a wean getting a skelped arse? Edited October 23, 2017 by ayrmad 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chomp my root Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 4 minutes ago, ayrmad said: Are we now talking about battering kids or are we still discussing a wean getting a skelped arse? You know how this works, its all about the outrage, toss domestic violence in and we get 'house' (seems fair, others have called house). Gotta love the angry rhetoric to reinvigorate the 'debate'...... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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