Marshmallo Posted May 23, 2021 Share Posted May 23, 2021 Lowland League Two would see the SoS drop to tier 7. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Born To Run Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 4 hours ago, Ginaro said: Mentioned by Mozza on the podcast, I wrote in a previous post "the SOS are looking at moving down a tier (the worst kept secret in Scottish football apparently)." . Don't think he said specifically as a feeder to the west but just moving down to tier 7 (I presume to get out of the LL play-off). Nothing concrete on this front as yet, but internal discussions have been had on it. We’ll see if they lead to anything. Regardless, we need more relegation from the Lowland League. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glensmad Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 Nothing concrete on this front as yet, but internal discussions have been had on it. We’ll see if they lead to anything. Regardless, we need more relegation from the Lowland League.'Internal' as in within the SoSFL itself ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 12 hours ago, Marshmallo said: Lowland League Two would see the SoS drop to tier 7. Yeah, not to get ahead of ourselves as the WoS is still to get going, but I think this is why an LL2 makes sense just as it naturally resolves the placement of the SoS and could also help to resolve the lack of promotion and relegation. You can move to the ideal three up and three down (obviously numbers could move based on Club 42 playoff result) for a 16-18 team league without having to give an automatic spot to the SoS champions, who will likely be weaker than the runners-up of the WoS and EoS before even considering licensing. If it's preferred to still have further regionalisation at Tier 6 rather than another league covering the whole Lowland area then you could have LL2 East & LL2 West and still have three up three down from T5 to T6 with the two champions up and a playoff between runners-up, although that obviously means the EoS & WoS losing far more of their biggest clubs in one swoop. The SoS then sits as a feeder below the highest West league. Would LL clubs be more likely to vote for increased relegation spaces to Tier 6 if they knew they'd be relegated to another league administered by the LL? If something like this could have been planned to start for season 22/23 it could also have avoided the farce of the WoS Premier needing so many relegation places next season to get down to 16 clubs by 'promoting' a significant number of them into LL2 - while they'd still just be winning the right to remain at Tier 6 it would still be moving upwards from where the WoS Premier would then sit. Just a shame that the LL are more concerned with setting fire to the pyramid by chasing bribes for Colt sides than strengthening it by improving promotion and relegation. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted May 24, 2021 Author Share Posted May 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, Dunning1874 said: Yeah, not to get ahead of ourselves as the WoS is still to get going, but I think this is why an LL2 makes sense just as it naturally resolves the placement of the SoS and could also help to resolve the lack of promotion and relegation. A LL2 of only 16 teams means that whatever the WoS & EoS Premiers become will still be far stronger than the SoSFL. LL2 doesn't resolve the SoSFL's standing it just moves it down a tier. Promotion and relegation can be sorted within the existing structure without weakening the WoSFL & EoSFL for the benefit of the Lowland League blazers and SoSFL blushes. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) The LL just need to move to 2 relegation spots for next season. The WoS/EoS/SoS continue their round-robin play off where 99/100 times the WoS and EoS Champions prevail. On the odd occasion where the LL need to relegate a third team due to what happens above then all three go up. That can happen from next season if the LL want it to. As mentioned, I have also heard that the SoS are wanting to drop a level anyway, it's a sensible move as few of their clubs want LL football, with Dalbeattie and Gala dropping into the WoS (or EoS??) Premier when the time comes. We don't need LL2. Edited May 24, 2021 by Burnieman 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted May 24, 2021 Author Share Posted May 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, Burnieman said: The LL just need to move to 2 relegation spots for next season. The WoS/EoS/SoS continue their round-robin play off where 99/100 times the WoS and EoS Champions prevail. On the odd occasion where the LL need to relegate a third team due to what happens above then all three go up. That can happen from next season if the LL want it to. As mentioned, I have also heard that the SoS are wanting to drop a level anyway, it's a sensible move as few of their clubs want LL football, with Dalbeattie and Gala dropping into the WoS (or EoS??) Premier when the time comes. We don't need LL2. At this point if the WoSFL are looking to keep their Development League rather than form a proper Fourth Division. Then that's where the SoSFL should be sat alongside feeding into the WoSFL Third Division. And yes, switching to two promotion spots from the existing LL Pyramid Play-off is the sensible thing to do without completely messing around with the existing league structure. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshmallo Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 41 minutes ago, Dunning1874 said: Yeah, not to get ahead of ourselves as the WoS is still to get going, but I think this is why an LL2 makes sense just as it naturally resolves the placement of the SoS and could also help to resolve the lack of promotion and relegation. You can move to the ideal three up and three down (obviously numbers could move based on Club 42 playoff result) for a 16-18 team league without having to give an automatic spot to the SoS champions, who will likely be weaker than the runners-up of the WoS and EoS before even considering licensing. If it's preferred to still have further regionalisation at Tier 6 rather than another league covering the whole Lowland area then you could have LL2 East & LL2 West and still have three up three down from T5 to T6 with the two champions up and a playoff between runners-up, although that obviously means the EoS & WoS losing far more of their biggest clubs in one swoop. The SoS then sits as a feeder below the highest West league. Would LL clubs be more likely to vote for increased relegation spaces to Tier 6 if they knew they'd be relegated to another league administered by the LL? If something like this could have been planned to start for season 22/23 it could also have avoided the farce of the WoS Premier needing so many relegation places next season to get down to 16 clubs by 'promoting' a significant number of them into LL2 - while they'd still just be winning the right to remain at Tier 6 it would still be moving upwards from where the WoS Premier would then sit. Just a shame that the LL are more concerned with setting fire to the pyramid by chasing bribes for Colt sides than strengthening it by improving promotion and relegation. Nah no need for LL2. It makes it more difficult for clubs to remain at the tier they're in already if they would need to be licensed to play at tier 6 in LL2. It demotes clubs like Pollok (for example). LL2 is, IMO, about protecting existing LL clubs by giving them a further buffer league with licensed clubs which can't be accessed by a few of the bigger West clubs in their current state. That and LL brass wanting further control of the non-league game South of the Tay. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 At this point if the WoSFL are looking to keep their Development League rather than form a proper Fourth Division. Then that's where the SoSFL should be sat alongside feeding into the WoSFL Third Division. And yes, switching to two promotion spots from the existing LL Pyramid Play-off is the sensible thing to do without completely messing around with the existing league structure.I guess it depends how the likes of Threave Rovers view it. Maybe not interested in LL, but see themselves as better than fourth level WoS. They might also prefer EoS.Either way, the SoS eventually needs to find a more comfortable place further down the tiers. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 Yeah, all fair responses. I was thinking it might just be a neat way to resolve the blockage of promotion and relegation, but ultimately it shouldn't need that if some clubs put self-interest aside. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ginaro Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 9 hours ago, Born To Run said: Nothing concrete on this front as yet, but internal discussions have been had on it. We’ll see if they lead to anything. Regardless, we need more relegation from the Lowland League. I'm sure if your club proposes it, then Caley Braves will be more than happy to second the proposal, after all they want Scottish football to open up and flourish. 54 minutes ago, Dunning1874 said: If it's preferred to still have further regionalisation at Tier 6 rather than another league covering the whole Lowland area then you could have LL2 East & LL2 West and still have three up three down from T5 to T6 with the two champions up and a playoff between runners-up, although that obviously means the EoS & WoS losing far more of their biggest clubs in one swoop. So you create a LL2 meaning tier 6 covers the Lowland area, then you split it back into east and west? Seems like a waste of time when you already have two east/west leagues at tier 6. All you need is more relegation spots... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted May 24, 2021 Author Share Posted May 24, 2021 16 minutes ago, Burnieman said: I guess it depends how the likes of Threave Rovers view it. Maybe not interested in LL, but see themselves as better than fourth level WoS. They might also prefer EoS. Either way, the SoS eventually needs to find a more comfortable place further down the tiers. I don't imagine Threave will grace the EoSFL ever again. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Ginaro said: So you create a LL2 meaning tier 6 covers the Lowland area, then you split it back into east and west? Seems like a waste of time when you already have two east/west leagues at tier 6. All you need is more relegation spots... Aye I can see why that looks like I'm overthinking it and suggesting a pointless administrative change when it's effectively just giving the same leagues under a different body. It was more looking at a compromise to move the SoS down and increase the relegation spots between tiers 5 and 6, but if those things could happen anyway without that reorganisation being needed then that's preferable. Edited May 24, 2021 by Dunning1874 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
8MileBU Posted May 24, 2021 Share Posted May 24, 2021 Kelty up and Barry’s offski 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARFC Exile Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 Was at a loose end so headed to Newbyers for Arniston Rangers v Vale of Leithen friendly last night. My main take away from the game was how the hell are Vale a LL outfit? The top EoS and WoS teams would easily tear them apart. I know it's a friendly and early doors but they really are poor for this level. Surely relegation and promotion should be increased to allow teams to find their level more quickly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlanCamelonfan Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 35 minutes ago, ARFC Exile said: Was at a loose end so headed to Newbyers for Arniston Rangers v Vale of Leithen friendly last night. My main take away from the game was how the hell are Vale a LL outfit? The top EoS and WoS teams would easily tear them apart. I know it's a friendly and early doors but they really are poor for this level. Surely relegation and promotion should be increased to allow teams to find their level more quickly. They wouldn't be but they got away with it because of covid. Relegation probably will increase at some point. Rome wasnt built in a day. With more clubs getting licensed it probably will happen 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
selfassemblyshire Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 Was at a loose end so headed to Newbyers for Arniston Rangers v Vale of Leithen friendly last night. My main take away from the game was how the hell are Vale a LL outfit? The top EoS and WoS teams would easily tear them apart. I know it's a friendly and early doors but they really are poor for this level. Surely relegation and promotion should be increased to allow teams to find their level more quickly.They've survived the last 2 seasons due to covid. They'll go down this year 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDM Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 4 hours ago, ARFC Exile said: Was at a loose end so headed to Newbyers for Arniston Rangers v Vale of Leithen friendly last night. My main take away from the game was how the hell are Vale a LL outfit? The top EoS and WoS teams would easily tear them apart. I know it's a friendly and early doors but they really are poor for this level. Surely relegation and promotion should be increased to allow teams to find their level more quickly. Booted off the park it seems? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARFC Exile Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 5 hours ago, MDM said: Booted off the park it seems? I would say the challenges were late rather than dirty. Arniston are a showdow of the side they were a few years ago under Jock Hadden. Pretty much an amateur team in all but name these days. Thats why I was surprised Vale weren't much better to be honest. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AsimButtHitsASix Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 Bill Gates is a Vale fan and released Covid via 5G to keep them in the Lowland League. He would just buy players normally but he's a bit skint efter the divorce 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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