Kuro Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Just now, welshbairn said: I'm happy that the Catalonians didn't inadvertently put fascists into power by bringing down the Socialist Government. And accepting of the fact you were full of shit about this issue 24 hours ago. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Kuro said: And accepting of the fact you were full of shit about this issue 24 hours ago. No, it was a risk that the Catalonians took without any benefit to themselves. WIth the Socialists making big gains it looks like the Catalonians could lose what leverage they had in Madrid for nothing. The right have done much worse than the polls predicted. Edited April 28, 2019 by welshbairn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuro Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, welshbairn said: No, it was a risk that the Catalonians took without any benefit to themselves. WIth the Socialists making big gains it looks like the Catalonians could lose what leverage they had in Madrid for nothing. The right have done much worse than the polls predicted. Or maybe they understand Spanish politics slightly better than you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tibbermoresaint Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 24 minutes ago, welshbairn said: No, it was a risk that the Catalonians took without any benefit to themselves. WIth the Socialists making big gains it looks like the Catalonians could lose what leverage they had in Madrid for nothing. The right have done much worse than the polls predicted. Independence wouldn't be a benefit? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 (edited) 23 minutes ago, Kuro said: Or maybe they understand Spanish politics slightly better than you. Doesn't look like it. Quote Analysis: Sanchez free to govern without Catalan nationalist support Stephen Burgen With nearly 90% of votes counted, it seems certain that Pedro Sánchez’s socialist party will be able to govern without the support of the Catalan nationalists that brought down his previous administration, leaving the pro-independence movement with a voice in parliament but little leverage. Sánchez should be able to reply on support from the Basque parties and independents to get majority he needs in parliament. In Catalonia itself, the story has been the rise of the Republican Left (ERC) led by Oriol Junqueras, currently on trial for his role in the illegal unilateral declaration of independence in 2017, at the expense of Together for Catalonia, the party of former president Carles Puigdemont. ERC even overtook Puigdemont in Girona, his heartland in the north of the region. While Junqueras has taken a conciliatory line with Madrid of late, Puigdemont has continued to seek confrontation and it seems that voters have wearied of this approach. As well as supporting ERC, there has been a significant swing towards the socialists, especially in the Barcelona region, suggesting that voters want to focus on social issues rather than questions of sovereignty. Junqueras said he was prepared to support a Sánchez government if it agreed in principle to a referendum on independence, something the socialist leader said he would never do. As things stand, he won’t need Junqueras and the Catalan issue looks set to lose its place at the centre of the national debate. https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2019/apr/28/spain-election-turnout-increases-as-voters-head-to-polls-for-third-time-in-four-years-live-updates Edited April 28, 2019 by welshbairn 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, Tibbermoresaint said: Independence wouldn't be a benefit? If anything they're further away from independence than they were before forcing the election. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tibbermoresaint Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 3 minutes ago, welshbairn said: If anything they're further away from independence than they were before forcing the election. Which isn't an answer to my question. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 1 minute ago, Tibbermoresaint said: Which isn't an answer to my question. Yes it is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 I was wondering what had happened to banana. https://twitter.com/catalannews/status/1122601721996431360 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tibbermoresaint Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 7 minutes ago, welshbairn said: Yes it is. Nope. Do you genuinely not believe the Catalans would benefit from independence? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuro Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 16 minutes ago, welshbairn said: Doesn't look like it. https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2019/apr/28/spain-election-turnout-increases-as-voters-head-to-polls-for-third-time-in-four-years-live-updates Yet they haven't empowered fascists at all have they? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Just now, Tibbermoresaint said: Nope. Do you genuinely not believe the Catalans would benefit from independence? As you said for yourself yesterday, you're not Spanish or Catalonian, so don't have a position. Neither do I. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 4 minutes ago, Kuro said: Yet they haven't empowered fascists at all have they? No, they've disempowered themselves, and put a fascist party in Parliament for the first time since Franco. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kuro Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 Just now, welshbairn said: No, they've disempowered themselves, and put a fascist party in Parliament for the first time since Franco. Did they vote the fascist party into parliament? They only need power in Catalonia to achieve their ends. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tibbermoresaint Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 8 minutes ago, welshbairn said: As you said for yourself yesterday, you're not Spanish or Catalonian, so don't have a position. Neither do I. Do you believe Scotland would benefit from independence? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tibbermoresaint Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 2 hours ago, welshbairn said: Thankfully their potential right wing coalition parties aren't doing too well, so looks like a Socialist/Catalan coalition again if they can agree. So the Catalans are going to be in government.. 1 hour ago, welshbairn said: it looks like the Catalonians could lose what leverage they had in Madrid for nothing. ... or maybe they aren't. 51 minutes ago, welshbairn said: Doesn't look like it. I'd say it does. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted April 28, 2019 Share Posted April 28, 2019 12 minutes ago, Tibbermoresaint said: So the Catalans are going to be in government.. ... or maybe they aren't. I'd say it does. Just reporting on the early indications as they came in. Seems they won't with 97% of the results in. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tirso Posted April 29, 2019 Share Posted April 29, 2019 14 hours ago, welshbairn said: No, they've disempowered themselves, and put a fascist party in Parliament for the first time since Franco. You are all over the place. What power did they have before like? If they use their leverage at all you decry them as Nazi enablers. Make your mind up. Not many Catalans put Vox in Parliament. I think you should look at the results. Is it Scotland or the SNP's fault if a tiny proportion of England vote for UKIP? If I could be offended I would be but your opinions are so out of step with what's going on, it's hard to know where to start. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieThomas Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 (edited) Just reading about wee Benny Shapiro getting ABSOLUTELY DESTROYED by Andrew Neil before calling the Spectator owning, Orban praising, friend of Murdoch a "leftist" and terminating the interview in a huff. Andrew Neil. Leftist. Edited May 10, 2019 by JamieThomas 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda Posted May 10, 2019 Share Posted May 10, 2019 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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