The Ultimate Super Ayr Thread

[diegomarahenry]

1 minute ago, AnonGuy7991 said:

This 100%. Mathies moneyball vision of plucking gems from nowhere to fill voids isn’t sustainable long term.
 

There’s definitely room for the odd off the cuff signing ala Dipo where it’s successful- but in the Scottish championship, experience trumps almost everything. It’s a tough league, and proven players in this league command more money than lucky dips from elsewhere. It seems the club is going to continue down the moneyball route for the foreseeable 

There is a merry-go-round of players in the Championship/League 1 and maybe 4 Premier teams, Using Aaron Muirhead as an example, freed by Falkirk, goes to Ayr, leaves Ayr on a free and could have signed for 6 of those clubs. They know their worth and know what they can get at clubs. Muirhead could be in the top end of the middle third of earners in the championship. 

If we get someone from the London leagues, there isn't the same network that the players have so negotiations could be easier, the promise of sell on that could see them return down south at a slightly higher level after a year of full time training and matches. It is probably less expensive and easier to look at that market with the hope of unearthing a Dipo. we are about 1 in 10 so far. 

[diegomarahenry]

6 minutes ago, Nelson said:

I suppose it’s trying to pick through the bones of why Rose was so ineffective on Saturday.  Was it because Smith and Musonda were so hopeless in the middle of the park?  Did that stop Amartey and McGeady stretching Dundee Utd or having any real influence at all in the attacking third?  Was it because McKenzie was dreadful at holding the ball up or linking the play with anyone?  All that being said, could Rose have done more to affect the play?

I noticed that he was standing static for a lot of the high balls, where Dipo would wrestle the defenders and get them out the way. High balls maybe aren't his game though, or battles. 

[diegomarahenry]

16 minutes ago, eez-eh said:

You literally were talking about individual players when you mentioned Ashford by name.

I’m not thrilled about things either but I also don’t twist every single wee thing that happens into meaning that the club is absolutely fucked.

Carry on if you want to double down though.

How was I to make the point without mentioning the players name? 

Third time I have explained it and you are still with the - Aye, I know what you really meant. 

[Trogdor]

20 minutes ago, No_Problemo said:

The only reason I am going to the Falkirk game is for the Ahui show so unfortunately Watret can’t start - give him thirty minutes… 

I genuinely forgot he even existed.

[Rb123]

17 minutes ago, AnonGuy7991 said:

This 100%. Mathies moneyball vision of plucking gems from nowhere to fill voids isn’t sustainable long term.
 

There’s definitely room for the odd off the cuff signing ala Dipo where it’s successful- but in the Scottish championship, experience trumps almost everything. It’s a tough league, and proven players in this league command more money than lucky dips from elsewhere. It seems the club is going to continue down the moneyball route for the foreseeable 

He sees us as the Brighton & Hove Albion of Scotland 

The problem is however Brighton sign young guys from the continent who are already highly rated and they then nurture and develop them into world class players over a 2-3 year process.

We aren't buying guys which are already highly rated for one and we don't have of pool of 30 players to choose from or a "B Team" that we could farm these guys into for the first 6 months to get them up to speed before introducing them to the 1st team squad. 

[D'Jaffo]

1 minute ago, Trogdor said:

I genuinely forgot he even existed.

Morton fans can’t let that happen. 

[malkyshotton]

18 minutes ago, Nelson said:

I suppose it’s trying to pick through the bones of why Rose was so ineffective on Saturday.  Was it because Smith and Musonda were so hopeless in the middle of the park?  Did that stop Amartey and McGeady stretching Dundee Utd or having any real influence at all in the attacking third?  Was it because McKenzie was dreadful at holding the ball up or linking the play with anyone?  All that being said, could Rose have done more to affect the play?

It was all of the above, perfect storm of shiteness.

[AyrExile]

30 minutes ago, Nelson said:

We’ve signed too many unproven players.  That’s the bottom line for me.  Taking one or two risks when you have a reasonably settled core of players is one thing, but we’ve really gone too far.  But we’ve certainly made our bed - maybe it’ll all work out, or maybe it’s going to blow up in our face.  It’s pretty much a waiting game now.

We have signed enough unproven players over the last while and been through the cycle to know how it pans out 

[GaryMc93]

29 minutes ago, AnonGuy7991 said:

It’s a tough league, and proven players in this league command more money than lucky dips from elsewhere. It seems the club is going to continue down the moneyball route for the foreseeable 

Proven players such as the ones Kerr signed in 2020 didn't exactly bring much success. People need to accept that every signing carries a risk of failure no matter whether they're signed from Scotland, England or elsewhere. Also I'm not convinced people actually understand the moneyball concept they refer to.

[Nelson]

3 minutes ago, GaryMc93 said:

Proven players such as the ones Kerr signed in 2020 didn't exactly bring much success. People need to accept that every signing carries a risk of failure no matter whether they're signed from Scotland, England or elsewhere. Also I'm not convinced people actually understand the moneyball concept they refer to.

They kept us in the division….

[Rb123]

See it's another brilliant night in Europe for the Scottish clubs...

[No_Problemo]

21 minutes ago, Trogdor said:

I genuinely forgot he even existed.

It’ll be interesting to see both him and Watret playing, if Watret is better hopefully we can just send Ahui back. 

9 minutes ago, GaryMc93 said:

Proven players such as the ones Kerr signed in 2020 didn't exactly bring much success. People need to accept that every signing carries a risk of failure no matter whether they're signed from Scotland, England or elsewhere. Also I'm not convinced people actually understand the moneyball concept they refer to.

I’m not sure that works as a comparison though, as that was largely a managerial issue. Bruce Anderson left us and instantly was excellent a league above. 

Players such as Syla are quite clearly bigger risks than the Scottish guys we have brought in - I’m absolutely fine with the data lead buys as long as it is complemented in the right areas. 

[eez-eh]

There’s no defending some of the duds we’ve signed but people seem to forget the amount of utter shite we’ve signed from Scotland over the years as well.

I think we got lucky a few years ago with McCall having good contacts and getting first dibs on any decent youth player McInnes was releasing and maybe that’s clouded people’s memories a bit. 

[Trogdor]

15 minutes ago, GaryMc93 said:

Also I'm not convinced people actually understand the moneyball concept they refer to.

Tbf Moneyball was all about data and analytics. Which is essentially what Glendinnings spreadsheet is doing.

At least we've not gone full blown Falkirk under Hartley and solely bought duds from down south. It can always be worse... 

[Nelson]

9 minutes ago, eez-eh said:

There’s no defending some of the duds we’ve signed but people seem to forget the amount of utter shite we’ve signed from Scotland over the years as well.

I think we got lucky a few years ago with McCall having good contacts and getting first dibs on any decent youth player McInnes was releasing and maybe that’s clouded people’s memories a bit. 

The value of an experienced manager.  

[Guest]

28 minutes ago, Nelson said:

They kept us in the division….

Yes and last years crop got us 2nd in the league.....

[Guest]

26 minutes ago, Rb123 said:

See it's another brilliant night in Europe for the Scottish clubs...

Out of our depth in terms of budget, it's to be expected.

[GaryMc93]

32 minutes ago, No_Problemo said:

I’m not sure that works as a comparison though, as that was largely a managerial issue. Bruce Anderson left us and instantly was excellent a league above. 

Players such as Syla are quite clearly bigger risks than the Scottish guys we have brought in - I’m absolutely fine with the data lead buys as long as it is complemented in the right areas. 

The way some people post on here you would think our current problems are largely a managerial issue, (or the players, Mathie, Glendinning, Smith and so on).

26 minutes ago, Trogdor said:

Tbf Moneyball was all about data and analytics. Which is essentially what Glendinnings spreadsheet is doing.

Is it though, I've never seen it? From the only interview he's given that I've read since he joined it was implied he watches plenty of games in person and produces detailed player reports highlighting strengths and weaknesses. Not sure why everyone thinks signings are simply data driven because they haven't heard of the player themselves.

[No_Problemo]

Just now, GaryMc93 said:

The way some people post on here you would think our current problems are largely a managerial issue, (or the players, Mathie, Glendinning, Smith and so on).

Is it though, I've never seen it? From the only interview he's given that I've read since he joined it was implied he watches plenty of games in person and produces detailed player reports highlighting strengths and weaknesses. Not sure why everyone thinks signings are simply data driven because they haven't heard of the player themselves.

Fair enough point, Bullen clearly isn’t in the Mark Kerr school of shit managers though. Every signing is obviously a risk - some are just far bigger ones. An entire central midfield made up of boys with eight senior appearances between them is a fucking huge one for example!

I think data is behind most of the signings, they will also watch players play I would imagine on top of that. Mathis had cited the Brighton model as an example I’m sure. 

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, GaryMc93 said:

The way some people post on here you would think our current problems are largely a managerial issue, (or the players, Mathie, Glendinning, Smith and so on).

Is it though, I've never seen it? From the only interview he's given that I've read since he joined it was implied he watches plenty of games in person and produces detailed player reports highlighting strengths and weaknesses. Not sure why everyone thinks signings are simply data driven because they haven't heard of the player themselves.

Yes, it's amazing how many seem to think that if we sign some known Scottish Championship journeymen that we will somehow be guaranteed success and will play some great entertaining stuff into the bargain.