FairWeatherFan Posted August 30, 2021 Author Share Posted August 30, 2021 3 minutes ago, newcastle broon said: Correct but hardly their fault is it? After the Selkirk situation, VoL would have been part of the membership that voted to allow for scenarios where no team can be relegated from the LL. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshmallo Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 9 minutes ago, newcastle broon said: Correct but hardly their fault is it? No one on here has said it's "their fault" -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockson Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 31 minutes ago, Marshmallo said: No one on here has said it's "their fault" Nevertheless people on here have been relentlessly critical of them. All of those clubs below them (in the EoSL and WoSL) could have applied to the LL themselves at the time it was being set up. They didn't. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted August 30, 2021 Author Share Posted August 30, 2021 9 minutes ago, rockson said: Nevertheless people on here have been relentlessly critical of them. All of those clubs below them (in the EoSL and WoSL) could have applied to the LL themselves at the time it was being set up. They didn't. When exactly do the events of 2013 get scrubbed as being a free pass for events happening in the present day? It's a club that finished bottom in 2019-20 and got saved because of COVID and the slight doubt over whether a couple of clubs might stumble at the end. Then they would have been relegated in 2020-21 if a licenced Tier 6 Champion had been declared. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 Pointing out that VoL are a gang who would naturally be below about 50 clubs below them AND that the LL are exercising the same level of self preservation that had our football media shrieking when the SPFL were apparently trying it (they weren't) isn't a criticism of VoL themselves 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockson Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 2 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said: Pointing out that VoL are a gang who would naturally be below about 50 clubs below them AND that the LL are exercising the same level of self preservation that had our football media shrieking when the SPFL were apparently trying it (they weren't) isn't a criticism of VoL themselves But that's how it comes across. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcastle broon Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 1 hour ago, Marshmallo said: No one on here has said it's "their fault" Still rages ye though I see. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanley Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 20 minutes ago, newcastle broon said: Still rages ye though I see. What system for promotion/relegation would you propose for the Lowland League? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcastle broon Posted August 30, 2021 Share Posted August 30, 2021 (edited) 40 minutes ago, stanley said: What system for promotion/relegation would you propose for the Lowland League? Everyone can see common sense says the LL has to open up more spaces for relegation. Bleating on about VoL being rock bottom isnt the problem. I dont want to defend them either by the way after they and the rest voted the Colts in but as it stands they're only 1 win away from safety. I like the LL but its management have taken the piss out of all things LL. Is there a Highland relegation this year? The problem for me seems to be far too many teams in the South part of the pyramid but unfortunately that is always gonnae be the case. The LL ain't gonnae open up more relegation slots anytime soon unfortunately. Let's hope I'm proved wrong. Edited August 30, 2021 by newcastle broon 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted August 30, 2021 Author Share Posted August 30, 2021 A team with 0pts after 10 games and a -52 GD can get off the bottom of the table with a single win. The system works 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
newcastle broon Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 9 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said: A team with 0pts after 10 games and a -52 GD can get off the bottom of the table with a single win. The system works Exactly but can you see anything changing anytime soon? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FairWeatherFan Posted August 31, 2021 Author Share Posted August 31, 2021 30 minutes ago, newcastle broon said: Exactly but can you see anything changing anytime soon? I did up until the proposal for introducing the Colts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnieman Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 On 30/08/2021 at 19:41, rockson said: All of those clubs below them (in the EoSL and WoSL) could have applied to the LL themselves at the time it was being set up. They didn't. You can't keep playing that card ad-infitum, it is now 8 years since the LL kicked-off and there was a lot of issues (which we wont rake over again) which persuaded many Junior clubs not to go for it. So 8 years down the track and the LL have not progressed beyond one relegation spot, and to be honest, they'll resist calls to increase this for as long as they can. They might have been forward thinking 8 years ago, that's now well and truly in the bin. The reputation of the LL over the last few months has taken a kicking, and it's entirely self inflicted, the board and member clubs need to start practising what they preach on "ventilation" and other issues, otherwise they're no better than the SPFL or dare I say it, the SJFA. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lowenan Posted August 31, 2021 Share Posted August 31, 2021 Good win for Edinburgh University tonight. Will be tough for VoL to avoid ending bottom. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 11 hours ago, Burnieman said: You can't keep playing that card ad-infitum, it is now 8 years since the LL kicked-off and there was a lot of issues (which we wont rake over again) which persuaded many Junior clubs not to go for it. So 8 years down the track and the LL have not progressed beyond one relegation spot, and to be honest, they'll resist calls to increase this for as long as they can. They might have been forward thinking 8 years ago, that's now well and truly in the bin. The reputation of the LL over the last few months has taken a kicking, and it's entirely self inflicted, the board and member clubs need to start practising what they preach on "ventilation" and other issues, otherwise they're no better than the SPFL or dare I say it, the SJFA. Aye, you might as well just say if clubs in the pyramid wanted into the SPFL, they should have made successful applications 100 years ago. It's objectively ridiculous that the SPFL, the LL, and the HL all have such meagre relegation spots and make it so difficult for clubs from below to win promotion. At least with the SPFL, there isn't the issue of hypocrisy where they're bemoaning the 'protectionism' of another league whilst doing exactly the same thing. Of course none of this is VoL's fault. Their situation isn't the disease, it's the symptom. One of the arguments in favour of the pyramid was how it was possible for East Stirlingshire to finish bottom of the SPFL for so many seasons and not be relegated anywhere. Vale of Leithen are many, many times worse than East Stirlingshire ever were, in relative terms. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigkillie Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 At least with the SPFL, there isn't the issue of hypocrisy where they're bemoaning the 'protectionism' of another league whilst doing exactly the same thing.It's sort of the same situation as we used to have with the SPL and SFL, where SFL clubs and fans would complain about the SPL "closed shop" despite it actually allowing relegation whilst their own organisation actually was a closed shop.Each of the SPFL, Highland League and Lowland League are being led by the same protectionist ideas even though it is patently obvious that opening up more would be good for the majority in the long term.No doubt if some structure appears below the WoS, EoS or SoS in the future they'll do exactly the same thing. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshmallo Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 30 minutes ago, craigkillie said: No doubt if some structure appears below the WoS, EoS or SoS in the future they'll do exactly the same thing. Not quite the same thing but we've already seen this to an extent with the backtracking on conferences in the WoS and the "Conference X" stuff in both the WoS and EoS. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 11 hours ago, lowenan said: Good win for Edinburgh University tonight. Will be tough for VoL to avoid ending bottom. Quite a few clubs will be very keen to see Elgin City as Club 42 now to avoid the HL champion replaces Berwick Rangers scenario that automatically relegated a fifteenth placed Whitehill Welfare even after Selkirk folded midseason. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergeant Wilson Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 On 30/08/2021 at 20:32, rockson said: But that's how it comes across. The criticism is of the league and it's structure. Vale are just the focal point of that since they are the club at the bottom. I don't think it's anything "personal" against them. The issues are with the organisation that welcomed two new clubs at the expense of others who joined the pyramid in good faith without sorting out a fair means of relegation and promotion. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlansHotBath Posted September 1, 2021 Share Posted September 1, 2021 1 hour ago, Sergeant Wilson said: The criticism is of the league and it's structure. Vale are just the focal point of that since they are the club at the bottom. I don't think it's anything "personal" against them. The issues are with the organisation that welcomed two new clubs at the expense of others who joined the pyramid in good faith without sorting out a fair means of relegation and promotion. Vale - or maybe just their now-departed manager- didn't help themselves in a lot of people's eyes with that statement claiming the powers that be are holding them back and everyone criticising them were armchair pundits who'd never kicked a ball in their sad little lives. But yeah, them going down this season doesn't fix the overall issue that there isn't enough movement between tiers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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