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What is the point of labour ?


pawpar

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5 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Read this morning that Labour will reverse the tax relief for the upper limit on personal pension funds.

I then read that they will leave it in place for doctors!  I’m not sure the practicality of a different tax system for one group of workers; the detail in the legislation would probably be a minefield.

Mind you knowing Labour they’ll probably do nothing.

Its a bollocks soundbite for the meedja.

There has been a lot of angst about the £1m-ish LTA disappearing altogether.

Lots of people assumed it would go to £1.8m, but scrapping it completely is probably simpler to operate and (in the real world) wont affect that many more people.

Of course some very high contributors to pensions will gain out of this, but I rather suspect that all Labour may do is reimpose a cap, but at such a level as to be effectively unlimited.

 

eta - no danger they can alter the system "just for doctors". Not happening.
 

Edited by Leith Green
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Someone pointed out yesterday (maybe on telly?) that the pension change might actually worsen the situation of retaining high earners in the NHS because they'd be able to build up bigger pension pots quicker, so be able to retire earlier. 

Any pension-savvy folk know if that's true? 

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12 minutes ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

Someone pointed out yesterday (maybe on telly?) that the pension change might actually worsen the situation of retaining high earners in the NHS because they'd be able to build up bigger pension pots quicker, so be able to retire earlier. 

Any pension-savvy folk know if that's true? 

They dont "build up pots" as they are in a DB (final salary) scheme, its all notional.

Simplistically - if someone are on a 60ths scheme, and intend working 40 years and are on £100k, their "notional" pension will be £66,666 pa.

That is multiplied by 20 to reach a notional value (so £1,333,333).

The LTA is currently £1,070,000 so in this case the person breached the cap and will be subject to (a lot of ) tax on the excess.

The problem has been that - e.g. during Covid - if senior doctors worked extra to help, their "notional" pension figure could have gone from being below to breaching the cap in the space of one year - and they will need to pay a large tax bill.

So many doctors just said "fuckit" and left or when part time.

 

eta, and it really only impacts the higher earning consultants with lots of years in the job - so its unlikely to have a negative impact.

Edited by Leith Green
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11 minutes ago, Salt n Vinegar said:

Someone pointed out yesterday (maybe on telly?) that the pension change might actually worsen the situation of retaining high earners in the NHS because they'd be able to build up bigger pension pots quicker, so be able to retire earlier. 

Any pension-savvy folk know if that's true? 

If they can afford to put away the extra £20k each year then of course they will build their pot quicker.  Whether they will then want to retire earlier is supposition.

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1 minute ago, Granny Danger said:

If they can afford to put away the extra £20k each year then of course they will build their pot quicker.  Whether they will then want to retire earlier is supposition.

Doesnt really work like that unless they are also doing private work and chucking cash in there too. That would be a very small number of people given the age and earnings profile of those "in scope".

Edited by Leith Green
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2 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

They dont "build up pots" as they are in a DB (final salary) scheme, its all notional.

Simplistically - if someone are on a 60ths scheme, and intend working 40 years and are on £100k, their "notional" pension will be £66,666 pa.

That is multiplied by 20 to reach a notional value (so £1,333,333).

The LTA is currently £1,070,000 so in this case the person breached the cap and will be subject to (a lot of ) tax on the excess.

The problem has been that - e.g. during Covid - if senior doctors worked extra to help, their "notional" pension figure could have gone from being below to breaching the cap in the space of one year - and they will need to pay a large tax bill.

So many doctors just said "fuckit" and left or when part time.

I’m not sure if all, or even the majority of, doctors will be on finally salary schemes.  I’d imagine GPs in practices will have SIPPs as will many others.

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Just now, Granny Danger said:

I’m not sure if all, or even the majority of, doctors will be on finally salary schemes.  I’d imagine GPs in practices will have SIPPs as will many others.

GPs are in the NHS DB scheme.

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2 minutes ago, Leith Green said:

GPs are in the NHS DB scheme.

Then it’s all smoke and mirrors; particularly the uplift from £40k to £60k.  Makes Labour’s response even more senseless.

ETA I didn’t even know the LTA applied to non-SIPP schemes.  

Edited by Granny Danger
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13 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Then it’s all smoke and mirrors; particularly the uplift from £40k to £60k.  Makes Labour’s response even more senseless.

ETA I didn’t even know the LTA applied to non-SIPP schemes.  

Apllies to everything you have (e.g. If you notionally have £800k in a DB scheme and also left that and build up SIPP value of xyz £000)

But, agreed Labour are making it up as they go along !

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13 hours ago, StellarHibee said:

 

Impossible to draw any conclusion from this other than Labour being a fundamentally racist party, and Keir Starmer is actively encouraging this state of affairs.

This should be headline news on every front page and TV channel, as the intial report should have been. Instead, only one journalist contacted Forde in the wake of publication and they hadn't even read the report. Most people simply don't know it exists.

The BBC trying to interfere with the contents of the report should also be a national scandal which sees a lot of people out of their jobs, but it won’t.

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4 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

Keir Starmer accusing anyone of a lurch to the right has taken my breath away somewhat 

This is Keir "Freedom of Movement is over" Starmer? 😂

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37 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Starmer is like Johnson, nothing he says any more surprises me.

He’s got to be a Tory plant surely. Absolutely staggering that he has taken a social Democratic Party which young Europe supporting voters flocked to after the Brexit shambles and has turned the once great party into a pale imitation of Johnson’s Tories. Nothing he utters surprises me anymore either

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14 minutes ago, CambieBud said:

He’s got to be a Tory plant surely. Absolutely staggering that he has taken a social Democratic Party which young Europe supporting voters flocked to after the Brexit shambles and has turned the once great party into a pale imitation of Johnson’s Tories. Nothing he utters surprises me anymore either

As a father of three, "young Europe supporting voters" I'd say that they and their pals are pretty much committed to Labour as the 'least worst' option.  Seems to be a theme right through Britain ATM.

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3 minutes ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

Not in Scotland it isn't and only one of us stays here.

Ooooft, calm yer jets.  I've been on the 'next Scotland manager' thread enough to know that choosing the 'least worst' option is definitely a thing 'up there' too.

But crack on with your 'not living in Scotland' tripe.

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