Give everyone 3 Stands FC V Livingston

[tree house tam]

11 minutes ago, Broughty said:

Don’t know where to start as we were so poor. Probably not everyone’s opinion but is there not a case to drop Matthews. How many of our recent goals against should he have saved. 
 

I've not been impressed with remi tbh. He's better than our goalkeeper coach, but seems to be poor at saving shots either side of him, could be because he's not the tallest and doesn't have the greatest spring. He will never be first choice at Palace that's for sure.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, RossBFaeDundee said:

On the game itself, I wanted to comment on Morgan Boyes' Seaman-esque inability to just jump a bit to stop the cross for the first goal, but by then St Johnstone had already scored their second.

Boyes looks a bit like a full back playing centre back just now. His tackling, positioning and speed are all good but he has a weakness aerially, as we saw today. Fitzwater really struggled with that too when he first came into the team, worse than Boyes has been, yet improved hugely on it over time. So I'm hoping Boyes can do likewise.

[Cptn Hooch]

53 minutes ago, Troy.1995 said:

Shamal got rescued there from his teammates

I saw it the other way in that his defence let him down twice. He made a number of important stops today and At Johnstone players were first to the ball twice because our defence stopped a bit. I'm a big fan of Morgan Boyes but he wasn't at it today. We looked much better when Ayo came on. Great to see Guthrie back in the side too, thought his hold up play was really good and he looked a better option than Goncalves considering he's been out for a long time

[PauloPerth]

Aye I’ve felt Matthews hasn’t been making any great saves to keep us in matches for a while.  No real howlers, but goals trundling in.

As hopeless a first half as you could see. Everything about it after the first 5 minutes was awful.

Fair play to Livi it looked like they did their homework, attacked down the channel and waited on our defence to drop back on top of the keeper then cut it back for late arriving midfielders safe in the knowledge we wouldn’t be tracking  runners.

We managed to lose that game twice over. At 3-2 we should have got momentum and piled the pressure on. Instead Livi got hold of the ball and a mistake by Considine eventually led to the well taken 4th. 
 

Livi probably took the foot off the gas after the break but we at least looked like a team with a midfield. Phillips brought a lot of energy, MacPherson did okay. 
 

We are so easy to score against right now it’s frightening…

[monkfish]

Have to wonder if Davidson still has the dressing room, an increasing number of players look like they just cannot be arsed. 

You could make many comments on that shit show, but you might think at two goals down and getting overrun in the middle, you'd switch to 442. But no, wait for a 3rd and half time. 

I don't doubt the off field mess at the club makes it difficult for Davidson, but that doesn't excuse the on field issues he's had multiple, multiple opportunities to sort, and hasn't. 

[Troy.1995]

3 minutes ago, Cptn Hooch said:

I saw it the other way in that his defence let him down twice. He made a number of important stops today and At Johnstone players were first to the ball twice because our defence stopped a bit. I'm a big fan of Morgan Boyes but he wasn't at it today. We looked much better when Ayo came on. Great to see Guthrie back in the side too, thought his hold up play was really good and he looked a better option than Goncalves considering he's been out for a long time

Yeh,apologies Hooch.George pulled off a couple of saves that kept us ahead at crucial times.Was talking on the whole about the end result.Onwards and upwards .

[Guest]

First St Johnstone goal was Boyes' errors. He ran back, breaking our offside line and allowing Clarke to begin his run earlier. Boyes then failed to intercept the pass by jumping poorly. George made a good save and almost recovered his own parry in time. Second St Johnstone goal was a decent save from George which unfortunately fell straight to a St Johnstone player. The problem from a Livi perspective was the defensive line being far too low when May took his shot which allowed Murphy and then MacLennan to get in close to our goal for the rebounds.

[Hayseed]

Callum made the right subs today, but too late as usual. I’d have hooked Spoony and Carey in the first half. 
Drey improved a bit in the second half, but he really gave up in the last 15 minutes of the first half. 
Shocking performance at times. 
Gordon needs rested and McGowan definitely struggling with injury IMO. 

[Guest]

42 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

Livi probably took the foot off the gas after the break but we at least looked like a team with a midfield. Phillips brought a lot of energy, MacPherson did okay. 

Exactly this. Although the two goals didn't come directly from midfield play, St J were on top at that point due to MacPherson and especially Phillips having established dominance in centre mid. It's why Martindale subbed on Pittman and Holt, both excellent pressers in centre mid, to try and get some control back in that area.

[Durnford]

Firstly thank you for proving that I have learnt absolutely nothing from watching football for sixty plus years. 

For the first half that was absolutely not a St Johnstone side by any measure that I use to view a side that always seemed to manage to give us a tough game irrespective of the result.

I remember the season when we were promoted to the SPL (2001/2002) when Saints ended up dropping down to the first; they still seemed a better side that we saw in the first half. (I still remember the Santa conga performed by the travelling Saints fans at half time - fantastic guys.)

And yet that has to be wrong; prior to their current five(?) game losing streak I would probably have betted on them finishing in the top half of the division.

Second half I started to see glimpse of the kind of side I'd expect to see; a shadow of some sides of the past but leastways with a bit of bite and a side that was able to take full advantage of our shaky ten minutes however much I'll try to blame that on the weather  

Its a strange one; a convincing win away from home if great news particularly against a mid table Premiership side; yet I feel strangely deflated. 

Maybe after I've defrosted a bit more I'll be able to post something more positive.

Edited January 14, 2023 by Durnford

[EdinburghLivi]

1 hour ago, FreedomFarter said:

Boyes looks a bit like a full back playing centre back just now. His tackling, positioning and speed are all good but he has a weakness aerially, as we saw today. Fitzwater really struggled with that too when he first came into the team, worse than Boyes has been, yet improved hugely on it over time. So I'm hoping Boyes can do likewise.

I agree but I wonder if we're being a bit harsh given the horrendous wind and the state of the pitch. Can't be easy to judge balls over the top in that condition.

Edit: That said, should have recovered quicker. He seemed to stop after the mistake.

Edited January 14, 2023 by EdinburghLivi

[ol1vercloff]

You'd have thought St Johnstone would have a better pitch given how popular the agricultural scene is up there.

Life in plastic, it's fantastic.

[Guest]

57 minutes ago, EdinburghLivi said:

I agree but I wonder if we're being a bit harsh given the horrendous wind and the state of the pitch. Can't be easy to judge balls over the top in that condition.

Edit: That said, should have recovered quicker. He seemed to stop after the mistake.

For that first goal, I think he's fucked up by running backwards for some reason just before the pass is played which broke the offside line and allowed Clark to steal a march on Fitzwater. You see Fitzwater complaining to Boyes in the TV replays after the goal goes in. My guess is Fitzwater's annoyance was over Boyes initially breaking the offside line more than missing the subsquent header. With that missed header, I think Boyes was worried about headering it backwards in case he did what Sean Kelly did earlier in the season against Ross County. Having seen the TV footage now, it looked like he might've deliberately not made contact. Which was the wrong choice as Clark then runs onto the pass perfectly.

But yes, you're right, my earlier criticism was exaggerated. I do feel that being more aerially commanding is something he can improve on but it's not a glaring weakness or anything. For only 21 he looks very promising.

[Munoz]

11 minutes ago, ol1vercloff said:

You'd have thought St Johnstone would have a better pitch given how popular the agricultural scene is up there.

Life in plastic, it's fantastic.

Looked like a coo field to me.

[LIVIFOREVER]

Managed to avoid the result so i could watch it on alba not knowing the outcome, was tempted to look for the FT result when St Johnstone brought it back to 3-2, but glad i didn't, full on celebrated our 4th goal.

 

Great finishes for Kelly's goals and Penrice's 2nd (our 4th), fantastic seeing our younger signings playing so well, Bradley also looking a decent signing. Hope Bruce is ok and isn't seriously injured. Massive result for us, moving us up into 4th place, decent bit of breathing space between the chasing pack down in the bottom 6 now too, esp from 8th down.

Edited January 14, 2023 by LIVIFOREVER

[thruthenight]

I've only seen the highlights, so these comments might be a little harsh:

- Shamal needs to do better for both goals. Tbf Boyes does atrociously for the first one, but both parries were into poor areas and that can be improved upon.

- Matthews was utterly atrocious in the Saints goal. A decent keeper stops both the first and the fourth, and arguably the second.

- The saints defending for the 3rd is probably the worst defending at a corner that I've ever seen. They had 3 chances to clear that and still fucked it.

- Great composure from Kelly for both goals. The second in particular is a nice finish. Getting him for a nominal fee looks like a bargain.

- Not sure I understand the starting lineup with both Holt & Pitts on the bench. I mean it worked in the first half, but was that us, or was that St Johnstone being really shite? I'm confident that Kelly/Kelly/Omeonga is a weaker midfield than Holt/Kelly/Pittman.

Still, enough misery, that's a really good win. EUROPEAN TOUR BABY! 

[orco]

Not sure why Boyes is getting the nod over Ayo who is a much more commanding centre half in the air.

[PSJ.84]

5 hours ago, thruthenight said:

I've only seen the highlights, so these comments might be a little harsh:

- Shamal needs to do better for both goals. Tbf Boyes does atrociously for the first one, but both parries were into poor areas and that can be improved upon.

- Matthews was utterly atrocious in the Saints goal. A decent keeper stops both the first and the fourth, and arguably the second.

- The saints defending for the 3rd is probably the worst defending at a corner that I've ever seen. They had 3 chances to clear that and still fucked it.

- Great composure from Kelly for both goals. The second in particular is a nice finish. Getting him for a nominal fee looks like a bargain.

- Not sure I understand the starting lineup with both Holt & Pitts on the bench. I mean it worked in the first half, but was that us, or was that St Johnstone being really shite? I'm confident that Kelly/Kelly/Omeonga is a weaker midfield than Holt/Kelly/Pittman.

Still, enough misery, that's a really good win. EUROPEAN TOUR BABY! 

Most likely that. We started with an attacking midfielder, a winger and a centre half in midfield yesterday and it showed. George looks a really unconventional goalkeeper, although Livi fans will know better than me and probably tell me I’m speaking rubbish. Thought he made a decent save for our first goal but ultimately doesn’t push it far enough away (Boyes doesn’t cover himself in glory either). His kicking still looks wrong but he still gets distance on them, so who really cares. 
 

As others have said Livi are like everything we used to pride ourselves on.  Sitting fourth and looking up, fair play. 

Edited January 15, 2023 by PSJ.84

[RandomGuy.]

Who'd have thought playing 11 players in their best, natural, positions would lead to a better performance all round than playing half the team out of position to fit a shape nobody plays well in.

Carey needs punted for that Crawford esque performance (dont track runners/sprint 40 yards out of position to "press" the opposing keeper so it looks like youre trying but really youre just trying to get an excuse for not marking someone). At least Crawfords never faked an injury to avoid seeing the ball though, cowardly as f**k and some sympathy with Davidson that hes the type of personality hes hung his hat on.

[Cptn Hooch]

7 hours ago, thruthenight said:

- Not sure I understand the starting lineup with both Holt & Pitts on the bench. I mean it worked in the first half, but was that us, or was that St Johnstone being really shite? I'm confident that Kelly/Kelly/Omeonga is a weaker midfield than Holt/Kelly/Pittman.

 

 

4 hours ago, orco said:

Not sure why Boyes is getting the nod over Ayo who is a much more commanding centre half in the air.

Davie has said in the past that when someone comes into the team and plays well then it's their place to lose. Can't exactly turn round and drop guys who played so well on the last game. I agree that Holt and maybe Pittman would be first choice but that just shows how strong our squad is in midfield that we have guys like then to come off the bench. On Boyes, I really like him. He shows a lot of promise for only being 21(?) but Ayo and Fitzwater are our best CB pairing. Morgan hadn't really done anything wrong to warrant being dropped though so I get why he's been starting. He didn't cover himself in glory yesterday at either goal so can see us returning to the original pairing for Wednesday night.