The SPFL recommendation?

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

And playing teams 30-42 instead of those positioned at 23-32 is relegation anyway you look at it.

[Clyde01]

Promote 2 relegate none is still the best way out of this. It doesn’t really disadvantage anyone apart from 3rd and 4th placed sides (who only had a 25% at best chance of promotion anyway). However if we accept the playoffs are cancelled regardless that takes away that argument. Promotion for second place is on sporting merit.

 

The only other argument against this model is the dilution of money in the premier league between 14 instead of 12 clubs but if this was for a single season only surely it’s not going to torpedo an otherwise reasonable plan. Season 20/21 can relegate 3 and promote 1 to reset. At least that way all clubs will be fully aware of what’s at stake before a ball is kicked, unlike the current restructure ideas being banded about.

 

[RandomGuy.]

26 minutes ago, haufdaft said:

I can't see how voiding the season will result in sponsors (eg Ladbrokes) being legally able to claim all their money back.

 

If this did happen, I'll be demanding a refund of my multitude of losing bets using the same principle suggested

 

I wonder if Ladbrokes would pay out?

 

Maybe I'll also demand 100% refund from BTsport too

 

 

Until UEFA clarify on the 23rd, the top flight cannot be voided if we expect to have teams enter UEFA competition. 

Every team down here is screeching about how you can't treat the top flight differently.

[Shadwell Dog]

15 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Until UEFA clarify on the 23rd, the top flight cannot be voided if we expect to have teams enter UEFA competition. 

Every team down here is screeching about how you can't treat the top flight differently.

Let's face it though that hasn't been ruled out. If UEFA come back and say finish the league then they will have no choice surely.

[Gordon EF]

56 minutes ago, craigkillie said:

Why would you promote Kelty and not Brora? Why would you promote Edinburgh City but not Cowdenbeath, etc. All of those clubs are in play-off places right now, and those play-offs can't be played. That's the obvious difference. Why would any individual team winning the play-off be the "most likely outcome"?

Yeah, that's my point.

Why is it vitally important that automatic promotion happens from a legal / financial /fairness point of view but at the same time binning the play-offs is totally fine?

Edited April 9, 2020 by Gordon EF

[AL-FFC]

This has to be the best reaction and echoes what a lot of us are saying:

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/local-sport/f-rangers-celtic-former-airdrie-21838781

Roberts told Lanarkshire Live Sport : “It’s pathetic; League One is far too close to give Raith a title.

“Is that fair on Partick Thistle getting relegated from the Championship as well, which is potentially a club killer? It’s not.

“If you’re not going to play it I think you should restart the league with a clean slate. I don’t think it’s fair.

“The Premiership is being treated differently, how is the Premiership different? Because there is more money in the Premiership? F**k the Premiership.

“I don’t get it, but it grates on me. If they can get the Premiership games played, why can’t they get the rest of the games played?

“Is it just cause they have Rangers and Celtic in it? F*** Rangers and Celtic.

“It still means just as much to an Airdrie fan or a Falkirk fan as it does to Rangers, Celtic, Hearts, and Hibs.

“If they aren’t going to play the season out they can’t just say that’s you up. If I’m a player with Airdrie or Falkirk there is no way I’m accepting that.

“That’s what you’ve been working for from June last year until now.

“You’ve worked your b***s off to get to that position where you can go and win a league, it’s not fair.

“If I was a player, coach or chairman at one of those clubs I’d be bealing.”

He continued: “Why do Hearts have a chance to save themselves but Partick Thistle don’t? Why do Rangers and Celtic get to fight for a title but Airdrie, Falkirk and Raith don’t?

“If I was at a club I wouldn’t want them to vote for the proposal.

"Get the SPFL, SFA; whoever it is thinking of ways to make the game better rather than p*** off 95 per cent of the clubs in Scotland."

 

Edited April 9, 2020 by AL-FFC

[Zen Archer (Raconteur)]

1 hour ago, East Fife is best said:

Reading on bbc website that EFL clubs can resume training from May 16th and complete there season withing 6 weeks in June/July after 3 weeks training so surely the same can be done here

Surely there won't be 1 rule for English sport and another for Scottish sport

Player contracts will have expired by then, at least 3 SPFL teams will have NO signed players.

How do you overcome the legal minefield, forcing players to play despite having no contract?

[AL-FFC]

2 minutes ago, Zen Archer Esq. said:

Player contracts will have expired by then, at least 3 SPFL teams will have NO signed players.

How do you overcome the legal minefield, forcing players to play despite having no contract?

Rolling contract until the season is complete, the transfer window is closed so not as if they can do anything till it reopens.

[Shadwell Dog]

2 minutes ago, Zen Archer Esq. said:

Player contracts will have expired by then, at least 3 SPFL teams will have NO signed players.

How do you overcome the legal minefield, forcing players to play despite having no contract?

The whole season timescales will be changed I would think.  Player contracts would just be extended for a month or so  and the transfer window wont open till  after this season has finished.  It would mean a lot more midweek games next season. Anyway I doubt anyone will.be back training in may anyway .

[Zen Archer (Raconteur)]

2 minutes ago, AL-FFC said:

Rolling contract until the season is complete, the transfer window is closed so not as if they can do anything till it reopens.

 

1 minute ago, Shadwell Dog said:

The whole season timescales will be changed I would think.  Player contracts would just be extended for a month or so  and the transfer window wont open till  after this season has finished.  It would mean a lot more midweek games next season. Anyway I doubt anyone will.be back training in may anyway .

This is what the Bosman case fought to stop, what if the players don't want to sign?

[Shadwell Dog]

17 minutes ago, Zen Archer Esq. said:

 

This is what the Bosman case fought to stop, what if the players don't want to sign?

I would think discussions would be held with the pfa and agreement gained for all players to have short term ext added to their contracts.  They can't move till the window opens anyway and are better getting paid than sitting with no wage for a month or so.  It's important though that this is done uniformly and not different in varying countries.

[Jack Burton]

See, I've said that I don't think we can reconstruct our way out of this, but I don't agree with this. I don't think it should or will happen anyway, but Clyde are currently in the third tier and under the 14x3 proposal would be in the third tier. That's not being relegated.

We would back in the bottom tier, only one relegation away from the Lowland league and playing all the current sides in league 2. It would very much be a relegation for us.

[Jack Burton]

Null and Void the Season and reconstruct the Lower Leagues to two Divisions of 15, play each other twice, home and away, that gives you 8 less League games so the pressure of starting Season 20-21 up in time can be shifted out to late September, early October and we can also get rid of the League Cup and Challenge Cup for a year, if a National “All-Clear” is given before then then the Cups can be easily reinstated to be played to a finish in those 8 free weeks!!!

You can't null and void the season but use the current standings for reconstruction. All your doing is moving the promotion or relegation places so it affects other teams.

The clubs are all going to be strapped for cash so reducing the number of games and losing the cups won't help.

[Paco]

I would think discussions would be held with the pfa and agreement gained for all players to have short term ext added to their contracts.  They can't move till the window opens anyway and are better getting paid than sitting with no wage for a month or so.  It's important though that this is done uniformly and not different in varying countries.

Do the government just pay these players until we can play football again? What happens on furlough isn’t extended but football still can’t go ahead?

What about players who have agreed to move? Kieron Bowie has agreed to move to Fulham in June from Raith for circa £150k. Do we just wait for that too, in addition to prize money/season ticket sales? Or do we let him go and have a weakened squad for the run-in?

It won’t work. The season won’t finish.

[TxRover]

So, to summarize the facts:

-The SPFL needs the 2020-2021 season to begin in August, or as near that as possible, to protect their new TV contract.

-The “null and void will cause refunds” is pretty much pish, however, it does apparently not have enough support and some downsides. 

-Realignment would not trigger renegotiation of TV contracts, and thus would possibly spread money more thinly...this likely opposed.

-They were sitting on £8,000,000 in prize money, but have already distributed about £2,500,000 or so. The payments appear deliberately skint.

-There is no perceptible argument about why they can’t pay out bottom position payments to each team (excepting Motherwell, Rangers and Celtic, who already got more pie) for now, pending final positions.

-It’s clear the money is the bludgeon being held over the teams heads to get this proposal passed...why?

 

The reality is the only teams really getting pumped by this are Hearts and Partick. The League One winner dilemma is, to be honest, a sideshow. Everything else is pretty much decided, and this is looking at teams with equal games played, where Hearts and Partick actually have a little more argument. There is a lot of “it isn’t fair”, “how would you feel...”, “it’s not right”, etc...but the ultimate point is if we don’t decide something, then nothing happens. Which leads us to Shadwell’s favorite question, why now?

Follow the interests, and we’ll figure out why now. As for the League One title, we’re a distraction and they really don’t give a toss.

[Gordon EF]

10 minutes ago, TxRover said:

Follow the interests, and we’ll figure out why now. As for the League One title, we’re a distraction and they really don’t give a toss.

Correct. I think this has absolutely nothing to do with who's in which position. Big picture, the SPFL don't care whether Raith go up, Falkirk go up, both go up or neither go up.

it seems to me that, as an organisation, they're pinning their hopes on being able to start 2020/21 at or around the scheduled starting date. As the organisers of the game, that is by far the easiest outcome, operationally. So to me it looks like they'll do anything which puts them in a position to do that if the coronavirus situation allows it.

If that's the case, you've only got two choices, put forward a proposal to call the season and award automatic promotion / relegation as is or put forward a proposal to call the season and have no promotion or relegation or awarding of titles. To me, financially, I can't see why one would be more attractive than the other. So i reckon it's just down to which one feels "cleaner". If we call the season, award titles, promote and relegate then we can all kind of pretend this season actually just played out and get back to normal. Also, they probably bet that it's the proposal that would have the higher chance of passing.

[Zen Archer (Raconteur)]

Quote

Scottish football season suspended until 10 June

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52236228

[Shadwell Dog]

3 minutes ago, Gordon EF said:

Correct. I think this has absolutely nothing to do with who's in which position. Big picture, the SPFL don't care whether Raith go up, Falkirk go up, both go up or neither go up.

it seems to me that, as an organisation, they're pinning their hopes on being able to start 2020/21 at or around the scheduled starting date. As the organisers of the game, that is by far the easiest outcome, operationally. So to me it looks like they'll do anything which puts them in a position to do that if the coronavirus situation allows it.

If that's the case, you've only got two choices, put forward a proposal to call the season and award automatic promotion / relegation as is or put forward a proposal to call the season and have no promotion or relegation or awarding of titles. To me, financially, I can't see why one would be more attractive than the other. So i reckon it's just down to which one feels "cleaner". If we call the season, award titles, promote and relegate then we can all kind of pretend this season actually just played out and get back to normal. Also, they probably bet that it's the proposal that would have the higher chance of passing.

If you called it null and void but gave out the prize money as is and euro places it probably would be nip and tuck between a vote on it and a vote on ending the season.  Likes of celtic, raith, united and cove would vote against but would many other teams?

[Shadwell Dog]

18 minutes ago, Zen Archer Esq. said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52236228

Not in any way announced just now to effect this vote. Honestly you couldnt make it up. How can all the other nations be wrong and us so right?

Edited April 9, 2020 by Shadwell Dog

[Boghead ranter]

35 minutes ago, Paco said:

 

What about players who have agreed to move? Kieron Bowie has agreed to move to Fulham in June from Raith for circa £150k. Do we just wait for that too, in addition to prize money/season ticket sales? Or do we let him go and have a weakened squad for the run-in?

It won’t work. The season won’t finish.

 

Don't let him fly in any small planes.