strichener Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 (edited) 16 minutes ago, shootingboots said: It's not that bad. The reason for that is that there isn't really a rush hour anymore. More like a really busy three hours with people consciously finishing at different times to try and avoid the traffic. However, this doesn't really compare to the emptying of a stadium after a match where there really isn't the ability to stagger the exit times. As an example, I used to drop my daughter off for an hour appointment at the top of Union Street at 4pm. I couldn't get out to Westhill and back in that hour when I tried to. Edited December 12, 2017 by strichener 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingboots Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, strichener said: The reason for that is that there isn't really a rush hour anymore. More like a really busy three hours with people consciously finishing at different times to try and avoid the traffic. However, this doesn't really compare to the emptying of a stadium after a match where there really isn't the ability to stagger the exit times. As an example, I used to drop my daughter off for an hour appointment at the top of Union Street at 4pm. I couldn't get out to Westhill and back in that hour when I tried to. Wherever the stadium is there'll be heavy traffic after the game. I don't know what people expect? It's not exactly easy congestion free leaving Pittodrie. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdTheDuck Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, shootingboots said: Wherever the stadium is there'll be heavy traffic after the game. I don't know what people expect? It's not exactly easy congestion free leaving Pittodrie. Quite so. My point is that with Pittodrie you have a choice of many, many establishments where you can go for a social interaction with your fellow football watchers (including your designated driver of course) and enjoy a glass of sherry or two while the traffic subsides. This is what a fair percentage of football fans do, not everyone wants to rush home immediately after the game. In the middle of nowhere this option is removed. Whether you like it or not, driving or taking one of the 100 buses, you are going to sit in traffic for an hour before you can enjoy the delights of Archibald Simpsons or The Scotia. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aberdeen Cowden Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 hours ago, fatshaft said: People in the city make up half the home gate. Everyone, literally everyone outside the city will have an easier trip to Kingsford than Pittodrie. From the city, Hazlehead, Dyce, Bucksburn, Kincorth, Culter/Cults, Mastrick, Sheddocksley, Northfield areas will all have an easier trip too. So on balance, as far as getting to games, Kingsford wins. I’d say people in the city make up more than half of the home gate. However, anyone trying to get to Kingsford will HAVE to drive or get a bus (and that’s already been shown to be ridiculous. Vehicles won’t be able to get off the AWPR before the game and on to it after games. You’d be quicker going to a game in Dundee. And it’s going to be like that every home game. Where are all the cars going to park? Aberdeenshire Cooncil have already opposed the stadium. The only folk who would be able to get there on foot safely would be a couple of hundred Dons fans from Westhill. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatshaft Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 50 minutes ago, EdTheDuck said: The fact you live in Garlogie gives me an idea why you are so in favour of the Stewart Milne Memorial Colliseum, though... Wiggy Dome ©™ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdTheDuck Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, fatshaft said: Wiggy Dome ©™ I'm not speaking to you any more..my feelings are hurt 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry94 Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 15 hours ago, Marr1 said: Except Dens has twice the potential footprint of Pittodrie. You could easily demolish the main stand and put the seats closer to the pitch and have a lot of room for a concourse etc. Dens has a footprint of 27,034m2 despite only having 11,000 seats Tannadice has 18, 587m2 The amount of usable land at Pittodrie is 26,275m2 ETA: Kingsford has 164,000m2 In the case of Dens, the footprint isn't really an issue. There's obvious potential there that could have been developed on (and still can in theory) but I think the economics of redoing Dens V new ground is what kind of kills it. Like pointed out, the south side is a bit of a b*****d with the layout. There have been numerous schemes in the background for the last couple of decades where they've looked at even using the space for flats or even some sort of commercial development but it's never went past a nice idea. There was a real prospect of getting the money to redevelop three sides of the ground when grant applications were going in to access funding for behind the goals but the cost estimate of just a normal stand there (without the facilities of a Main Stand) put the figure through the roof. Even if doing the two stands alone did work out cheaper than a new purpose built stadium, raising that money is pretty much impossible. The only real reason the Americans are involved in this is that there's tangible commercial long term benefit from then. The stadium alone is pretty worthless in economic benefit and the only real thing it brings is the ability to win approval for a wider plan. The crematorium, hotel, housing and a bit of rent long term is where the viability lies. If the project doesn't achieve any of those and gets knocked back, I suspect Dundee may well be looking for new owners in the near future. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aberdeen Cowden Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 1 hour ago, shootingboots said: Wherever the stadium is there'll be heavy traffic after the game. I don't know what people expect? It's not exactly easy congestion free leaving Pittodrie. Yes most stadiums are like that too. The problem at Kingsford would be that there is one road passing the stadium so you either go West into the countryside or east along theA944. The slip roads on to the AWPR are narrow and anyone travelling North will also have a pedestrian crossing to deal with effectively blocking one lane of the A994 back to the stadium exit where there will also be lights! When you leave Pittodrie you can go in a multitude of different directions. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 As well as the circa 100 buses shuttling the home support you'll have away fan buses too. For some clubs this will be only be a couple, but for bigger clubs and bigger games you could be looking at a lot more. All that will add to the traffic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionel hutz Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 I think the best idea would be a rail line connecting Aberdeen with Westhill and possibly something further Westwards, could act as a key commuter line as well as relief for match day traffic. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shootingboots Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, Marr1 said: I think the best idea would be a rail line connecting Aberdeen with Westhill and possibly something further Westwards, could act as a key commuter line as well as relief for match day traffic. Would be absolutely perfect. The costs would be astronomical though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RiG Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 A spur coming off the Aberdeen - Inverness line taking in Kingswells and Westhill would be smashing. Complete pie in the sky obviously... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionel hutz Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 8 minutes ago, shootingboots said: Would be absolutely perfect. The costs would be astronomical though. Unfortunately this is the reality. I still find it mental that a city of 200,000 people is served by one rail station. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunty Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 hours ago, shootingboots said: Wherever the stadium is there'll be heavy traffic after the game. I don't know what people expect? It's not exactly easy congestion free leaving Pittodrie. Exactly. It's not about how busy it is five minutes after full-time, it's how long it takes to disperse that traffic, and the dual carriageway will be running back to normal far quicker than the roads around Pittodrie are after a game. 2 hours ago, EdTheDuck said: Quite so. My point is that with Pittodrie you have a choice of many, many establishments where you can go for a social interaction with your fellow football watchers (including your designated driver of course) and enjoy a glass of sherry or two while the traffic subsides. This is what a fair percentage of football fans do, not everyone wants to rush home immediately after the game. In the middle of nowhere this option is removed. Whether you like it or not, driving or taking one of the 100 buses, you are going to sit in traffic for an hour before you can enjoy the delights of Archibald Simpsons or The Scotia. The supporters bar will be there, the village hotel is a short walk, if Prime get their way and build a retail park there'll be loads of places there to stop. And that's before you mention the bars in Westhill and Kingswells. And, you never know, they may have re-introduced selling alcohol at the game by then, which would solve a lot of pre and post match drinking problems. 2 hours ago, Aberdeen Cowden said: However, anyone trying to get to Kingsford will HAVE to drive or get a bus (and that’s already been shown to be ridiculous. Vehicles won’t be able to get off the AWPR before the game and on to it after games. You’d be quicker going to a game in Dundee. You're acting like the whole of Aberdeen and the north-east can walk to Pittodrie. Most people drive or get a bus there too. Important to note that Transport Scotland, Roads Development Management and Police Scotland have all looked at the Kingsford plans and believe traffic will be fine. 1 hour ago, DA Baracus said: As well as the circa 100 buses shuttling the home support you'll have away fan buses too. For some clubs this will be only be a couple, but for bigger clubs and bigger games you could be looking at a lot more. All that will add to the traffic. At Ibrox the other week, the police stopped all the traffic and allowed the entire away support (buses and cars) to drive past - even on the right hand side of the road - so they were all on the motorway within minutes. Likewise, at Pittodrie traffic gets stopped to allow away buses (Old Firm ones at least) to leave. At Kingsford, the police are likely to block the road and allow the shuttle buses and supporters buses to all exit the stadium car park, get on to the AWPR, and be away before all the cars. 16 minutes ago, Marr1 said: Unfortunately this is the reality. I still find it mental that a city of 200,000 people is served by one rail station. Technically two - Dyce has a train station. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionel hutz Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 17 minutes ago, Dunty said: Technically two - Dyce has a train station. I wasn't counting Dyce otherwise I would have said 220,000. But the point still stands, Aberdeen probably needs either a Tram, Underground, Light Rail or expanded Commuter Rail network 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 34 minutes ago, Marr1 said: I wasn't counting Dyce otherwise I would have said 220,000. But the point still stands, Aberdeen probably needs either a Tram, Underground, Light Rail or expanded Commuter Rail network If we move Aberdeen down between Edinburgh and Glasgow we may have a chance. Central government expenditure doesn't reach this far - witness all the A90 flyovers that were build a few years ago that never made it to Aberdeenshire's side!!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatshaft Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 2 hours ago, Aberdeen Cowden said: Yes most stadiums are like that too. The problem at Kingsford would be that there is one road passing the stadium so you either go West into the countryside or east along theA944. The slip roads on to the AWPR are narrow and anyone travelling North will also have a pedestrian crossing to deal with effectively blocking one lane of the A994 back to the stadium exit where there will also be lights! When you leave Pittodrie you can go in a multitude of different directions. Hope my professional drawings helps here? Pittodrie loses half a compass, and most have to get across or along King Street to leave (let's accept that arriving is always OK due to staggering of travel) Kingsford has 5 immediate ways out, all flowing initially from dual carriageways, heading to the city, deeside, donside, south AWPR & north AWPR which connects with A96 and the north A90. Kingsford wins hands down (except for our fans that swim to the game). 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatshaft Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 5 minutes ago, strichener said: If we move Aberdeen down between Edinburgh and Glasgow we may have a chance. Central government expenditure doesn't reach this far - witness all the A90 flyovers that were build a few years ago that never made it to Aberdeenshire's side!!! AWPR, Harbour extension, City Deal, A90 dualling north, A96 dualling etc.....nae expenditure Let's keep it to the fitba eh? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lionel hutz Posted December 12, 2017 Author Share Posted December 12, 2017 3 minutes ago, fatshaft said: AWPR, Harbour extension, City Deal, A90 dualling north, A96 dualling etc.....nae expenditure Let's keep it to the fitba eh? When are these happening? Also, why does the Airport not have a station, it's literally half a mile from Dyce? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fatshaft Posted December 12, 2017 Share Posted December 12, 2017 Just now, Marr1 said: When are these happening? Also, why does the Airport not have a station, it's literally half a mile from Dyce? Fitba, fitba, fitba, fitba.......off topic is that way>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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