10 Years Ago

[O'Kelly Isley III]

Am I detecting a green shoot of recovery for the cause of Scottish Independence in a most unlikely location, a Birmingham conference venue ?

Reform have today attracted over 4000 to a Trumpian-style rally and if things continue on the current political trajectory then the Tories and Labour in England may begin to experience some serious and tangible electoral pressure.

Conversely, up here the current rabble known as the SNP may feel the pressure on them begin to ease as the political schism in the UK begins to widen and Scottish voters look to coalesce around differing ideological views and priorities than those of an increasingly right-wing and insular England, and perhaps Wales.

Just a thought.

[Mark Connolly]

2 hours ago, Fullerene said:

He could also have said  "This is a once in a generation opportunity.  Who knows when we will get this chance again" and it would simply be seen as a sales pitch that could be used for any referendum or by any salesperson trying to sell you anything.

Nobody specified what point we were in the generation when the referendum was held.

The assumption has been that we were at the beginning of one, but we may well have been at the end of the previous one, in which case we're due another referendum

[Granny Danger]

It’s ironic that the words of a completely insignificant, largely disgraced sleepy cuddler is being used to deny Scotland its say on self determination.

 

[DeeTillEhDeh]

With hindsight it's my biggest regret  spoiling my paper.

Given the chance to vote again I'd have voted Yes.

[GNU_Linux]

Apple got through 6 generations of ipod classic in 6 years. Check mate yoons.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

21 hours ago, Wee-Bey said:

The most ironically named poster on the forum is back baby.

Mintermind?

[TheScarf]

38 minutes ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

With hindsight it's my biggest regret  spoiling my paper.

Given the chance to vote again I'd have voted Yes.

I was still undecided walking into the polling booth, as I’ve always thought Alex Salmond was a bit of wanker, I took about 30 seconds then thought ‘fuck it’ and put a cross in the Yes box. I’d vote Yes in a millisecond of a heartbeat now.

I’ve since wondered what the result would’ve been if Nicola Sturgeon was first minister back then.

 

[git-intae-thum]

2 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

I was still undecided walking into the polling booth, as I’ve always thought Alex Salmond was a bit of w****r, I took about 30 seconds then thought ‘f**k it’ and put a cross in the Yes box. I’d vote Yes in a millisecond of a heartbeat now.

I’ve since wondered what the result would’ve been if Nicola Sturgeon was first minister back then.

 

Don't think we would ever have got a referendum in the first place if she was leader.

 

[TheScarf]

3 minutes ago, git-intae-thum said:

Don't think we would ever have got a referendum in the first place if she was leader.

 

Good point, because polling would’ve been a lot closer than 30-70 and the dead pig shagger would’ve told her to fuck off.

[git-intae-thum]

Just now, TheScarf said:

Good point, because polling would’ve been a lot closer than 30-70 and the dead pig shagger would’ve told her to f**k off.

Possibly.

But that's not the main reason.

[Granny Danger]

Just now, git-intae-thum said:

Possibly.

But that's not the main reason.

Go on, tell us the main reason.

[git-intae-thum]

2 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Go on, tell us the main reason.

I imagine being serious about independence is kind of a prerequisite for any leader aspiring an independence referendum.

[welshbairn]

If Salmond had taken questions on currency and the economy of an independent Scotland seriously, instead of laughing them off as Unionist scare mongering, the referendum might have been won 

[Wee-Bey]

I don't think Sturgeon being in charge would have made any difference tbh.

[Granny Danger]

13 minutes ago, git-intae-thum said:

I imagine being serious about independence is kind of a prerequisite for any leader aspiring an independence referendum.

That makes no sense and is not an answer.

[strichener]

1 minute ago, Granny Danger said:

That makes no sense and is not an answer.

It was oft posted on here that she was the best UK politician by a country mile and yet through some of the worst government and governance we have witnessed she still couldn't manage to get the case for a self determination across to the electorate.  That is either incompetence or lack of will.  If you don't doubt her competence then it must have been the latter.

[eez-eh]

45 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

If Salmond had taken questions on currency and the economy of an independent Scotland seriously, instead of laughing them off as Unionist scare mongering, the referendum might have been won 

Darling schooled him on the currency issue in the first telly debate and that was enough to put the fear into people for the rest of the campaign.

I don’t think he didn’t take it seriously, but he didn’t do anywhere near enough to reassure people that he did. Anyone could see that the U.K. Gov’s response to “we’ll enter a currency union” would be “no you won’t”. Whether there would have been a currency union in the event of a yes vote is besides the point, Cameron and Osbourne were always going to shoot it down in the middle of a campaign.

The “we’ll just use it anyway” response to that was never going to reassure a load of people who were being fed bullshit scare stories every day. No doubt there was an actual plan in the background but for whatever reason (arrogance?) it wasn’t conveyed to the public.

[AMMjag]

Sturgeon is a textbook Tony Blair politician. Her priority was to consolidate power around herself and she was very effective at this (until she wasn't anymore). Admired by liberals for this, as well as her centrist brand of 'progressive' politics, without ever committing to meaningful social reform. Almost certainly a criminal too.

I don't doubt she is ideologically in favour of Scottish Independence, but any commitment to the cause was secondary to her political career.

This is most evidenced in the context of the 2019 election. Scotland had voted to remain in the EU but was being forced out of it via a UK wide referendum. The logical position of a Scottish National Party in this case is to say 'we will back your Withdrawal Bill on one very obvious and non-negotiable condition' - it was not to stand on a stage with Alistair Campbell and throw the party's weight behind a butthurt, London-centric Second Vote campaign for the sake of more UK seats. 

Salmond was more abrasive and divisive, but that is exactly what any leading Scottish nationalist ought to be and something Sturgeon was never prepared to become.

[MazzyStar]

23 hours ago, Hammer Jag said:

My abiding memory of 2014 is the humiliation I felt when I visited Ireland and Croatia in the months following the referendum. Trying to explain the servility and cowardice of the Scottish electorate to people in countries where their people shed blood for their independence

All we had to do was tick a box. 

I think in the case of Croatia it was more the blood of other people that was spilled because of Croats (at least the last two times they’ve become “independent”) 

[git-intae-thum]

2 hours ago, Granny Danger said:

That makes no sense and is not an answer.

It does...and it is....... unfortunately.

 

It is a horrible realisation when it dawns that 10 years have been wasted by a shower of absolute charlatans.