Dundee United 24/25

[Boring Bob]

7 hours ago, Loemba90 said:

Any news on how long Ryan Strain is going to be out for?

R Strain can be problematic.

[Ascal]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairy_chess

 

Cause I know I'm not the only one who was utterly baffled by the reference to "fairy chess"

[Ludo*1]

I can see both sides tbf. It's certainly a term that has been used in a homophobic manner and absolutely has been used as a slur.

That wasn't the connotations I took from @Der Panzer's post, however, and when I read it before the big debate cropped up the connotations to me were that of someone who goes down a bit easy, doesn't get involved in 50/50s and generally is a bit 'precious' on the pitch in the same way you could use the word, 'jessie'.

Perhaps that stems from the original slur meaning and that's on me, but certainly wasn't how I interpreted it when it was used in the manner of describing Scott Fraser - I certainly didn't get the implication that he was calling him a gay male in a derogatory fashion.

Meh.

Edited July 19 by Ludo*1

[Pull My Strings]

I think that's probably enough from me on this one. I can't decide whether those defending the use of that term are self denying bigots, or simply lost in a bygone age. Either way, I'm struggling to respond in a civil manner to this nonsense.

[Dundee Hibernian]

Just now, Pull My Strings said:

I think that's probably enough from me on this one. I can't decide whether those defending the use of that term are self denying bigots, or simply lost in a bygone age. Either way, I'm struggling to respond in a civil manner to this nonsense.

Nobody I can see is defending the use of 'fairy' if it's used as  a derogatory term to refer to gay men. You've imagined that. 

You and @Granny Danger have missed or ignored the points I've been making. I can't think why.

[Pull My Strings]

24 minutes ago, Dundee Hibernian said:

Nobody I can see is defending the use of 'fairy' if it's used as  a derogatory term to refer to gay men. You've imagined that. 

You and @Granny Danger have missed or ignored the points I've been making. I can't think why.

Ach, there you go, you've goaded me back in just when I offered to withdraw gracefully. No, I haven't ignored your points, I've tried to address them as you deflected and changed the subject.

The question at hand is whether the use of "fairy", in this context (describing a footballer who might be considered soft or cowardly) is homophobic, or could reasonably be construed as homophobic. 

You've chosen to take issue with that question by suggesting: 

1. That people use the term to describe lots of things in addition to mythical creatures and gay people - the examples thus far, I think, are a form of chess/ chess piece, something to do with a thistle and a type of wasp. You've made an appeal to innocence by suggesting that your (presumably non homophobic?) grandchildren commonly use the term in any number of unspecified ways.

2. You appear to object to the "phobic" suffix, presumably on the basis that you're not scared of homosexuals. I'd ignored this bit earlier because I didn't know how to address it without explicitly implying that you're a bigot  quite happy to acknowledge distaste but resentful that the term attached to that tendency might imply that you're frightened.

So, no, nobody is explicitly defending the use of a slur as a slur. Obviously.  It's 2024. You can't get away with that shit now. Instead you have to to pretend that it's not a slur, or people are too sensitive, or you were talking about chess and anyway stop being so woke.

I think that probably covers it but please feel free to correct me if I've missed anything.

Edited July 19 by Pull My Strings

[Tannadeechee]

In United news, the reported transfer for Jort van der Sande doesn't seem to be going down too well with ADO Den Haag fans. Or at least not going down well with the ones replying to this Dutch football reporter's post on X.

Seems quite positive then that fans aren't happy to see him leave.

 

 

[Ascal]

2 minutes ago, Tannadeechee said:

In United news, the reported transfer for Jort van der Sande doesn't seem to be going down too well with ADO Den Haag fans. Or at least not going down well with the ones replying to this Dutch football reporter's post on X.

Seems quite positive then that fans aren't happy to see him leave.

 

 

St Mirren fans frantically googling the Dutch terms for "injury prone" and "we didn't want him anyway"

[Der Panzer]

Ffs lads without going all Ron Atkinson  - I’m anything but homophobic.

Fairy is a commonly used term in football - especially in my generation.

My use of it was clearly within the football context as I understand it and absolutely nothing to do with sexuality. 

I apologise for any offense caused - it certainly was not intended and I’ll add it to my list of words you can no longer use unless expressly talking about the original meaning before it was misappropriated. I’d like to add sand dancer to the list as I’ve seen it widely used in a football context and has racist connotations. 
 

Thank you.

[Dundee Hibernian]

5 minutes ago, Pull My Strings said:

Ach, there you go, you've goaded me back in just when I offered to withdraw gracefully. No, I haven't ignored your points, I've tried to address them as you deflected and changed the subject.

The question at hand is whether the use of "fairy", in this context (describing a footballer who might be considered soft or cowardly) is homophobic, or could reasonably be construed as homophobic. 

You've chosen to take issue with that question by suggesting: 

1. That people use the term to describe lots of things in addition to mythical creatures and gay people - the examples thus far, I think, are a form of chess/ chess piece, something to do with a thistle and a type of wasp. You've made an appeal to innocence by suggesting that your (presumably non homophobic?) grandchildren commonly use the term in any number of unspecified ways.

2. You appear to object to the "phobic" suffix, presumably on the basis that you're not scared of homosexuals. I'd ignored this bit earlier because I didn't know how to address it without explicitly implying that you're a bigot  quite happy to acknowledge distaste but resentful that the term attached to that tendency might imply that you're frightened.

So, no, nobody is explicitly defending the use of a slur as a slur. Obviously.  It's 2024. You can get away with that shit now. Instead you have to to pretend that it's not a slur, or people are too sensitive, or you were talking about chess and anyway stop being so woke.

I think that probably covers it but please feel free to correct me if I've missed anything.

Cheers for your reply. I think you meant 'can't' rather than 'can in the last paragraph.

At one point you indicated there were only two possible meanings of the term 'fairy':

"Do they indeed. They’re likely either talking about mythical creatures at the bottom of the garden, or using a homophobic slur. 
You’ll hopefully be able to distinguish the two."

I simply illustrated other examples.

To reinforce my points:

a) You can’t tell from @Der Panzer's post what his intention was. It may have been rambling nonsense for all we know, he’s a ‘dee after all.

b) Fairy has many meanings.

c) -phobic is often a misused suffix

[Ludo*1]

5 minutes ago, Tannadeechee said:

In United news, the reported transfer for Jort van der Sande doesn't seem to be going down too well with ADO Den Haag fans. Or at least not going down well with the ones replying to this Dutch football reporter's post on X.

Seems quite positive then that fans aren't happy to see him leave.

 

 

I had to chuckle when I translated a reply to that Tweet that said, 'We're the Temu of the league'.

[Tannadeechee]

Just now, Ludo*1 said:

I had to chuckle when I translated a reply to that Tweet that said, 'We're the Temu of the league'.

I did see that. Looks like that they have a problem with their manager and the players he has fallen out with are leaving on the cheap!! Was a good line though

[Pull My Strings]

1 minute ago, Dundee Hibernian said:

Cheers for your reply. I think you meant 'can't' rather than 'can in the last paragraph.

At one point you indicated there were only two possible meanings of the term 'fairy':

"Do they indeed. They’re likely either talking about mythical creatures at the bottom of the garden, or using a homophobic slur. 
You’ll hopefully be able to distinguish the two."

I simply illustrated other examples.

To reinforce my points:

a) You can’t tell from @Der Panzer's post what his intention was. It may have been rambling nonsense for all we know, he’s a ‘dee after all.

b) Fairy has many meanings.

c) -phobic is often a misused suffix

Yeah, this is pish. You've no interest in debating the subject and your response to my genuine and honest appraisal of your earlier post is to simply repeat the same surface level deflection. I did offer to withdraw in good faith but you pretended that this indicated an unwillingness to engage with your argument. 

If you can summon up an alternative explanation for what the term "fairy" might mean when describing a footballer criticised as soft or cowardly without the explicit, or widely understood, inference that the player is gay then I am all ears.

[Doctor Manhattan]

Thank f**k there's some actual football tomorrow!

[Der Panzer]

6 minutes ago, Pull My Strings said:

Yeah, this is pish. You've no interest in debating the subject and your response to my genuine and honest appraisal of your earlier post is to simply repeat the same surface level deflection. I did offer to withdraw in good faith but you pretended that this indicated an unwillingness to engage with your argument. 

If you can summon up an alternative explanation for what the term "fairy" might mean when describing a footballer criticised as soft or cowardly without the explicit, or widely understood, inference that the player is gay then I am all ears.

Right since no c***s being reasonable

.

On 05/03/2022 at 19:11, Pull My Strings said:

Fairy muff.

[Pull My Strings]

1 minute ago, Der Panzer said:

Right since no c***s being reasonable

.

Ooft. Have you just spent the last half hour going back through my posts to find something which might be considered problematic?

You're wasting your time, my man. I've been a right-on cunt since before the internet was invented. Awful sweary words, notwithstanding. 

[Der Panzer]

Just now, Pull My Strings said:

Ooft. Have you just spent the last half hour going back through my posts to find something which might be considered problematic?

You're wasting your time, my man. I've been a right-on cunt since before the internet was invented. Awful sweary words, notwithstanding. 

Na 30 second google search - and I’m being facetious - I know when you used that word you weren’t being homophobic.

As I suspect you and Granny Danger do with respect to my post - but we are all just here scoring points. 

[invergowrie arab]

10 years ago I might have called something gay if it was rubbish or 20 years ago use a term like someone had poofed a challenge if they hadn't gone in full blooded.

I wasn't being overtly or deliberately homphobic but would have stopped it the moment I actually had a think about why I was using those phrases.

Fairy is clearly derived from a  homphobic slur to imply a player is less manly, strong or brave because homosexuals are effeminate or not real men.

I belive Der Panzer wasn't being homophobic but equally it's absolutely a homophobic slur and the common usage is derived from a homophobic slur and most people would put their hands up when they was pointed out. Maybe he's embarrassed, who knows. 

@Dundee Hibernian though, f**k me you have shown yourself. Nobody in history who has attempted to appear clever using the "it's not phobia as I'm not scared" wasn't a OFTW trying to minimise phobic behaviour. 

 

[Der Panzer]

Just now, invergowrie arab said:

10 years ago I might have called something gay if it was rubbish or 20 years ago use a term like someone had poofed a challenge if they hadn't gone in full blooded.

I wasn't being overtly or deliberately homphobic but would have stopped it the moment I actually had a think about why I was using those phrases.

Fairy is clearly derived from a  homphobic slur to imply a player is less manly, strong or brave because homosexuals are effeminate or not real men.

I belive Der Panzer wasn't being homophobic but equally it's absolutely a homophobic slur and the common usage is derived from a homophobic slur and most people would put their hands up when they was pointed out. Maybe he's embarrassed, who knows. 

@Dundee Hibernian though, f**k me you have shown yourself. Nobody in history who has attempted to appear clever using the "it's not phobia as I'm not scared" wasn't a OFTW trying to minimise phobic behaviour. 

 

I thank you for pointing out I clearly wasn’t being homophobic.

I agree I got defensive at the ludicrous accusation - as most would.

I refer you to my apology already made.

Thank you

[Pull My Strings]

Just now, Der Panzer said:

Na 30 second google search - and I’m being facetious - I know when you used that word you weren’t being homophobic.

As I suspect you and Granny Danger do with respect to my post - but we are all just here scoring points. 

I'm not scoring points, bud. I'm quite happy to accept that you used the term without malicious intent. We're all flawed. I think it was a misstep but you've clarified that no offence was intended and it's not for me to argue otherwise.

I'm simply pointing out that the term is widely considered a slur in context. If you were to continue posting using the term in a derogatory manner then I'd probably say you were a homophobic arsehole but you haven't done that thus far and I hope that you won't.