Linlithgow Rose - 2019 onwards

[FairWeatherFan]

With Linlithgow Rose being a well represented club  on the forum, has no one thought to change the title of the thread? Or create a new one?

[Auld Heid]

Stone wall penalty you should have had on the highlights. But further down comment. Big kasa could have seen red as well

Very true, however for me the penalty incident was the game changer.

Where the game would have went if given - we will never know.

[GordonS]

The formation yesterday was the same as last week, and it's baws. It was 4-1-4-1 with Docherty alone up front. When he was up top he was rarely closer than 20 yards from his nearest team-mate, and when he dropped off we were more like 4-6-0. Stowe - an-form finisher - was way out on the right of pretty basic midfield, nowhere near goal. The first half we were blunt AF.

It's such a contrast from the first two home games when the front five were well connected and interchanged positions. When Docherty dropped off someone else moved beyond him. The distances between the players were much, much less and the combinations worked well. They were a constant menace between the lines and in the channels between centre halves and full backs. How can Ferguson have changed it so badly from the shape that allowed us to score 10 goals in the previous 2 home games?

At half time he brought TC on to create a focal point, dropping Docherty onto the left, but it was very little help because TC was just as marooned as Docherty had been. Of course, TC scored because he's such a good predator and plays between the posts but he was living off scraps. We finally had a decent shape when Kyle Wilson came on and Stowe moved into a more central position. Too little, too late.

One of the galling things is that Penicuik didn't have to be great to go 3-0 up in 40 minutes. Only Tansey was a real danger and Nicky Reid played well. The rest just went about their business and that was more than enough. The position Tansey played is exactly where Stowe should have been for Rose - attacking into the channel and linking up with the rest of the front line. 

I don't know if Ferguson is over-thinking it, or the team are under-prepared or whatever, but the starting shape he chose at Sauchie and again yesterday is never, ever going to be successful.

On top of that, individual mistakes didn't help. Thom sold their second goal and Stevenson covered the wrong man at the counter-attack for the third.

You tell yourself that it's still early days and we have a decent squad, but a 9 point deficit already looks like a lot.

[Marooneye]

26 minutes ago, GordonS said:

The formation yesterday was the same as last week, and it's baws. It was 4-1-4-1 with Docherty alone up front. When he was up top he was rarely closer than 20 yards from his nearest team-mate, and when he dropped off we were more like 4-6-0. Stowe - an-form finisher - was way out on the right of pretty basic midfield, nowhere near goal. The first half we were blunt AF.

It's such a contrast from the first two home games when the front five were well connected and interchanged positions. When Docherty dropped off someone else moved beyond him. The distances between the players were much, much less and the combinations worked well. They were a constant menace between the lines and in the channels between centre halves and full backs. How can Ferguson have changed it so badly from the shape that allowed us to score 10 goals in the previous 2 home games?

At half time he brought TC on to create a focal point, dropping Docherty onto the left, but it was very little help because TC was just as marooned as Docherty had been. Of course, TC scored because he's such a good predator and plays between the posts but he was living off scraps. We finally had a decent shape when Kyle Wilson came on and Stowe moved into a more central position. Too little, too late.

One of the galling things is that Penicuik didn't have to be great to go 3-0 up in 40 minutes. Only Tansey was a real danger and Nicky Reid played well. The rest just went about their business and that was more than enough. The position Tansey played is exactly where Stowe should have been for Rose - attacking into the channel and linking up with the rest of the front line. 

I don't know if Ferguson is over-thinking it, or the team are under-prepared or whatever, but the starting shape he chose at Sauchie and again yesterday is never, ever going to be successful.

On top of that, individual mistakes didn't help. Thom sold their second goal and Stevenson covered the wrong man at the counter-attack for the third.

You tell yourself that it's still early days and we have a decent squad, but a 9 point deficit already looks like a lot.

We're a hard watch.  Didn't get to Sauchie but from what I hear and saw on highlights it was bad.

Stenny fans said his football style is dull and boring.  Having seen it in the flesh now I agree.

[GordonS]

We're a hard watch.  Didn't get to Sauchie but from what I hear and saw on highlights it was bad.
Stenny fans said his football style is dull and boring.  Having seen it in the flesh now I agree.

In the first two home games we were really exciting though, that's why it's pretty bizarre now. It doesn't make any sense. He set them up to be hard to beat instead of trying to win the game.

And obviously he didn't get that bit right either.

[yessiricanboogie]

4 hours ago, Auld Heid said:

Very true, however for me the penalty incident was the game changer.

Where the game would have went if given - we will never know.

Don't say that against dundobald they get upset by that because they hit the woodwork

[UpInTheStand]

In case you missed them, the goals and stonewall penalty incident from Saturday’s match versus Penicuik can be found here:

There’s also an exclusive post-match interview with manager Brown Ferguson at the end. 

 

[FuzzyBear]

1 up. Ogilvie.

[FuzzyBear]

1-1

[GordonS]

Where's Mark Stowe tonight?

[FuzzyBear]

2-1, Stowe

[FuzzyBear]

3-1 Ogilvie

[Burnieman]

2 hours ago, GordonS said:

Where's Mark Stowe tonight?

 

1 hour ago, FuzzyBear said:

2-1, Stowe

[GordonS]

3 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

 

He came off the bench in the second half. They never listed the team on Twitter and I couldn't hear the subs being read out.

Unless he was unfit I can't understand why he didn't start. In fact, I can't understand how the manager uses him at all. He's a terrific goal threat and left-footed but Ferguson plays him in standard right midfield. He was only in position to score his goal (deliciously hit, btw) because it was from a set-piece and it got knocked down to him on the left side of the box. 

[GordonS]

Feels like a big win tonight. TC gave us a much better shape in attack with Ruari linking up well with him. How many times have they carried this team? TC also brought Docherty, Ogilvie and Wilson into the game. But we can't base our attack around a guy who doesn't have 90 minutes in him any more.

The shape after the substitutions was weird; Ogilve and Kyle Wilson up front in what looked like a 4-4-2, with Docherty in left midfield and Stowe on the right. Those two are unquestionably the best finishers behind TC and they just seem wasted out there. There's nothing wrong with wide players on the 'wrong' sides but they need to be further forward; otherwise they struggle to carry down the line and easily get shown into midfield. Ogilvie was superb, that's the first time I've realised what he can do. He seemed to grow and grow as the game went on.

For me the highlight was our shape when out of possession. Spartans had long spells on the ball and moved it around with patience and structure, so we were tested. Their goal came from a howling goalkeeping error, McMinn spilling a low cross into Murrell's path for an equaliser, but apart from that they created few clear opportunities with Kasa, Ogilvie, Wilson and Ruari doing a good job closing them down and Thom and Brownlie holding the line.

This is a good squad, they just need set up right and they'll be fine. I feel Ferguson sets them up to be hard to beat and while you can win cups like that, you can't win leagues.

[GordonS]

Also keeps up our excellent record against LL sides. I think East Stirling are the only one to beat us, in a Challenge Cup tie 3 years ago.

[grinderbrokeyourhearts]

12 hours ago, GordonS said:

He came off the bench in the second half. They never listed the team on Twitter and I couldn't hear the subs being read out.

Unless he was unfit I can't understand why he didn't start. In fact, I can't understand how the manager uses him at all. He's a terrific goal threat and left-footed but Ferguson plays him in standard right midfield. He was only in position to score his goal (deliciously hit, btw) because it was from a set-piece and it got knocked down to him on the left side of the box. 

Gordon, he’s scored about ten goals. I’m not sure BF has it all right yet but can’t question that Stowe is exactly where he should be.

[Marooneye]

4 minutes ago, grinderbrokeyourhearts said:

Gordon, he’s scored about ten goals. I’m not sure BF has it all right yet but can’t question that Stowe is exactly where he should be.

You're right, I'm not a big fan of manager but he got it right last night.

TC gives a real focal point in the number 9 role and brings the midfield into the game.  Docherty and Stowe are better playing off him. I don't think Docherty is a number 9 but TC can do that role.

Needs to get it right in league matches though as cup wins are all well and good but need to be challenging at top of table.

[Black Dug]

Feels like a big win tonight. TC gave us a much better shape in attack with Ruari linking up well with him. How many times have they carried this team? TC also brought Docherty, Ogilvie and Wilson into the game. But we can't base our attack around a guy who doesn't have 90 minutes in him any more.
The shape after the substitutions was weird; Ogilve and Kyle Wilson up front in what looked like a 4-4-2, with Docherty in left midfield and Stowe on the right. Those two are unquestionably the best finishers behind TC and they just seem wasted out there. There's nothing wrong with wide players on the 'wrong' sides but they need to be further forward; otherwise they struggle to carry down the line and easily get shown into midfield. Ogilvie was superb, that's the first time I've realised what he can do. He seemed to grow and grow as the game went on.
For me the highlight was our shape when out of possession. Spartans had long spells on the ball and moved it around with patience and structure, so we were tested. Their goal came from a howling goalkeeping error, McMinn spilling a low cross into Murrell's path for an equaliser, but apart from that they created few clear opportunities with Kasa, Ogilvie, Wilson and Ruari doing a good job closing them down and Thom and Brownlie holding the line.
This is a good squad, they just need set up right and they'll be fine. I feel Ferguson sets them up to be hard to beat and while you can win cups like that, you can't win leagues.

Weird how we see things. I thought Arnie looked a bit lost last night with numerous times he didn't pick up a man. We looked more settled when Luke Watt came on. Hopefully Luke can stay fit and gets a run of games as he linked well with Ruari. Agree with you about TC. He's not going to win any sprints but if you get the ball to him it sticks and he is able to do something with it to bring others in to play.
Some good play from Ogilvie last night as well. After a strong pre-season I thought he'd gone off the boil a bit so great to see him taking it past boys.
Overall a good performance against 'higher' level opposition.

[GordonS]

1 hour ago, grinderbrokeyourhearts said:

Gordon, he’s scored about ten goals. I’m not sure BF has it all right yet but can’t question that Stowe is exactly where he should be.

Yup. He was playing on the right of a front three in the home games against Inverkeithing and HoB. His goal last night came while out of position for a set piece.

He scores goals in one position but in the past three games he's been played in another.

1 hour ago, Marooneye said:

You're right, I'm not a big fan of manager but he got it right last night.

TC gives a real focal point in the number 9 role and brings the midfield into the game.  Docherty and Stowe are better playing off him. I don't think Docherty is a number 9 but TC can do that role.

Needs to get it right in league matches though as cup wins are all well and good but need to be challenging at top of table.

Can TC play more than an hour though? Time isn't on his side.

I'm happy with Docherty and Stowe playing off someone, or Docherty playing false nine with Stowe and Ogilvie/Wilson playing around him, but they can't do that from left and right midfield, they've got to get closer to each other than they were in the past two league games. Last night was a definite improvement in that regard and in the first half it came from the quality of TC and Rooster's link-up play.

59 minutes ago, Black Dug said:

Weird how we see things. I thought Arnie looked a bit lost last night with numerous times he didn't pick up a man. We looked more settled when Luke Watt came on. Hopefully Luke can stay fit and gets a run of games as he linked well with Ruari. Agree with you about TC. He's not going to win any sprints but if you get the ball to him it sticks and he is able to do something with it to bring others in to play.
Some good play from Ogilvie last night as well. After a strong pre-season I thought he'd gone off the boil a bit so great to see him taking it past boys.
Overall a good performance against 'higher' level opposition.

I thought Arnie shut the opposition down well, he didn't make a lot of challenges but shuffled around preventing them from going forward. But as you say, we all see the game our own way.

I think we looked more settled when Watt came on because we had two up front and were more 'sticky', rather than because of what he brought, but I agree he was good. I've never seen him offer as much defensively before.

The level of opposition is why it feels like a big win. IMO Spartans were better in the middle of the park and were capable of controlling the match for long stretches, as you'd expect from a good LL side. But we were more effective at both ends.