Non Scots Born Players Who Qualified.......With A Poor Attitude!

[BB_Bino]

With the recent additions of Gunn and Anderson, and with the potential inclusion of Harvey Barnes, throughout social media over the last few months, I keep reading people post that they are happy/unhappy for non-Scots born players who qualify, but only if they bring the right attitude. Then by and large, every thread turns into reasons reason why people want them or why they don't, but quite often people say that in the past, plenty have seen it as a way to progress their careers but have had stinking attitude to playing for the nation. So I'm asking the question, who are these people referring to? 

I've followed the national team since 1987 (roughly) and have seen many non-Scottish born players receive caps, and although some were flops in performances or ability, other than Matt Ritchie and Tom Cairney, I'm struggling to think of a player that has had a poor attitude towards playing for us. In fact, in my experiences, the non-Scots born players have been quite the opposite and have been handy players for us, in their time.

Off the top of my head, Andy Goram, Richard Gough and Stuart McCall are regarded as Greats by us all.  I don't think you'll find many who would say that Shaun Maloney, Steven Fletcher, James Morrison, Don Hutchison and Russell Martin's attitudes were questionable or that they were anything but good players in the squads they were playing in.....although Fletcher did have the fall out with Levien, I don't think his attitude to play for Scotland was questionable. In the current squad, Gunn, Adams, McTominay and Dykes have been great additions and Liam Cooper's attitude has never been in question, neither have his performances. Going back to players of the past, Neil Sullivan, Callum Patterson, Kris Commons, Matt Elliott, Jamie Mackie, Matt Phillips, Nigel Quashie & Jordan Rhodes had good spells or were pretty "meh" but again, I don't remember any dramas surrounding them.

Yip, we've had ones that were simply guff in our colours, Oli McBurnie, Scott Dobie and Chris Martin, spring to mind.....but surely out of all the players mentioned, these aren't the guys that people refer too?? Others picked up 1 or 2 caps and were never seen again.......are they the players that people are on about?? Your Liam Brigcutt's, George Boyd's of the world?? I just think they were lower league English jobbers that were simply never good enough in the first place, but is there more to this???

Edited September 11, 2023 by BB_Bino

[forameus]

To be fair to Matt Ritchie - who I'd agree didn't have the greatest attitude - that goal he got against Poland looked like it meant a hell of a lot to him.  If I'm remembering it right.

It's going to be an incredibly difficult thing to gauge "attitude" for a player.  McBurnie getting video'd being all Garfield about representing Scotland probably didn't mean he didn't care, it was just a window into how he's a thick fucking bellend.  Given the attitude of a modern footballer, I'd imagine if you really didn't care about representing a country that "wasn't yours" you just...wouldn't.  These players are all likely earning fortunes and can f**k off to Dubai in the international break with their families rather than head off for training camps. 

I'm not really sure what people want from these players.  Pledges of allegiance?  If they express an interest in playing for us, it becomes a question of whether they're good enough.  If they are, we'd be absolutely fucking mental to deny them because they were born "doon there".  Mental and deeply embarrassing.

[KirkieRR]

I'd question the term 'non-Scots'. Not all Scots were born here, not all have ancestry streaming back to Bruce's times or whatever.

 

McTominey wan't born here but many of his forbears were and his celebrations when he scores indicate pretty clearly where his heart is now.

[coprolite]

29 minutes ago, BB_Bino said:

With the recent additions of Gunn and Anderson, and with the potential inclusion of Harvey Barnes, throughout social media over the last few months, I keep reading people post that they are happy/unhappy for non-Scots who qualify, but only if they bring the right attitude. Then by and large, every thread turns into reasons reason why people want them or why they don't, but quite often people say that in the past, plenty have seen it as a way to progress their careers but have had stinking attitude to playing for the nation. So I'm asking the question, who are these people referring too? 

I've followed the national team since 1987 (roughly) and have seen many non-Scottish born players receive caps, and although some were flops in performances or ability, other than Matt Ritchie and Tom Cairney, I'm struggling to think of a player that has had a poor attitude towards playing for us. In fact, in my experiences, the non-Scots have been quite the opposite and have been handy players for us, in their time, some have even embraced the Scottishness and became very much Scottish.

Off the top of my head, Andy Goram, Richard Gough and Stuart McCall are regarded as Greats by us all.  I don't think you'll find many who would say that Shaun Maloney, Steven Fletcher, James Morrison, Don Hutchison and Russell Martin's attitudes were questionable or that they were anything but good players in the squads they were playing in.....although Fletcher did have the fall out with Levien, I don't think his attitude to play for Scotland was questionable. In the current squad, Gunn, Adams, McTominay and Dykes have been great additions and Liam Cooper's attitude has never been in question, neither have his performances. Going back to players of the past, Neil Sullivan, Callum Patterson, Kris Commons, Matt Elliott, Jamie Mackie, Matt Phillips, Nigel Quashie & Jordan Rhodes had good spells or were pretty "meh" but again, I don't remember any dramas surrounding them.

Yip, we've had ones that were simply guff in our colours, Oli McBurnie, Scott Dobie and Chris Martin, spring to mind.....but surely out of all the players mentioned, these aren't the guys that people refer too?? Others picked up 1 or 2 caps and were never seen again.......are they the players that people are on about?? Your Liam Brigcutt's, George Boyd's of the world?? I just think they were lower league English jobbers that were simply never good enough in the first place, but is there more to this???

Define "non-Scots". 

I sure many on that list consider themselves at least partly Scottish, if not more Scottish than anything else. 

Of course, pure bred native status guarantees a great attitude. 

[BB_Bino]

16 minutes ago, coprolite said:

Define "non-Scots".

Apologies, “non-Scots” isn’t the term I was meaning, I of course meant non-Scots born. I should have proof read my post before posting it. 
 

I will edit it now

Edited September 11, 2023 by BB_Bino

[ArabFC]

25 minutes ago, KirkieRR said:

I'd question the term 'non-Scots'. Not all Scots were born here, not all have ancestry streaming back to Bruce's times or whatever.

McTominey wan't born here but many of his forbears were and his celebrations when he scores indicate pretty clearly where his heart is now.

Indeed.

Maloney was only born in Malaysia because his parents had a job there and lived in Scotland since he was 5. As Scottish as the next guy. Same goes for others listed.

Edited September 11, 2023 by ArabFC

[Jambomo]

The players in the past with questionable attitudes tended to be the Scots born players. Ferguson and McGregor being right up there.

Never had any issues with the adopted ones.

[ICTChris]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Scotland_international_footballers_born_outside_Scotland

I hadn't realised that Callum Paterson was born in England and also that Kieran Tierney was born in the Isle of Man.

[Stevie Kirk]

I think the ones that stand out for me are Phil Bardsley and Matt Ritchie who both bailed on us at a time when they were important 1st team picks. However they are easily outnumbered by native Scots who retired early/ fell out with SFA/ would rather go on a stag do / laddered their tights in training.

[Savage Henry]

3 hours ago, forameus said:

To be fair to Matt Ritchie - who I'd agree didn't have the greatest attitude - that goal he got against Poland looked like it meant a hell of a lot to him.  If I'm remembering it right.

It's going to be an incredibly difficult thing to gauge "attitude" for a player.  McBurnie getting video'd being all Garfield about representing Scotland probably didn't mean he didn't care, it was just a window into how he's a thick fucking bellend.  Given the attitude of a modern footballer, I'd imagine if you really didn't care about representing a country that "wasn't yours" you just...wouldn't.  These players are all likely earning fortunes and can f**k off to Dubai in the international break with their families rather than head off for training camps. 

I'm not really sure what people want from these players.  Pledges of allegiance?  If they express an interest in playing for us, it becomes a question of whether they're good enough.  If they are, we'd be absolutely fucking mental to deny them because they were born "doon there".  Mental and deeply embarrassing.

One of the best goals I’ve ever seen.  
 

He stopped playing so he wouldn’t lose access to his kids.  I’m not going to hold that against him.  I seem to remember Ian Ferguson saying “don’t fucking clap them” to a team mate, which seemed far more nefarious.  He wasn’t very good, anyway.
 

The idea that players want international football “on their CV” is nonsense, but also completely understandable we’re it to be true.  It tends to be an argument made by folks with shortbread tin mentality and a rudimentary grasp on the word mercenary. 

[Binos]

8 hours ago, BB_Bino said:

With the recent additions of Gunn and Anderson, and with the potential inclusion of Harvey Barnes, throughout social media over the last few months, I keep reading people post that they are happy/unhappy for non-Scots born players who qualify, but only if they bring the right attitude. Then by and large, every thread turns into reasons reason why people want them or why they don't, but quite often people say that in the past, plenty have seen it as a way to progress their careers but have had stinking attitude to playing for the nation. So I'm asking the question, who are these people referring to? 

I've followed the national team since 1987 (roughly) and have seen many non-Scottish born players receive caps, and although some were flops in performances or ability, other than Matt Ritchie and Tom Cairney, I'm struggling to think of a player that has had a poor attitude towards playing for us. In fact, in my experiences, the non-Scots born players have been quite the opposite and have been handy players for us, in their time.

Off the top of my head, Andy Goram, Richard Gough and Stuart McCall are regarded as Greats by us all.  I don't think you'll find many who would say that Shaun Maloney, Steven Fletcher, James Morrison, Don Hutchison and Russell Martin's attitudes were questionable or that they were anything but good players in the squads they were playing in.....although Fletcher did have the fall out with Levien, I don't think his attitude to play for Scotland was questionable. In the current squad, Gunn, Adams, McTominay and Dykes have been great additions and Liam Cooper's attitude has never been in question, neither have his performances. Going back to players of the past, Neil Sullivan, Callum Patterson, Kris Commons, Matt Elliott, Jamie Mackie, Matt Phillips, Nigel Quashie & Jordan Rhodes had good spells or were pretty "meh" but again, I don't remember any dramas surrounding them.

Yip, we've had ones that were simply guff in our colours, Oli McBurnie, Scott Dobie and Chris Martin, spring to mind.....but surely out of all the players mentioned, these aren't the guys that people refer too?? Others picked up 1 or 2 caps and were never seen again.......are they the players that people are on about?? Your Liam Brigcutt's, George Boyd's of the world?? I just think they were lower league English jobbers that were simply never good enough in the first place, but is there more to this???

Steven Fletcher went on strike didn't he during his most prolific club spell

Or was that all levein I can't recall 

[velo army]

Fletcher sent a text to one of the backroom staff saying he didn't want to play for Levein. He didn't even tell him directly. Levein then proceeded to refrain from picking him for a while until there was a bit of a detente.

My feeling then and now is that Levein was entirely right.

[Lurkst]

8 hours ago, ICTChris said:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Scotland_international_footballers_born_outside_Scotland

I hadn't realised that Callum Paterson was born in England and also that Kieran Tierney was born in the Isle of Man.

I certainly didn't know Dave Bowman and Neil Simpson were English born.

 

[Binos]

2 hours ago, Lurkst said:

I certainly didn't know Dave Bowman and Neil Simpson were English born.

 

where you were brought up is more of a factor in your identity 

[Beard2bfeared]

Kris Commons seemed to withdraw from a lot of squads 

[No_Problemo]

1 hour ago, Binos said:

where you were brought up is more of a factor in your identity 

It might be, but it’s pretty individual for each person.