Rugby Union

[Dunning1874]

In the scenario that we beat Ireland by 7 or more but South Africa then fail to get a bonus point against Tonga, that would put us out wouldn't it, unless we beat Romania by a large enough scoreline to overtake Ireland on points difference? Ireland top on points difference then South Africa through on head to head against us?

[topcat(The most tip top)]

2 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

It's that sort of needless and artificially constructed rule which annoys me about international rugby union.  It smacks of trying to engineer outcomes rather than simply letting the scoreboards and the tables do the arithmetic.

I assume some people felt similarly about football introducing 3 points for a win

[ajwffc]

Johnny Matthews replaces Stuart McInally in our Rugby World Cup squad after the Edinburgh hooker sustained a neck injury. 

What a shit way for McInally to end his career 

[O'Kelly Isley III]

2 hours ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

I assume some people felt similarly about football introducing 3 points for a win

Yep, and of course the main beneficiaries were those teams already recording the most wins.  In the Scottish context you'll never again see a title win by anyone other than the OF.

[IrishBhoy]

4 hours ago, GHF-23 said:

I would need to watch it back but my recollection is that by the time he blew the whistle and shouted it's not out the ball was with the SA player, but that there had been a fair amount of digging around prior to that, for a length of time that you'd usually say was fair enough for a collapsed maul/balls not coming out scrum to be awarded. He's called it late but probably fair enough, similar to Wales wanting to go back for a penalty on half time last night when no one had heard Barnes shout advantage over but they had obviously made enough ground for it to be over. 

Just seemed like a very strange ending to the game, especially when South Africa were so close to the try line. I actually think the South African number 12 was too fly for his own good, because the referee didn’t have a clue where the ball was and neither did most of the players. If he had offloaded it a couple of seconds earlier there would surely have been space on the far side. Moot point now anyway but could have done Scotland a favour if they had managed to get the try. 

[Lurkst]

9 hours ago, topcat(The most tip top) said:

My reading of the rules is that under those circumstances South Africa would probably top the group and then Scotland would take 2nd on the head to head (but that depends quite how much the  Springboks put past Tonga)

I think if the three teams are tied on 14 or 15 it goes on points difference in the group, so we'd be needing to annihilate Romania.

 

7 hours ago, Dunning1874 said:

In the scenario that we beat Ireland by 7 or more but South Africa then fail to get a bonus point against Tonga, that would put us out wouldn't it, unless we beat Romania by a large enough scoreline to overtake Ireland on points difference? Ireland top on points difference then South Africa through on head to head against us?

If South Africa fail to get a bonus point against Tonga, Scotland and Ireland could "engineer" a result where we win but both teams bonus point. Putting the Saffers out Austria v West Germany style.

 

[GAD]

It'll be interesting to see who we pick against Romania. I think we need to pick a team that can aim to score 80-100 points, (and not concede many) which will be very difficult. However, I think the team I'd pick to do that isn't necessarily our best team. Can see a pack of Bhatti, Ashman, Fagerson, Cummings, Skinner, Watson, M.Fagerson and Dempsey starting, with Horne, Russell, Redpath, Jones, Graham, DVM and Kinghorn. Lots of big carriers up front, who should still be able to deliver a functional set piece against Romania, then two playmakers surrounded by loads of line breakers and pace in the backs.

[Eednud]

@peasy23 you asked for it. First up today’s Sydney Morning Herald, they broke the Eddie Jones Japan story.

 

[Eednud]

The Australian. No mention on front page although something in editorial.

 

[Eednud]

The Daily Telegraph (Sydney) 

[Eednud]

The Courier Mail (Brisbane) has the Code red story plus a small pic of Eddie Jones on back page. Herald Sun (Melbourne) the Code red story. The Advertiser (Adelaide) has a match report. These 3 plus the Daily Telegraph are all Newscorp publication as is The Australian.

The SMH letters page as well.
 

 

 

[ajwffc]

he should stay 
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/66914086

[Sensible Soccer🏴]

On 24/09/2023 at 19:27, Bully Wee Villa said:

Not really. If we could beat them by 100 points we'd have a chance of qualifying without a bonus point against Ireland.

Is this the last straw we're grasping at, skelping the Romanians, would allow just a regular (8 point) victory over Ireland?

[honestly united]

58 minutes ago, Sensible Soccer said:

Is this the last straw we're grasping at, skelping the Romanians, would allow just a regular (8 point) victory over Ireland?

My take is that points difference only counts if all 3 are tied on 15 points, with the team with the highest points going through first, then 2nd place goes on head to head (ie whoever beat who in the pool matches). The permutations are a clusterf*ck but its a mute point if we dont beat Ireland.

If SA beat Tonga with a try bp, we need a win with or without a try bonus, and no bp for Ireland and we are through (Both us and SA on 15, Ire 14, SA top group on head to head or SA15, us and Ireland on 14, we go through on head to head against Ire).

If Ireland get 2 BP's in a high scoring shoot out then we are also out which would be the most Scottish thing ever so look out for a 40-37 win for Scotland.

If we get a BP win and Ireland get a losing bp so we are all on 15 points, and Ireland have the best points difference we are out (SA get 2nd on head to head). So us or SA having a better points difference than Ireland, is the best outcome, if we beat Ireland.

SA winning by 30/40 over Tonga would see them top Ireland if we win and at the moment we need 109 point turn around vs Ireland. The best probable out come is SA topping group on points diff with a big win.

or we hope for a Tonga win over SA which is another set of permutations!

 

[Salvo Montalbano]

8 minutes ago, honestly united said:

My take is that points difference only counts if all 3 are tied on 15 points, with the team with the highest points going through first, then 2nd place goes on head to head (ie whoever beat who in the pool matches). The permutations are a clusterf*ck but its a mute point if we dont beat Ireland.

If SA beat Tonga with a try bp, we need a win with or without a try bonus, and no bp for Ireland and we are through (Both us and SA on 15, Ire 14, SA top group on head to head or SA15, us and Ireland on 14, we go through on head to head against Ire).

If Ireland get 2 BP's in a high scoring shoot out then we are also out which would be the most Scottish thing ever so look out for a 40-37 win for Scotland.

If we get a BP win and Ireland get a losing bp so we are all on 15 points, and Ireland have the best points difference we are out (SA get 2nd on head to head). So us or SA having a better points difference than Ireland, is the best outcome, if we beat Ireland.

SA winning by 30/40 over Tonga would see them top Ireland if we win and at the moment we need 109 point turn around vs Ireland. The best probable out come is SA topping group on points diff with a big win.

or we hope for a Tonga win over SA which is another set of permutations!

 

If Tonga beat South Africa (not that it will happen?), would a 3-0 win for us see us both through, assuming we get a BP against Romania?

[honestly united]

7 minutes ago, Salvo Montalbano said:

If Tonga beat South Africa (not that it will happen?), would a 3-0 win for us see us both through, assuming we get a BP against Romania?

if SA only got no or 1 bp in losing to Tonga a draw would see both us and Ireland through (assuming we get a bp win vs Romania). Ireland would already be through so we would only need to win if SA picked up 2 bp in their lose. In fact depending on how many bp's SA picked up in losing we would just need to better their bp's if possible if we picked up the BP win this weekend although SA losing is not something I would be pinning my hopes on.

[Salvo Montalbano]

14 minutes ago, honestly united said:

if SA only got no or 1 bp in losing to Tonga a draw would see both us and Ireland through (assuming we get a bp win vs Romania). Ireland would already be through so we would only need to win if SA picked up 2 bp in their lose. In fact depending on how many bp's SA picked up in losing we would just need to better their bp's if possible if we picked up the BP win this weekend although SA losing is not something I would be pinning my hopes on.

Oh absolutely not, it won't happen but good to know all the possibilities!

[Mark Connolly]

Clarification that you can tackle Scottish players in the head and get away with it, but if you f**k about with one of World Rugby's golden boys, you've had it

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2023/sep/26/namibias-johan-deysel-handed-five-match-ban-for-tackle-on-antoine-dupont

[ajwffc]

Fifita gets a 4 match ban for his red 

[honestly united]

I see Sexton could be in trouble due to taking what looks like some sort of energy gel during the SA game on the pitch which is against the current rules (which is water only i beleive) - cue 1 week ban rather than 1 game and him being available for our game