GTee Posted August 16 Share Posted August 16 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
git-intae-thum Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Most Scots appear content to gift 15.9 Twh (and growing) of power annually.... https://www.gov.scot/news/renewable-electricity-growth/#:~:text=Scotland's net exports of electricity,2023 amounted to 15.9 TWh. This winter will again see more of our people freeze in their houses. The annual gERS figures will again show us running a deficit. "too stupid" ? 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leith Green Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 3 hours ago, git-intae-thum said: Most Scots appear content to gift 15.9 Twh (and growing) of power annually.... https://www.gov.scot/news/renewable-electricity-growth/#:~:text=Scotland's net exports of electricity,2023 amounted to 15.9 TWh. This winter will again see more of our people freeze in their houses. The annual gERS figures will again show us running a deficit. "too stupid" ? Scotlands electricity useage is approx 33Twh, roughly equivalent to our renewables generation. Obviously, due to fluctuations in the supply and demand, its not produced or used in a linear way. However, its a pretty staggering statistic that - as a wee country of 5m people - we export 50% of our power requirement to England...................while paying the highest standing charges in the UK, and still having incredibly high energy costs. Its not stupidity by the unionist parties, its complicity with their masters in Westminster. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The DA Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 1 hour ago, Leith Green said: Scotlands electricity useage is approx 33Twh, roughly equivalent to our renewables generation. Obviously, due to fluctuations in the supply and demand, its not produced or used in a linear way. However, its a pretty staggering statistic that - as a wee country of 5m people - we export 50% of our power requirement to England...................while paying the highest standing charges in the UK, and still having incredibly high energy costs. Its not stupidity by the unionist parties, its complicity with their masters in Westminster. I sympathise with the overall message but the Ofgen site shows that Scotland pays roughly the same as the rest of Britain. Scotland pays 62p - 65p per day while the UK average is 60p. The north of England seems to pay more than Scotland on average, anything up to 71p per day. The figures are heavily skewed though by London paying 41p per day, 2/3rds of what everyone else is paying. https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/energy-advice-households/get-energy-price-cap-standing-charges-and-unit-rates-region 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
strichener Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 I've posted this previously but it is mental that electricity is priced based on where demand is rather than where supply is. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freedom Farter Posted August 19 Share Posted August 19 (edited) Are we not making the wrong argument here? This is new infrastructure that has been announced. It was always going to be needed. It's a standard development model for small states to invest in renewables then to sell power to more populous neighbours (Laos>Thailand, Bhutan/Nepal>India, etc). Scotland to England/UK would be a natural fit to this pattern but the difference with those Asian examples is their companies are state owned and profits go back to the state. Its ownership and regulation that affects pricing. Scottish energy is not currently owned by the Scottish people. Private legacy companies UK used to own and state owned companies from other nations own our wind farms. Independence while that remains the case will change nothing. Edited August 19 by Freedom Farter 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
git-intae-thum Posted August 19 Share Posted August 19 29 minutes ago, Freedom Farter said: Are we not making the wrong argument here? This is new infrastructure that has been announced. It was always going to be needed. It's a standard development model for small states to invest in renewables then to sell power to more populous neighbours (Laos>Thailand, Bhutan/Nepal>India, etc). Scotland to England/UK would be a natural fit to this pattern but the difference with those Asian examples is their companies are state owned and profits go back to the state. Its ownership and regulation that affects pricing. Scottish energy is not currently owned by the Scottish people. Private legacy companies UK used to own and state owned companies from other nations own our wind farms. Independence while that remains the case will change nothing. Agreed.. but we will never have an energy company owned by the Scottish public under the current constitutional arrangements. No red or blue Tory gov is ever going to devolve energy policy to the Scottish parliament..... They realise what a tremendous boost it could allow to the Scottish economy at the expense of the SE. They can't be having that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GTee Posted August 19 Author Share Posted August 19 Was clearly steaming when I started this. Pretty boozy now. I think what I was trying to get to. The argument against Scottish Independence is pretty much Too wee too poor and to stupid. Is there a different argument, that someone could convey. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MazzyStar Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 On 19/08/2024 at 22:12, git-intae-thum said: Agreed.. but we will never have an energy company owned by the Scottish public under the current constitutional arrangements. No red or blue Tory gov is ever going to devolve energy policy to the Scottish parliament..... They realise what a tremendous boost it could allow to the Scottish economy at the expense of the SE. They can't be having that. The yellow tories in charge in Holyrood have no intention of creating a publicly owned energy company even after independence. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
git-intae-thum Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 1 hour ago, MazzyStar said: The yellow tories in charge in Holyrood have no intention of creating a publicly owned energy company even after independence. They will only be in charge post independence if the Scottish people vote for them. Unlike the present, after independence we will only ever get the government's we vote for. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freedom Farter Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 (edited) 10 hours ago, git-intae-thum said: They will only be in charge post independence if the Scottish people vote for them. Unlike the present, after independence we will only ever get the government's we vote for. I think this is the main weakness to the independence movement. The idea that everything is to be left until after independence and until then we must be all things to all people for fear of alienating a single potential voter constituency. This leaves the movement with nothing to offer except saltires. No rallying points and no substance. For many of these Labour voters in the recent election, independence just being exactly the same but with a saltire instead of a union jack is not going to move them. Independence needs to promise transformational change. In all these "what makes you proud of your nation?" UK polls, Brits don't vote for the flag, the Royal Family or even the military. The NHS comes out on top every time. Material political accomplishment is what folk find most empowering. The SNP should make the Scottish people owning Scottish energy their rallying call. Much complaining has been done about SNP supposedly prioritising cultural and social issues in recent times. Yet they do that because they have to offer an alternative to Westminster and given they refuse to promote an economic alternative, that only leaves social and cultural issues. Then the same folk who refuse to countenance a transformational economic programme by the SNP end up complaining loudest about the social and cultural issues when its their obstinance causing that strategy in the first place. Edited August 21 by Freedom Farter 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 On 19/08/2024 at 23:59, GTee said: Was clearly steaming when I started this. Pretty boozy now. I think what I was trying to get to. The argument against Scottish Independence is pretty much Too wee too poor and to stupid. Is there a different argument, that someone could convey. Valuing and cherishing our British heritage, traditions and identity. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 50 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: Valuing and cherishing our British heritage, traditions and identity. Can you give some actual examples of this heritage, traditions & identity. Please don't go down the road of "We fought on the same side in war X" or "We dress up and have silly marches to commemorate war Y" (Obviously, I don't count Rememberence Sunday in this, as it is supposed to honour all the fallen, not just the British) After that, what's left? Royalty & the class system? Following England (and Wales!) in the Ashes? Flat beer on the village green? Go on, please name something British that I can value & cherish. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocketman Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 8 hours ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: Valuing and cherishing our British heritage, traditions and identity. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarrbridgeSaintee Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 8 hours ago, lichtgilphead said: Can you give some actual examples of this heritage, traditions & identity. Please don't go down the road of "We fought on the same side in war X" or "We dress up and have silly marches to commemorate war Y" (Obviously, I don't count Rememberence Sunday in this, as it is supposed to honour all the fallen, not just the British) After that, what's left? Royalty & the class system? Following England (and Wales!) in the Ashes? Flat beer on the village green? Go on, please name something British that I can value & cherish. I just think it's natural to have an attachment to your homeland and wasn't really intending on picking out specific events from history. Our traditions are our ways of being that have evolved over thousands of years and which we adhere to both consciously and subconsciously. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 16 minutes ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: I just think it's natural to have an attachment to your homeland and wasn't really intending on picking out specific events from history. Our traditions are our ways of being that have evolved over thousands of years and which we adhere to both consciously and subconsciously. Tradition is fine when it's a small 't' but the British 'adherence' to it, laced with vainglorious exceptionalism has stultified and divided the country. As such, the UK is a nation accelerating backwards, clinging to the twin pillars of monarchy and militarism, neither of which is conducive to a functional and progressive democracy at ease with itself. Fortunately however younger people are more likely to see through this shit. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SandyCromarty Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 Culturally, Scotland and England are easily identified as two separate nations. Socially, England has a north and south divide and maintains a class system. Scotland, being smaller, is one Nation. Scotland maintains a Scottish Judiciary system based on evidence presented whereas the English legal system is based on precedent. There are so many differences which separates the two. For centuries Westminster and other english establishments have attempted to define the two nations as one and have failed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pocketman Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 2 hours ago, CarrbridgeSaintee said: Our traditions are our ways of being that have evolved over thousands of years and which we adhere to both consciously and subconsciously. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacDuffman Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 2 minutes ago, Pocketman said: Did he eat the Big Hoose guy? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soapy FFC Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 3 minutes ago, Pocketman said: Is he beating his tummy rather than a big drum? 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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