Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[HibsFan]

6 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

Reading and Leeds festivals going ahead.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/news.sky.com/story/amp/reading-and-leeds-festivals-will-go-ahead-in-august-organisers-confirm-12227715

There's no real detail there beyond them sending out a tweet.

Hopefully they can go ahead, but it seems like they're just getting onboard the "haha I will be this drunk on the 21st of June" meme hype train.

[Elixir]

19 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

2 hours ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

I want a categorical assurance that neither of the Johnsons in "Johnson & Johnson" is related to the PM before I trust this one
 

85.4% efficacy as well so it looks the ideal candidate if we ever need an annual programme of vaccinations (like the the flu).

Any two dose vaccine will only need a single booster in future.

[Elixir]

[WhiteRoseKillie]

Not if their admission is demonstrably in breach of the Equalities Act, which a vaccine passport almost certainly will fall under until the entire population is offered it. 

All right, you brilliant wee nit picker.

In refusing admission to their premises, a business is not required to give a reason. It's the clever tw@ts who declare why they're making a stand who end up in court - where they're not guaranteed to lose.
There will obviously be a case to be made for discrimination of a potential customer has not had the opportunity of a vaccine, but the idea it's going to fall under the EA is laughable - a protected characteristic which will last three or four months? Behave.

[vikingTON]

11 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

All right, you brilliant wee nit picker.

In refusing admission to their premises, a business is not required to give a reason. It's the clever tw@ts who declare why they're making a stand who end up in court - where they're not guaranteed to lose.
There will obviously be a case to be made for discrimination of a potential customer has not had the opportunity of a vaccine, but the idea it's going to fall under the EA is laughable - a protected characteristic which will last three or four months? Behave.

Remarkable that you consider the cornerstone of progress that stopped 'no blacks or Irish' dog-whistle racism business policies to be the domain of 'clever twats' having the temerity to challenge your divine right to refuse service. No doubt whatsoever about the type of braying landlord you were then. 

So long as there are sectors of the population who fall under the protected characteristics of the EA who cannot freely obtain a vaccine then a legal challenge will stand every chance of success. The idea that a court will say 'ach it's only for four months, you can let it slide' is nonsense. It's either a breach or it isn't. 

Edited February 24, 2021 by vikingTON

[Left Back]

8 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

All right, you brilliant wee nit picker.

In refusing admission to their premises, a business is not required to give a reason. It's the clever tw@ts who declare why they're making a stand who end up in court - where they're not guaranteed to lose.
There will obviously be a case to be made for discrimination of a potential customer has not had the opportunity of a vaccine, but the idea it's going to fall under the EA is laughable - a protected characteristic which will last three or four months? Behave.

Won’t just last 3 or 4 months to some people though will it?

[topcat(The most tip top)]

26 minutes ago, G51 said:

Even worse, he's the owner of the New York Jets.

Well he's due a win then

[craigkillie]

All right, you brilliant wee nit picker.

In refusing admission to their premises, a business is not required to give a reason. It's the clever tw@ts who declare why they're making a stand who end up in court - where they're not guaranteed to lose.
There will obviously be a case to be made for discrimination of a potential customer has not had the opportunity of a vaccine, but the idea it's going to fall under the EA is laughable - a protected characteristic which will last three or four months? Behave.

Requiring people to be vaccinated before entering *is* giving a reason though. A conversation like this is not going to fly:

"Have you been vaccinated?"

"No"

"OK, you're not getting in, for no particular reason."

[WhiteRoseKillie]

Remarkable that you consider the cornerstone of progress that stopped 'no blacks or Irish' dog-whistle racism business policies to be the domain of 'clever twats' having the temerity to challenge your divine right to refuse service. No doubt whatsoever about the type of braying landlord you were then. 
So long as there are sectors of the population who fall under the protected characteristics of the EA who cannot freely obtain a vaccine then a legal challenge will stand every chance of success. The idea that a court will say 'ach it's only for four months, you can let it slide' is nonsense. It's either a breach or it isn't. 

So, we've moved from "no vaccination passport no entry is a breach of the EA" to

"If someone hasn't been offered a vaccine because of a protected characteristic under the EA"

It's a real shame when you have to double down on your bollox, isn't it?

To take a real world* example:
If a licensee refuses to serve someone - no issue. If that licensee refuses to serve someone because they are drunk, that person could, if they so wished, go through litigation and, given the grounds for refusal, would be asking what proof the licensee had that they were drunk, and/or what qualifications to make that judgment.

*Up the stairs, out of the basement, turn. right and the door is in front of you. Mind your eyes - daylight is a bugger.I'll

[D.A.F.C]

England has went fully mental, the one show presenter telling folk to book holidays and everything is fine.

Maybe even faster than June apparently. 

Spend your money, trust the government. Buy tickets to visit a country that might not let you in. We don't even know what will happen here. 

Positivity is good but this is insane.

[HibsFan]

Just now, D.A.F.C said:

England has went fully mental, the one show presenter telling folk to book holidays and everything is fine.

Maybe even faster than June apparently. 

Spend your money, trust the government. Buy tickets to visit a country that might not let you in. We don't even know what will happen here. 

Positivity is good but this is insane.

Aye I'm living down in London at the minute and it's incredible seeing the absolutely unshakable people seem to have confidence in that specific date. Certain events already being ticketed for that week beginning 21st June. All for a bit of wide-eyed optimism but think they could be in for a rude awakening.

Remember when Christmas was saved? Me neither. 

[WhiteRoseKillie]

Won’t just last 3 or 4 months to some people though will it?

Why, how long will it take to get the population vaccinated, in your opinion? Businesses aren't going to be open for a couple of months, another for takes us to the end of August.

Unless, of course, you're talking about those who refuse the vaccine. They'll be making a choice, and will have to live with the choice they make.

[vikingTON]

5 minutes ago, WhiteRoseKillie said:

So, we've moved from "no vaccination passport no entry is a breach of the EA" to

"If someone hasn't been offered a vaccine because of a protected characteristic under the EA"

It's a real shame when you have to double down on your bollox, isn't it?

To take a real world* example:
If a licensee refuses to serve someone - no issue. If that licensee refuses to serve someone because they are drunk, that person could, if they so wished, go through litigation and, given the grounds for refusal, would be asking what proof the licensee had that they were drunk, and/or what qualifications to make that judgment.

*Up the stairs, out of the basement, turn. right and the door is in front of you. Mind your eyes - daylight is a bugger.I'll

If a licensee refuses to serve someone and the victim has reasonable grounds to suspect it's because of his race, religion, nationality, disability (visible or hidden) or any other protected characteristic then the licensee will get hauled over the coals by the EA for being a clueless, braying dinosaur (you).

There is no credible real world scenario by which a business can both magically work out whether an individual is vaccinated to ensure full compliance on its premises and then argue in a court of law  that the reason for denying service to others is not in any way linked to that fact. Indeed, simply trying to collect that data could be considered a breach of the Act itself. It's not the 1960s champ, sit down. 

Edited February 24, 2021 by vikingTON

[D.A.F.C]

Just now, HibsFan said:

Aye I'm living down in London at the minute and it's incredible seeing the absolutely unshakable people seem to have confidence in that specific date. Certain events already being ticketed for that week beginning 21st June. All for a bit of wide-eyed optimism but think they could be in for a rude awakening.

Remember when Christmas was saved? Me neither. 

They just want people to spend money regardless of what will happen. Its illegal to travel abroad so how can they be selling holidays?

Talk of festival tickets selling as well.

I'm sure coronavirus will book a holiday as well.

[WhiteRoseKillie]

Requiring people to be vaccinated before entering *is* giving a reason though. A conversation like this is not going to fly:

"Have you been vaccinated?"

"No"

"OK, you're not getting in, for no particular reason."

Of course it is, which is why it ain't going to happen.
My very point was that refusal of admission does not require a reason. Once a reason is given, the onus is on the business to justify the refusal.

[Theroadlesstravelled]

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-56185142

Reading and Leeds festival organisers are very confident that the event will go ahead in June.

 

Very confident. 

[Left Back]

Just now, WhiteRoseKillie said:

Why, how long will it take to get the population vaccinated, in your opinion? Businesses aren't going to be open for a couple of months, another for takes us to the end of August.

Unless, of course, you're talking about those who refuse the vaccine. They'll be making a choice, and will have to live with the choice they make.

If they choose not to accept a vaccine because of a religion or belief that is a protected characteristic and absolutely protected under the EA.

A belief doesn’t have to be religious, it can be philosophical and I’m sure lawyers would argue that ant-vax falls under that category.

People with the attitude of “f**k them, they chose not get vaccinated so exclude them from society” have no understanding of the wide ranging definition of equality.

[vikingTON]

3 minutes ago, Theroadlesstravelled said:

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-56185142

Reading and Leeds festival organisers are very confident that the event will go ahead in June.

 

Very confident. 

They're probably confident because the festival takes place at the end of August and not in June. 

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

10 minutes ago, D.A.F.C said:

England has went fully mental, the one show presenter telling folk to book holidays and everything is fine.

Maybe even faster than June apparently. 

Spend your money, trust the government. Buy tickets to visit a country that might not let you in. We don't even know what will happen here. 

Positivity is good but this is insane.

Yeh inclined to agree, im certainly not confident of the june date etc, i think it will probably get knocked back for some unforeseen reason before then, but the positivity is nice albeit slightly misguided. The best approach for me would have been a combination of more positive than NS and a bit more grounded than BJ. 

[D.A.F.C]

4 minutes ago, Theroadlesstravelled said:

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-56185142

Reading and Leeds festival organisers are very confident that the event will go ahead in June.

 

Very confident. 

Gies yer money fuckwits